#clojure – 2014-11-03

2014-11-03

00:01	andyf	Twylo: Also, wouldn't you want two separate arguments to your map-once besides the sequence? One for the predicate function, and a separate function to calculate what to replace the matching item with?
00:02	Twylo	andyf: Great idea about looking at 'map'. And yeah, I think for general use I'd want two arguments, predicate and replacement function
00:03	andyf	Twylo: I just looked at clojure.core/map source, and there is an extra complicating factor in its implementation involving chunked sequences that you probably want to ignore. It is a performance optimization, not something for correct behavior.
00:04	kenrestivo	does compojure do something weird when defining routes? like... execute at compile time instead of runtime? because... this https://www.refheap.com/92630
00:05	andyf	Twylo: Ignore the 'then' part of the (if (chunked-seq? s) ...) expression. Remove that if, replacing it with its "else" part, which is simpler and works correctly in all cases.
00:06	andyf	kenrestivo: Someone else can probably give a more authoritative answer, but aren't compojure route definitions implemented as Clojure macros, not Clojure functions?
00:07	kenrestivo	they are
00:07	kenrestivo	i'm macroexpand-1'ing right now tryign to figure out wtf
00:08	Twylo	andyf: Looking at it now. It's nice and simple.
00:08	kenrestivo	it's funny, just a few days ago someone was in here asking why not use macros. i'd say, this is why not.
00:10	andyf	kenrestivo: I don't know enough to give suggestions on what to change here, but in general it is good in Clojure to use functions when a function will do.
00:10	kenrestivo	yep. thanks. i've been around this block before with compojure and some other web things. it's just frustrating; i'll figure it out.
00:11	nestastubbs	the issue is not wether is it a macro or a function, in the case of compojure
00:12	Twylo	Huh, acutally I just noticed that "map" is defined recursively, but not using (recur). It just calls itself directly, no tail call optimization. Interesting.
00:13	nestastubbs	it's that the servers handler fn won't get updates
00:14	nestastubbs	it would not matter if it was a macro or a function that defind the routes...
00:15	kenrestivo	i don't mind, this is something that needs to be fixed at start-time, meaning, at handler-define time
00:15	kenrestivo	but not at compile time.
00:16	nestastubbs	if you restart the request handler...
00:16	nestastubbs	sorry I can't be mroe specific, just nuked workstation with new OS install, and don't have any of my projects handy with code
00:17	kenrestivo	no prob, i appreciate the perspective. seems you have a bit more familiarity with the internals of compojure than i have
00:18	kenrestivo	i'm looking at the macroexpand-1 and can't see any reason why this would not work, it looks fine. hmm.
00:19	kenrestivo	i have seem some syntax-quote trickery in for example lein, which i should study up on, might fix this
00:19	nestastubbs	no it won't
00:19	nestastubbs	how do you start your request handler?
00:20	nestastubbs	your ring server...
00:21	kenrestivo	components start
00:22	Twylo	andyf: Pefect, I have a working function now. Thanks for your help
00:23	andyf	Twylo: np
00:24	andyf	Twylo: The lazy-seq in map makes the implementation lazy. Only as much of the answer will be computed as is 'demanded' by later code that tries to examine the result.
00:25	Twylo	I admit, that's sort of black magic to me. I'd like to understand lazy-seq better
00:26	kenrestivo	the baddness seems to be coming from the let-request macro, still tracing...
00:32	nestastubbs	kenrestivo: how is app-routes being called?
00:33	kenrestivo	nestastubbs: https://www.refheap.com/92632
00:34	kenrestivo	the end game here is to have different html for :dev and :release :-/
00:36	nestastubbs	kenrestivo: so it's the mode check?
00:36	kenrestivo	there are 3 substitutions, yeah mode is the main one
00:37	kenrestivo	i was thinking of blowing off stencil completely and just doing this all in hiccup
00:37	kenrestivo	but i don't think stencil is the problem. it's some conceptual barrier i have with the way compojure operates
00:37	nestastubbs	I would expect that code to work 8)
00:38	nestastubbs	what if you do (:playing-url settings)
00:38	nestastubbs	instead of using the keyword binding
00:39	nestastubbs	kenrestivo: are you calling make-handler every time you make an edit?
00:39	kenrestivo	ooh, interesting. will try.
00:39	kenrestivo	nope, make-handler is called only at start/stop time (in components)
00:39	nestastubbs	ok, so what does make-handler return?
00:39	nestastubbs	I'm being pedantic ... that is your problem
00:40	nestastubbs	the handler that is serving up the web requests has an old value of app-routes
00:41	nestastubbs	make-handler returns a function that wrapped the value that app-routes returned at the time it was called
00:41	nestastubbs	not a fn that calls app-routes each time
00:42	kenrestivo	hmm
00:43	kenrestivo	i actually do want to close over that stuff.
00:43	nestastubbs	this happens in our app dev all the time
00:43	kenrestivo	what's frustrating is that it isn't an old value. it's an EMPTY value. there's nothin in it
00:43	nestastubbs	when we want to add a new route
00:44	kenrestivo	mode, playing-url, chat-url, those are all nil at whatever time let-request is called
00:44	kenrestivo	which is confusing me because everythign i thought about clojure's lexical scope is violated by this
00:44	nestastubbs	have you restarted your entire world yet?
00:44	kenrestivo	many times :-/
00:44	kenrestivo	like, whole jvm restarts
00:45	nestastubbs	ok, if you have done that since you wrote the version of app-routes in the paste, then my theory is toast 8)
00:45	kenrestivo	the value of mode, at the time render-file is called, is nil.
00:45	kenrestivo	whereas, at the time app-routes is called, mode has a value, and i can prove it with log output
00:46	kenrestivo	so, macro magick
00:46	nestastubbs	nothign to do with macros
00:47	nestastubbs	you are printing the value of settings
00:47	nestastubbs	try accessing it (:mode settings)
00:47	kenrestivo	did that. didn't help.
00:48	kenrestivo	was a good idea tho.
00:48	nestastubbs	ok, so it's not the destructuring
00:53	nestastubbs	do you have reloading on?
00:53	nestastubbs	if so, make sure you are saved out to disk
00:53	nestastubbs	try changing the wording of the log message to confirm it's getting your latest edit
00:53	nestastubbs	those are all the ways I have been hosed in the past 8)
00:56	nestastubbs	ok, I'm out of ideas without checking out the whole project and trying, and I'm falling asleep 8)
00:56	nestastubbs	good luck site!
00:56	nestastubbs	sir!
00:56	nestastubbs	see, I told you I was falling asleep
01:06	kenrestivo	nestastubbs: thanks, i think i got it sorted
01:07	kenrestivo	it's working. i will have to look through my git thrash history to find out exactly WHY and HOW
01:08	kenrestivo	i've gotten in the habit in recent months of generating tons of git branches with names like dead-end1, dead-end2, dead-end3, stash them go back to master, try something else, git checkout -b dead-end4, commit, back to master..
02:22	mindbender1	What's the fundamental difference between a library like d3.js and react.js?
02:26	borkdude	mindbender1 d3 works directly on the real DOM
02:26	borkdude	mindbender1 and if focussed on data viz.
02:26	borkdude	mindbender1 ReactJS is a general library that utilizes a virtual DOM
02:32	mindbender1	borkdude: ok
02:33	mindbender1	How does using them both sound?
02:35	mindbender1	When I read some part of d3 docs I tend to see functionalities that are typical of a full js framework
02:35	mindbender1	making me think of `or` rather than `and`
02:39	borkdude	mindbender1 some people use them both
03:20	dc_	would it be faster to use filter or to use reduce and build up objects with transients/persistents?
03:22	dc_	kind of a generic question and it probably depends on the circumstances, i know
03:24	cy	dc_: why not benchmark it?
03:25	dc_	alright, i'll try both and see
03:49	SagiCZ1	can i spread my namespaces into more folders without reflecting it in the ns name? or is it like in java where packages have to correspond with file path?
03:52	schmir	SagiCZ1: I think you could use clojure.core/load from within the namespace.
03:53	schmir	SagiCZ1: https://github.com/ztellman/potemkin#import-vars may be a better solution
03:53	schmir	SagiCZ1: haven't used any of those...so don't blame me.
03:59	SagiCZ1	schmir: no i want it to work out of the box, if it isnt possible i can stick to the regular structure
04:26	mbac	so does anyone do 3d graphics games in clojure?
04:26	mbac	i wrote something in quil to do 2d graphics and it was surprisingly slow
04:27	mbac	i had a draw function doing a bar graph in realtime over 800 points and the framerate dropped to about <10fps
04:41	ssideris	mbac: you could try opengl with penumbra (although it's no longer maintained as a library): https://github.com/ztellman/penumbra
04:46	Glenjamin	there's that new ClojureCLR unity thing
04:46	Glenjamin	https://github.com/arcadia-unity/Arcadia
04:51	mnngfltg	I have a question about the typical workflow with core.async (on the server). As I understand it, using blocking calls should be avoided. However, SQL calls (jdbc) are always blocking. How can I make SQL queries from core.async-based code?
04:54	ddellacosta_	mnngfltg: where in the core.async workflow are you talking about?
04:55	mnngfltg	ddellacosta_, so I use http-kit's server to accept tcp connections
04:55	mnngfltg	if I run an sql query using jdbc, that blocks the thread that is making the request
04:57	mnngfltg	but isn't the whole point of running in an event loop (like with http-kit) that you eliminate all synchronous calls?
04:57	ddellacosta_	mnngfltg: I don't know why you are using core.async, or what the problem is with blocking. What is the problem you are trying to solve?
04:58	ddellacosta_	mnngfltg: and http-kit supports both modes
04:59	mnngfltg	ddellacosta_, I guess I'm not clear about the way you would typically implement a web service that does both http calls and sql queries
04:59	mnngfltg	using node.js I suppose you would never do a blocking call, anywhere
05:00	mnngfltg	I know that http-kit does both synchronous and async, but jdbc is synchronous only
05:02	mnngfltg	so wouldn't it be useful to fire off (clojure.java.jdbc/query "....") in a non-blocking way? So your flow is resumed once the SQL query finishes.
05:05	ddellacosta_	mnngfltg: if you need to initialize a job that does something and immediately return to execution without waiting for the result, Clojure has many mechanisms to support that. I think it's confusing matters a bit to talk about http-kit in the context of how blocking and SQL queries work
05:06	ddellacosta_	mnngfltg: sorry, I'm a bit fuzzy on what you're trying to do--if you have a specific use-case I may be able to offer more help. As it is, I'm not sure exactly what the problem is that you're trying to solve.
05:08	ddellacosta_	mnngfltg: and as far as how you'd implement a web service, I don't see why synchronous execution is a problem
05:08	mbac	ssideris, thanks
05:14	dc_	cy: filter building vectors, nested under a reduce seems much much faster than using a reduce nested in a reduce.
05:15	dc_	i'm getting hamming-distance for lots and lots of data
05:17	dc_	like 2 orders of magnitude faster. wow
05:17	dc_	also, i set the hamming-distance to use recur and to terminate early if it passed the threshold of the distance i'm filtering on
05:29	mnngfltg	ddellacosta_, point taken, I'm a bit confused about the whole business :)
05:31	ddellacosta_	mnngfltg: re-reading your questions, it sounds a bit like you're conflating the synchronous/asynchronous modes of http-kit w/the threading model provided by the JVM. But consider that you can have a synchronous HTTP request trigger a job that asynchronously executes a SQL query, for example, the result of which you can check again using another synchronous HTTP request
05:32	ddellacosta_	(not that this is necessarily a good idea, but depends on your architecture I suppose)
05:34	ddellacosta_	mnngfltg: I suppose the bottom line is, Clojure gives you the tools to build a lot of different architectures, you aren't constrained to some thing like the "everything is a big event loop" or whatever it is that node provides (sorry, I know nothing about node really)
05:39	mnngfltg	yeah, I don't know much about node.js either
05:40	mnngfltg	right now my code is perfectly synchronous, which is perfectly fine by me. However, I'm trying to add a feature that talks to other web services, and I expect that these calls block for 1000ms or more.
05:41	mnngfltg	So I thought it would be a good idea to use clore.async's channels as a means to fire "background jobs"
05:42	ddellacosta_	mnngfltg: are you talking about the web server firing off jobs, or the web client?
05:42	ddellacosta_	mnngfltg: that is, where is the "talking to other web services" thing happening?
05:42	mnngfltg	a web server accepts HTTP requests, but then fires off a notification to another http host, in the background
05:43	mnngfltg	it's all in the JVM, if that's what you're talking about
05:43	cbryan	is the response dependent on the notification?
05:43	ddellacosta_	mnngfltg: and then does something have to handle the response to that notification?
05:43	ddellacosta_	jinx
05:44	cbryan	haha
05:44	ddellacosta_	:-)
05:44	mnngfltg	no it's not, I can return the response without waiting for the result of the notification
05:44	cbryan	well then "fire and forget", yeah? :)
05:44	ddellacosta_	mnngfltg: so, what do you do with the result of that notification?
05:44	mnngfltg	cbryan, yes, except that I need to re-try a notification if it fails
05:45	mnngfltg	so I can't just do (future (http-client/get "..."))
05:45	mnngfltg	and I also need to write the result of the notification to a database
05:45	cbryan	(http-client/get) accepts a callback
05:46	cbryan	http://http-kit.org/client.html#async
05:46	ddellacosta_	this seems like it happens entirely the HTTP request cycle though
05:46	mnngfltg	cbryan, but if I do that, does it create a new thread?
05:46	ddellacosta_	this doesn't have anything to do with the client, no?
05:46	ddellacosta_	oh, sorry, I misread that--sorry cbryan
05:47	ddellacosta_	yeah, mnngfltg, seems like what cbryan is proposing is perfect, no?
05:47	cbryan	mnngfltg: so you want to avoid creating a new thread, or? i might be misunderstanding your actual question!
05:48	mnngfltg	cbryan, yes that's what I mean, though maybe that not a sensible concern, Isn't it inefficient to fire off a new thread constantly like that?
05:49	mnngfltg	hmm looking at https://github.com/http-kit/http-kit/blob/master/src/org/httpkit/client.clj it looks like it's using a worker pool
05:50	cbryan	mnngfltg: sounds like a case of premature optimization, honestly. try it and profile? :)
05:50	mnngfltg	a worker pool would be perfect actually :)
05:51	mnngfltg	So actually I don't need core.async at all?
05:52	ddellacosta_	mnngfltg: well, the worker pool is just threads anyways, right? No, not sure you need core.async here, unless you have some higher level abstraction you want to implement using it
05:52	cbryan	http-kit is handling that for you, yeah
05:53	mnngfltg	ddellacosta_, it's threads, but it's a limited pool of threads, so I don't risk running out of threads if a lot of requests block for a long time
05:53	ddellacosta_	mnngfltg: ah.
05:54	mnngfltg	I'm just going to go with http-kit and see if it's enough
05:54	mnngfltg	one more thing, I need to wait between notification requests (say 10 seconds, 30 seconds, 60 seconds)
05:55	mnngfltg	Thread/sleep seems like it might end up blocking everything again
05:55	mnngfltg	is there some way to block "asynchronously" for lack of a better term?
05:56	cbryan	http://http-kit.org/timer.html
05:56	ddellacosta_	yeah, schedule-task looks perfect, huh?
05:57	mnngfltg	right!
05:57	mnngfltg	it is perfect :)
05:58	mnngfltg	thanks !!
05:59	mnngfltg	schedule-task uses a "Timer-service thread", so that's how that works
06:05	borkdude	is enlive pronounced as en-liv or en-lie-v
06:06	borkdude	as in "I live" or "live performance"
06:31	kungi	borkdude: as far as I remember the talk about enlive it's pronounces as in "live performance"
06:39	borkdude	k
07:13	ucb	good day all
07:13	ucb	I'm trying to write a macro that'll take the body of the expression and use it as the key in a hashmap
07:13	ucb	however I'm not getting it quite right
07:13	clgv	ucb: example?
07:14	ucb	yes, creating it :)
07:14	ucb	1s
07:14	clgv	best with call example and desired expansion
07:16	ucb	here https://gist.github.com/ulises/b34d5bae94e8cf8006e9
07:18	clgv	ucb: ok, what exactly does not work? the fullqualified "do-more*" ?
07:19	ucb	the (quote ~f) actually gets evaluated
07:19	clgv	huh? not really
07:19	ucb	so instead of getting '(fn [] :foo) as a key, I get user$eval3687$fn__3692 as key
07:20	clgv	,(defmacro thing [f] `(hash-map (quote ~f) ~f))
07:20	clojurebot	#'sandbox/thing
07:20	clgv	,(thing (fn [] :foo))
07:20	clojurebot	{(fn [] :foo) #<sandbox$eval52$fn__53 sandbox$eval52$fn__53@1716c3d>}
07:20	clgv	looks about right
07:20	ucb	hrm
07:20	clgv	maybe do-more* confuses the parameters?
07:21	ucb	well, let me paste the do-more* equiv I'm working with
07:22	ucb	here https://gist.github.com/975b1843c13888a95ff7
07:23	ucb	oh, silly silly boy
07:23	clgv	ucb: why don't you use the same "quote" form there?
07:23	ucb	where?
07:23	clojurebot	where is log
07:24	clgv	in "rich-stream" first arg
07:24	ucb	how do you mean?
07:24	ucb	heh, it works now
07:24	clgv	it is constructing a list with 'quote as first arg and the evaluated function as second arg. line 15
07:24	ucb	it wasn't the macro that was the problem :)
07:24	ucb	yeah, list there is wrong
07:24	ucb	that's an old paste
07:24	clgv	ucb: did you change it to (quote ~f) as well?
07:25	ucb	yes
07:25	clgv	ok
07:25	ucb	the bug is here https://gist.github.com/ulises/975b1843c13888a95ff7#file-streams-clj-L10
07:25	ucb	assoc f
07:25	ucb	should be assoc name
07:25	clgv	haha ok ;)
07:25	ucb	thanks for prodding me!
08:21	nondisclosure	I'm trying to use a let with selenium to grab a value from the page i'm currently on, then proceed to the next page, then return that value. the let isn't storing that value until my function tries to return it. what's the best way to deal with this problem? i've tried using eval and doall to no avail.
08:22	justin_smith	nondisclosure: what does "the let isn't storing that value" mean?
08:23	nondisclosure	the let is pointing to a selenium function, so i'm under the impression it's storing that function unevaluated and then evaluating when i return that value
08:24	justin_smith	nondisclosure: let is greedy
08:24	justin_smith	or I should say, it is sequential, and is not itself lazy
08:24	justin_smith	is the function you are calling lazy?
08:25	nondisclosure	i'm actually not sure, so you're saying if i do (let [a (+ 1 1)]) let is storing a 2 rather than a (+ 1 1)?
08:25	justin_smith	right
08:26	nondisclosure	ahh i see
08:26	nondisclosure	thanks, that points me in a good direction, i'll try to figure out what that function is doing
08:48	CookedGryphon	Does anyone know of a handy core.async/chan -> InputStream converter
08:49	CookedGryphon	I want to stream data to a javascript EventSource in a wrapped WebView through the WebRequestResponse api, in which I can give it an InputStream
08:49	CookedGryphon	I set it up with a PipedInputStream. PipedOutputStream, but that doesn't seem to do anything on the receiving end until the buffer fills up
08:49	CookedGryphon	and apparently has a number of other pitfalls
08:51	CookedGryphon	I'm trying to wrap the InputStream interface directly, but it doesn't quite fit with the core.async model, as it has an available() method which should return the number of bytes available, and then a separate read(byte buffer[], off, len)
08:51	CookedGryphon	so I can't just have read doing <!! available-data
08:55	jeffterrell	[news] Clojure is currently the highest-paid programming language, according to this analysis: http://bit.ly/13zeP2x . Relatively low demand, though.
08:55	justin_smith	CookedGryphon: yeah, it seems like you need an abstraction between the channel and the InputStream proxy
08:55	craigglennie	I get a ClassCastException trying to use one of my namespaces in nREPL. Subsequent attempts to use the namespace generate a “namespace […] not found” exception, and I have to restart nREPL to try again - is this normal? https://www.refheap.com/92645
08:55	craigglennie	Also using Cursive, if it matters
08:56	justin_smith	craigglennie: after a require throws an exception, you need to specify :reload for the require to rettry
08:56	justin_smith	*retry
08:56	justin_smith	as far as clojure is concerned, it already required it once, so it is done :)
08:56	justin_smith	(require 'my.ns :reload)
08:58	justin_smith	assumedly you fixed the "string isn't a regex" issue so the ns would actually load this time, of course
08:59	craigglennie	justin_smith: thanks, that worked!
09:15	clgv	I want to get a short string representation of a byte array similar to a hexadecimal representation but with more characters to reduce the length. is there something Java built-in I can use? some option to a formatter or similar?
09:18	justin_smith	clgv: what about base64?
09:18	justin_smith	the encoding returns a byte-array, but it is easy to apply String. to that
09:19	clgv	justin_smith: hmm would work I guess
09:19	clgv	justin_smith: did you have a clojure lib in mind for that?
09:21	justin_smith	,(require '[clojure.data.codec.base64 :as b64])
09:21	clojurebot	#<FileNotFoundException java.io.FileNotFoundException: Could not locate clojure/data/codec/base64__init.class or clojure/data/codec/base64.clj on classpath: >
09:21	justin_smith	(b64/encode (.getBytes "hello"))
09:21	clgv	ok the contrib one ^^
09:21	justin_smith	that would work, if the previous did :)
09:21	justin_smith	well, really you want (String. (b64/encode (.getBytes "hello")))
09:22	justin_smith	in my repl that returns "aGVsbG8="
09:22	justin_smith	(.getBytes "hello") is just a placeholder for a byte array, of course
09:23	hyPiRion	urgh
09:23	clgv	damn two additional deps for debugging this strange error scenario...
09:25	justin_smith	you don't need the dep
09:25	justin_smith	,(String. (.encode (java.util.Base64/getEncoder) (.getBytes "hello")))
09:25	clojurebot	#<CompilerException java.lang.ClassNotFoundException: java.util.Base64, compiling:(NO_SOURCE_PATH:0:0)>
09:25	justin_smith	wat
09:26	justin_smith	oh, that is new with java 8
09:26	justin_smith	so it works in my repl :)
09:26	clgv	yeah well, I have the dep now ;)
09:27	justin_smith	I was hoping there was a simple way to not need the dep
09:27	sveri	Hi, when creating a new project with leining, is there a way to add a generic namespace for all generated classes?
09:32	jzinedine	hey guys, I'm trying to build a simple pedestal service using stencil but got a weird exception, java.lang.ClassCastException: java.lang.String cannot be cast to clojure.lang.Associative
09:32	jzinedine	here is the complete stacktrace: https://gist.github.com/jzinedine/acc68a83e6164aa77b98
09:32	jzinedine	appreciate any help
09:34	clgv	justin_smith: yeah no problem I just added it
09:34	justin_smith	that exception means that someone is trying to treat a string as an associative datastructure (likely ussing assoc or get)
09:35	justin_smith	yeah, assoc-in is finding a string instead of a vector or map at some level
09:36	justin_smith	it looks like it is happening in the header creation
09:36	jzinedine	yeah, I'm trying to understand what's happening in ~/.m2/repository/io/pedestal/pedestal.service/0.3.1/pedestal.service-0.3.1.jar!/io/pedestal/http/secure_headers.clj
09:37	justin_smith	jzinedine: one guess - it is being handed a string rather than a response map?
09:37	jzinedine	(fn [{response :response :as context}]
09:37	jzinedine	(assoc-in context [:response :headers] (merge sec-headers (:headers response)))
09:38	justin_smith	so what is context? is it a string?
09:38	justin_smith	or perhaps headers is a string
09:38	jzinedine	it's a map actually
09:38	jzinedine	but response is string
09:39	justin_smith	there you go
09:39	justin_smith	response should likely be a map, with :body containing said string
09:39	justin_smith	jzinedine: clojure.trace is helpful for this kind of stuff in my experience
09:39	jzinedine	yeah maybe it should be a ring response map
09:40	jzinedine	thanks a bunch buddy for your help
09:40	justin_smith	jzinedine: yeah, tools like compojure will automatically turn a string into a response map I think, maybe pedastal is more finicky
09:40	jzinedine	I'm a clojure newbie and just trying to develop my first app using clojure
09:40	justin_smith	cool
09:41	daniel___	pedestal is pretty hard to get your head around, there aren't really many parallels with conventional frameworks in other languages
09:41	daniel___	at least thats how it seemed to me
09:41	daniel___	i don't know if it's worth it
09:41	justin_smith	I'll just reiterate tools.trace is great for finding out what is actually going on
09:44	jzinedine	daniel___ I think most of what it does remind me of spring aspects, here we have interceptors, a familiar idea, but I'm not good at language nor tools to debug and browse apis
09:45	daniel___	jzinedine: that might be the case, im really unfamiliar with Java frameworks
09:46	jzinedine	however I think when I get my head around it I can be very productive , yet everything is simple to understand
09:51	lazylambda	folks, I am currently using cider on emacs to work with clojure. Are there alternatives that provide better code formatting?
09:52	ARM9	what about clojure mode
09:53	mwfogleman	lazylambda: https://github.com/sanel/monroe/ is a new cider alternative. i haven't tried it, so i'm not sure about it's code formatting.
09:53	justin_smith	ARM9: cider uses clojure mode
09:54	mwfogleman	actually,
09:54	mwfogleman	yeah
09:54	mwfogleman	it uses clojure mode too :D
09:54	mwfogleman	not sure about any clojure mode alternatives.
09:54	llasram	lazylambda: What do you mean by "better"?
09:55	lazylambda	llasram: well, I am happy with clojure-mode. I just like how slime indents code better
09:55	lazylambda	llasram: for example cond forms
09:55	justin_smith	mwfogleman: monroe does not replace clojure mode in any way
09:55	mwfogleman	yeah
09:56	mwfogleman	lazylambda: sounds like it might be doing a compare and contrast between clojure mode and slime.
09:56	llasram	lazylambda: You may just be seeing differing standard formatting for CL vs Clojure?
09:56	mwfogleman	ah, that may be true.
09:58	schmir	lazylambda: https://github.com/schmir/.emacs.d/blob/master/lisp/setup-clojure.el#L17 may be relevant
09:58	lazylambda	schmir: that looks good. Thank you
09:59	mwfogleman	schmir: what exactly does your snippet do?
09:59	lazylambda	In general, is there a standardised way of formatting clojure code?.
10:00	mwfogleman	lazylambda: https://github.com/bbatsov/clojure-style-guide may be helpful
10:00	schmir	mwfogleman: it fixes cond formatting for me :)
10:00	mwfogleman	schmir: :) i tried evaling your code and looking at a before and after with a cond that i have locally, but i couldn't tell a difference.
10:01	schmir	I'm not sure if it's still needed...
10:01	mwfogleman	schmir: that's possible. it's also possible that I am blind, or that the eval needs to happen at boot or something.
10:03	schmir	mwfogleman: if I comment it out, cond formatting is broken for me
10:03	mwfogleman	schmir: interesting. maybe i'm blind then.
10:04	schmir	:)
10:04	mwfogleman	schmir: on the other hand, i really like your advice to cider-load-current-buffer.
10:04	mwfogleman	schmir: that looks really handy.
10:04	lazylambda	my problem with the cond formatting is that if the action code is too long and I decide to put it on a separate line, it is placed right under and aligned with the action which makes it harder to read sometimes
10:04	mwfogleman	lazylambda: interesting. i'll try that out.
10:05	schmir	lazylambda: then try my code. it fixes that issue!
10:05	mwfogleman	lazylambda: with schmir's code ;) with the cond i was checking out, everything was on one line.
10:05	lazylambda	schmir: sweet, i'll give it a shot
10:08	mwfogleman	schmir: wow, that defadvice is great :D
10:22	jzinedine	sorry for bothering again, but anyone knows about a way to reload/auto-reload resource files (css/js/html) in repl?
10:24	mwfogleman	jzinedine: https://github.com/bhauman/lein-figwheel ?
10:24	mwfogleman	not sure.
10:27	jzinedine	mwfogleman: thanks I'll check it out
10:28	jzinedine	seems to be a clojurescript plugin, don't know if I can use it in a clojure project
10:28	mwfogleman	jzinedine: i don't do anything with browser stuff right now, so that might not be what you're looking for.
10:28	mwfogleman	jzinedine: right.
10:28	jzinedine	mwfogleman: yeah thanks anyway
10:29	jzinedine	I think I should look for a way to disable stencil caching in dev mode
10:32	jzinedine	yeah, I just need to eval this line in repl: (stencil.loader/set-cache (clojure.core.cache/ttl-cache-factory {} :ttl 0))
10:44	csd_	Does it make sense to incorporate macros into compojure views to factor out the (let [binding param]) stuff? I have a ton of it cluttering my code but am having trouble thinking of a good way to consolidate it
10:47	CookedGryphon	Can anyone think of a decent pattern for piping the string contents of a channel into an InputStream that stays open for a long time receiving occasional appends
10:47	CookedGryphon	as in a core.async channel with core.async take semantics
10:48	mr_rm	having trouble understanding the seed arguments to memo. if i try this: (def foo (clojure.core.memoize/memo + {[42 1] 99})) and then call (foo 42 1) I get an error trying to cast Long to Future. I thought the map value should simply be the return value. What am I doing wrong here?
10:48	CookedGryphon	I'm struggling to wire up appropriate input/output streams, tried implementing Inputstream directly myself and hit all sorts of snags
10:48	weavejester	csd_: Could you explain a little more what you mean?
10:48	klyed2	CookedGryphon: i know very little clojure, but cues maybe?
10:48	CookedGryphon	PipedInputStream and PipedOutputStream sort of work, but don't flush immediately, I need to fill the buffer before anything goes through
10:49	csd_	weavejester: sure
10:49	csd_	(defn add-link! [request]
10:49	csd_	(let [{session :session} request
10:49	csd_	{params :params} request
10:49	csd_	{link :link} params
10:49	csd_	{description :description} params
10:49	csd_	{username :username} session]
10:49	csd_	I have a ton of that
10:49	Bronsa	csd_: do you know about :keys?
10:50	Bronsa	(let [{session :session} request {params :params} request] ..) can be rewritten as (let [{:keys [session params]} request] ..)
10:50	weavejester	csd_: {{:keys [username]} :session, :keys [link description] :params}
10:51	Bronsa	^ and they can nest
10:51	csd_	I guess my hangup is I feel like there should be a way to make a wrapper that makes it so that each view doesn't require a let statement to access request parameters
10:51	weavejester	I’d also be tempted to use Compojure’s binding forms
10:52	weavejester	It’s often a good idea to restrict what data your functions have access to.
10:52	weavejester	The less they know, the less that can affect them.
10:53	weavejester	You can also make use of closures
10:53	csd_	By clojure binding forms you mean the binding during defroutes?
10:53	weavejester	No, the binding forms in GET, POST, etc.
10:53	csd_	I think that's what I mean
10:53	csd_	How would you do that in the case of multiple vars?
10:54	weavejester	Let me put together a gist
10:57	weavejester	csd_: https://gist.github.com/weavejester/b7388f5626f5bfa512a5
10:58	weavejester	There’s potentially a better way of getting the username from the session, I think…
10:58	weavejester	Maybe dumping it into the request map
10:58	clgv	oh `gen/elements` from test.check behaves pretty badly for a list of 56 entities when performing 100 runs - in the last runs the only the last element of the collection is used
10:58	csd_	weavejester: Is that something that would need to be done on the library side?
10:59	weavejester	csd_: No, you could add the username to the request with middleware
11:00	weavejester	csd_: But I’m considering improving the efficiency of the context macro when the route is “/“…
11:01	csd_	this gist is helpful, thanks
11:02	CookedGryphon	Does anybody know of an alternative to PipedInputStream/PipedOutputStream which doesn't wait for the buffer to be full/closed before it writes to the consumer?
11:03	mr_rm	CookedGryphon: can you call flush at opportune times?
11:05	justin_smith	CookedGryphon: isn't there one like that in java.nio somewhere?
11:06	mr_rm	having trouble understanding the seed arguments to memo. if i try this: (def foo (clojure.core.memoize/memo + {[42 1] 99})) and then call (foo 42 1) I get an error trying to cast Long to Future. I thought the map value should simply be the return value. What am I doing wrong here?
11:06	EvanR	,({:a 1} :a)
11:06	clojurebot	1
11:06	EvanR	,(:a {:a 1})
11:06	clojurebot	1
11:06	EvanR	o_O no wonder im having hard time remembering the order
11:07	mr_rm	EvanR: the second version won't give you nullpointerexceptions if you have no map though
11:08	mr_rm	,(nil :a)
11:08	clojurebot	#<CompilerException java.lang.IllegalArgumentException: Can't call nil, compiling:(NO_SOURCE_PATH:0:0)>
11:08	mr_rm	,(:a nil)
11:08	clojurebot	nil
11:08	EvanR	null pointer exceptions are good for you, they build character
11:08	mwfogleman	:D
11:10	arrdem	&(char nul)
11:10	lazybot	java.lang.RuntimeException: Unable to resolve symbol: nul in this context
11:10	arrdem	&(char nil)
11:10	lazybot	java.lang.NullPointerException
11:10	arrdem	^ not building character
11:10	EvanR	lol
11:12	Glenjamin	hahaha
11:12	Glenjamin	(inc arrdem)
11:12	lazybot	⇒ 39
11:12	mr_rm	((clojure.core.memoize/memo + {[42 1] 99}) 42 2)
11:12	mr_rm	,((clojure.core.memoize/memo + {[42 1] 99}) 42 2)
11:12	clojurebot	#<CompilerException java.lang.ClassNotFoundException: clojure.core.memoize, compiling:(NO_SOURCE_PATH:0:0)>
11:13	mr_rm	,(require 'clojure.core.memoize)
11:13	clojurebot	#<FileNotFoundException java.io.FileNotFoundException: Could not locate clojure/core/memoize__init.class or clojure/core/memoize.clj on classpath: >
11:13	mr_rm	,((clojure.core.memoize/memo + {[42 1] 99}) 42 2)
11:13	clojurebot	#<CompilerException java.lang.ClassNotFoundException: clojure.core.memoize, compiling:(NO_SOURCE_PATH:0:0)>
11:16	justin_smith	,(Character. nil)
11:16	clojurebot	#<NullPointerException java.lang.NullPointerException>
11:22	mr_rm_	clojure-version
11:22	mr_rm_	,clojure-version
11:22	clojurebot	{:interim true, :major 1, :minor 7, :incremental 0, :qualifier "master"}
11:26	mwfogleman	bots.
11:37	EvanR	,(first nil)
11:37	clojurebot	nil
11:37	EvanR	,(ffirst nil)
11:37	clojurebot	nil
11:38	justin_smith	,(get-in nil [:we :must :go :deeper :inception])
11:38	clojurebot	nil
11:43	clgv	O_o
11:44	CookedGryphon	mr_rm_: flush doesn't seem to do anything at all, it still waits for the buffer to fill or the outputstream to close
11:44	CookedGryphon	justin_smith: not that I can find, and I have looked. Pointers appreciated
11:45	mr_rm_	http://clojure.github.io/core.memoize/#clojure.core.memoize/memo is there a bug in the documentation here? you can't actually provide just a simple number here as the return value. you need to use a (delay 42) or something similar
11:45	clgv	CookedGryphon: hmm usually .flush should do that
11:45	CookedGryphon	clgv: that's what I thought
11:45	CookedGryphon	I spent ages sending one message then a flush and thinking I didn't have it wired up correctly
11:46	CookedGryphon	but actually I just need to send ~1k messages and it all streams out
11:46	mr_rm_	i can see that the source code derefs the value and you can't do that on a simple number. the documentation is what threw me in the first place. simply wrapping those values in the seed map with a (delay) works fine
11:47	mr_rm_	CookedGryphon: personally, i would suspect a bug in your code because that's how flush works :) maybe you're doing something with a lazy seq that isn't getting realized... or something
11:47	CookedGryphon	I'm literally calling (.write ostream (.getBytes "Hello" "UTF-8")) (.flush ostream)
11:47	clgv	CookedGryphon: do you use other streams wrapped around or within?
11:48	CookedGryphon	and if I do the same in a dotimes [n 10000] it comes through
11:48	CookedGryphon	nope, I have (let [istream (PipedInputStream.), ostream (PipedOutputStream. istream)] ...
11:48	CookedGryphon	handing the PipedInputStream to the WebView API
11:49	CookedGryphon	that's expecting an InputStream
11:49	CookedGryphon	I wonder....
11:50	CookedGryphon	let me make a gist, I just had a thought
11:51	CookedGryphon	https://gist.github.com/AdamClements/27948417027275d08f06
11:51	mr_rm_	does anyone else agree that the documentation of the seed values here is a bug because it shows using a simple number? i can submit a PR but i want to be sure i'm not just misinterpreting: http://clojure.github.io/core.memoize/#clojure.core.memoize/memo
11:52	clgv	CookedGryphon: looks good over here: http://grepcode.com/file/repository.grepcode.com/java/root/jdk/openjdk/7u40-b43/java/io/PipedOutputStream.java#PipedOutputStream.flush%28%29
11:53	CookedGryphon	Is it that doing <!! waiting for more data in the same thread is not allowing the InputStream to be read because my thread is blocked or something?
11:53	Bronsa	mr_rm_: "where keys are a vector
11:53	Bronsa	mapping expected argument values to arity positions"
11:53	Bronsa	mr_rm_: it seems pretty clear to me that the numbers are example inputs
11:54	mr_rm_	Bronsa: if you use a number as the VALUE though, calling the memoized function will blow up (can't cast a Long to a Future)
11:54	EvanR	,(first "foo")
11:54	clojurebot	\f
11:55	mr_rm_	Bronsa: that is, this will work: ((clojure.core.memoize/memo + {[42 1] (future 99)}) 42 1) but this won't: ((clojure.core.memoize/memo + {[42 1] 99}) 42 1)
11:55	Bronsa	mr_rm_: gotcha
11:58	Bronsa	mr_rm_: I'd say, rather than changing the docstring, the impl should change
11:58	Bronsa	https://github.com/clojure/core.memoize/blob/master/src/main/clojure/clojure/core/memoize.clj#L148-L152
11:58	CookedGryphon	I think it must be something to do with which thread I'm doing things on...
11:58	csd_	weavejester: I think there is an error in the gist you wrote. `username` actually appears to be the request map
12:00	Bronsa	mr_rm_: btw it expects an IDeref, not necessarily a future, you can use an atom/delay/var whatever
12:00	mr_rm_	Bronsa: i also feel it would be a simpler api if you could just pass the actual return value. that threw me at first when i was trying to use it as documented. feels artificial to have to pass a delay or something
12:00	weavejester	csd_: What do you mean?
12:00	csd_	I'm doing basically (str username) and it's returning the entire request map
12:01	mr_rm_	Bronsa: yes i figured that out afterward. i should have just looked at the source first but the doc seems to straightforward i thought i must be doing something stupid :)
12:01	weavejester	csd_: Could I take a look at your code? I don’t see how destructuring could fail like that
12:02	csd_	sure one sec
12:02	Bronsa	mr_rm_: http://dev.clojure.org/jira/browse/CMEMOIZE here's the bug tracker for core.memoize if you want to open a ticket reporting the bug
12:05	EvanR	function to get the only value out of a map known to have exactly one entry
12:05	EvanR	,(second (first {:a 0}))
12:05	clojurebot	0
12:06	csd_	weavejester: sorry looks like i had a syntax error
12:06	weavejester	csd_: No problem :)
12:09	CookedGryphon	this is really infuriating. I tried moving the PipedOutputStream creation into the thread that's reading off the channel, no luck. It's still not getting read. I wonder if this is something wrong with the way the webview is reading the InputStream...
12:12	clgv	CookedGryphon: just try it, make a debug thread that just consumes and prints your input stream
12:14	mr_rm_	Bronsa: done. http://dev.clojure.org/jira/browse/CMEMOIZE-18 thanks for your response
12:19	csd_	weavejester: if keys aren't present in the request map but are being destructured, will that cause problems with route processing at all?
12:19	mr_rm_	,(val (first {:a 0}))
12:19	clojurebot	0
12:19	borkdude	what is the technical term for getting a value out of a map by key?
12:20	weavejester	csd_: I don’t believe so. Destructuring a missing key just ends up with nil
12:20	Bronsa	borkdude: looking up?
12:20	weavejester	,(let [{{:keys [session]} :request} {}] session)
12:20	clojurebot	nil
12:21	csd_	weavejester: i'm really stumped at this point. my login function wasn't getting called anymore, so i stripped out all the parameters and made the response just a simple str, and then a print to console, and it doesn't even seem like it's getting called.
12:21	csd_	(POST "/login" [] (views/login))
12:21	csd_	only thing i can think of is that somehow the destructuring above is causing it
12:22	borkdude	Bronsa yeah ok
12:22	weavejester	csd_: Let me double-check I’m not mistaken about context
12:23	weavejester	csd_: Hm, seems to work on my end
12:24	weavejester	csd_: What does your code look like? And which version of Compojure/Ring are you using?
12:24	csd_	compojure 1.1.9; ring 1.3.1
12:25	csd_	i'll put on pastebin, one moment
12:25	weavejester	csd_: I don’t think there are any bugs in 1.1.9 that would cause a problem, but it might be worth updating to 1.2.1
12:27	EvanR	function to run a function on each value, which does IO, and get the list of results of each one, like a foreach which gives the results in a list/seq
12:28	csd_	weavejester: http://pastebin.com/yQeXDuHA
12:31	weavejester	csd_: There are a couple of odd things in that code. You’re using the deprecated handler/site and wrap-defaults simultaneously.
12:31	justin_smith	mr_rm_: EvanR: how about ##(first (vals {:a 0}))
12:31	lazybot	⇒ 0
12:31	EvanR	##?
12:32	justin_smith	## is just inline lazybot syntax
12:32	weavejester	csd_: You also have a parameter called “session”, which leaves me to think that’s a mistake?
12:32	mr_rm_	justin_smith: sure, why not? :)
12:32	cbryan	it's a super-anonymous function, duh
12:32	csd_	session is in there because the function i'm passing it to needs to be able to add :username to the session
12:32	justin_smith	mr_rm_: I like it because it does not rely on implicit seq / map overloading
12:33	csd_	i don't know how else to do the assoc otherwise
12:33	csd_	as for handler/site, can i just remove it since i'm using wrap-defaults?
12:34	mr_rm_	justin_smith: not sure i understand... vals basically turns it into a seq of values right?
12:34	mr_rm_	then you're just using a seq function
12:34	weavejester	csd_: You can remove handler/site, because you’re using wrap-defaults instead.
12:35	mr_rm_	justin_smith: whereas my way is just getting the first MapEntry and then retrieving the val of that entry
12:35	weavejester	csd_: The context destructuring looks okay, but maybe try updating your Compojure version to the latest one?
12:35	mr_rm_	justin_smith: not that i think it makes much diff :)
12:35	csd_	ok
12:35	weavejester	csd_: The session binding you have just binds to a parameter called session, not the actual session.
12:35	EvanR	i think doall map is what im trying to think of
12:36	weavejester	csd_: For that you’d want :as {:keys [session]}
12:36	weavejester	csd_: Or take advantage of Compojure’s handling of returned functions
12:36	csd_	how do you mean?
12:37	mr_rm_	EvanR: maybe reduce?
12:37	weavejester	csd_: (GET “/“ [] (fn [req] (assoc (:session req {}) :foo “bar”)))
12:37	justin_smith	mr_rm_: vals is a function that takes a map and returns a seq - that is what it explicitly does. first when called on a map returns a map entry, but this is less explicit. For example imagine reading the code in a context where the map was not a literal, but was an argument passed in - with first vals I would know to expect a map in that place, with val first it's slightly more ambiguous
12:37	weavejester	csd_: Well, that won’t work exactly because the return value is wrong…
12:38	mr_rm_	justin_smith: this is why i'm slightly uncomfortable with dynamic languages :)
12:38	weavejester	csd_: But the idea is that you can return a function and using that to regrab the request map, without needing to pull in the request map explicitly.
12:38	justin_smith	mr_rm_: my discomfort grows
12:38	csd_	which do you view as being better style?
12:39	EvanR	im going with first vals for that, it makes sense
12:39	EvanR	and easier to read
12:39	EvanR	without already knowing all the clojure tricks
12:39	weavejester	csd_: Returning a handler function that modifies the request would be my choice, I think.
12:39	EvanR	,(de-dupe [1 1 2 2 1 1])
12:40	clojurebot	#<CompilerException java.lang.RuntimeException: Unable to resolve symbol: de-dupe in this context, compiling:(NO_SOURCE_PATH:0:0)>
12:40	EvanR	,(dedupe [1 1 2 2 1 1])
12:40	clojurebot	(1 2 1)
12:40	weavejester	csd_: Although I’m not sure it’s necessary - I typically just keep a user identifier in the session, so there’s only ever one value anyway.
12:41	mr_rm_	EvanR: (reduce #(conj %1 (do (prn %2) 99)) [] ["hi" "there"])
12:41	csd_	weavejester: yeah i think its just more an issue of setting it though--i only set session with user too
12:42	weavejester	csd_: {:session {:username username}} then
12:42	EvanR	mr_rm_: doesnt doall already do this
12:42	mr_rm_	EvanR: added a (do) just to get a return value more interesting than nil :)
12:43	mr_rm_	EvanR: i thought you wanted it to collect the return values from the i/o function
12:43	Glenjamin	anyone around familar with reagent (this may apply to Om too) - if i redef a component in the repl, but it's in a part of my UI tree that shouldComponentUpdate is false - is there a way to reload it?
12:44	EvanR	mr_rm_: the io function already returns the result, and im applying it to a list of inputs, so (doall (map proc) inputs) ?
12:44	EvanR	er
12:44	EvanR	mr_rm_: the io function already returns the result, and im applying it to a list of inputs, so (doall (map proc inputs)) ?
12:44	csd_	java.lang.IllegalAccessError: rfn does not exist, compiling:(route.clj:1:1)
12:45	EvanR	,(sort [1 3 2 1])
12:45	clojurebot	(1 1 2 3)
12:45	bordatoue	hi can anyone please help me, I'm trying to read some funtion written in a txt file using read-string and using eval create a fn which i invoke dynamically. The problem is it works in repl but when i run it outside repl all the string losses its quotes
12:45	bordatoue	is there any way accomplish this using read-string
12:47	ohpauleez	bordatoue: You are reading in the file using `slurp`?
12:47	bordatoue	yes
12:47	mr_rm_	EvanR: map is really better for applying pure functions to data.
12:47	bordatoue	ohpauleez: yes
12:47	EvanR	mr_rm_: yeah, that would make sense
12:49	EvanR	make it seems like this would work and theres no alternative, and if there was one would be indistinguishable from map
12:49	bordatoue	ohpauleez: actually i got my main clj program which reads a txt file ; the txt file contains some fn defined in clj. I read in the txt file using (eval (read-string (slurp "text")) ==> fn
12:49	EvanR	s/^make //
12:49	ohpauleez	bordatoue: You should be able to pass that directly to `read-string`
12:50	mr_rm_	(reduce #(conj %1 (myfunc %2) [] inputs) would be ok right?
12:50	ohpauleez	bordatoue: Be careful though, you want to make sure you that text file is fully trusted
12:50	bordatoue	ohpauleez: but read-string seems to get rid of all the quotes , so when i have something in the function "." using read-string it becomes .
12:50	EvanR	mr_rm_: right, you can also implement map the same way
12:51	EvanR	map and reduce to me same equally as "pure"
12:51	bordatoue	ohpauleez: I really don't care about trust , I just want the implementation to work
12:51	EvanR	seem*
12:51	mr_rm_	EvanR: yes, agreed. it just feels icky to use map to generate side effects. side effects are always messy :)
12:52	EvanR	it feels icky to produce it with reduce, actually side effects are icky. however in this case i am dealing with non-side effects, they are the main point of this computation ;)
12:52	Bronsa	EvanR: you should prefer doseq to map to iterate over a sequence performing side-effects
12:52	mr_rm_	EvanR: the problem is you want to both generate the effects AND collect up the results so it's ugly no matter what
12:52	EvanR	front effects
12:53	EvanR	Bronsa: but i dont get the results right
12:53	Bronsa	EvanR: ah you want the results, ok
12:53	EvanR	mr_rm_: head scratch, why is that more icky than throwing the results away? IO actions often result in a response value
12:53	Bronsa	EvanR: sorry I mix dorun and doall in my head every time
12:54	borkdude	history question: what led to clojurescript one being abandoned
12:54	EvanR	yeah so doall seems the most appropriate, it even has a do in the name
12:54	ohpauleez	borkdude: The creation of Pedestal App (just a guess)
12:55	borkdude	ohpauleez can pedestal app be seen as the successor of clojurescript one?
12:55	ohpauleez	I'd imagine so, to some degree
12:55	borkdude	ohpauleez interesting, didn't know that
12:55	EvanR	where is dedupe defined ...
12:56	cbryan	in 1.7 ;)
12:56	ohpauleez	Lineage looks like Brenton on CLJS:One, Chris on Pinot, Myself on Shoreleave
12:56	EvanR	ff
12:56	EvanR	s
12:56	ohpauleez	Brenton then doing Pedestal App (with others), Pinot being broken up
12:56	justin_smith	$source dedup
12:56	lazybot	Source not found.
12:56	cbryan	http://crossclj.info/fun/clojure.core/dedupe.html
12:57	ohpauleez	Then walking away from Pedestal App to collect our thoughts on React and core.async some more
12:57	mr_rm_	EvanR: what throws the results away?
12:57	mr_rm_	EvanR: but yeah... probably best to have doall on the outermost call to make it obvious
12:58	bordatoue	is there any alternative to read-string
12:58	bordatoue	how do i know which name same read-string belong to
12:59	justin_smith	bordatoue: there is clojure.edn/read-string
13:01	EvanR	that dedupe code is now stoled
13:03	ohpauleez	borkdude: You can also just use `read`
13:03	ohpauleez	and you already said it worked in the REPL, right?
13:03	ohpauleez	so if it works in the REPL, it'll work in your file. It's unclear what you're really trying to do
13:04	ohpauleez	but you're essentially doing the same thing the repl does (Read, eval)
13:04	EvanR	volatile! not defined...
13:04	justin_smith	ohpauleez: I think you meant to reply to bordatoue
13:04	ohpauleez	justin_smith: borkdude: bordatoue: Yes, sorry about that
13:04	ohpauleez	:)
13:06	EvanR	gah getting stuck on this dedupe thing, using old clojure strikes back
13:07	{blake}	OK, I need some help with partition-by. Like, maybe I'm misusing it. I'm using hiccup to convert a collection ("FieldName1" {:thing "value1" :group "group1"}, "FieldName2" {:thing1 "value3" :group...) into a Bootstrap table. This works.
13:08	{blake}	But I now want to partition the controls by the ":group" key in the associated map. So I use "(partition-by #(:group(val %))" which returns a list of lists for each partition.
13:09	justin_smith	{blake}: are you sure you want partition-by and not group-by?
13:10	justin_smith	partition-by is for ordered things, maps are not ordered
13:10	{blake}	justin_smith, I think so. Besides :group, I also have a :row. The controls have to come out in row order, but they need to break by group. (Which, theoretically, should be continuous.)
13:10	justin_smith	oh, I misunderstood, that is not a map
13:10	justin_smith	sorry
13:10	{blake}	justin_smith, Well, maybe that's where I'm going wrong.
13:11	ohpauleez	bordatoue: you can also look at `load-file` - http://clojuredocs.org/clojure.core/load-file
13:11	{blake}	justin_smith, Well, it =could= be. I'm not even sure why it's a list, actually. The field names are unique.
13:11	justin_smith	(partition-by (comp :group second) (partition 2 coll)) ?
13:11	{blake}	Oh, I know why: because I sort it.
13:11	{blake}	justin_smith, The partition-by works. The problem is I can't figure out how to work with the results.
13:12	{blake}	Like, when it's just a straight list, I have "(map input-to-control inputs)". Easy
13:12	justin_smith	(for [inputs partitioned input inputs] (input-to-control input))
13:12	{blake}	Once it's partitioned, I've got (first (map #(map input-to-control %) inputs) to get the FIRST group. But I can't figure out how to apply that to ALL the groups.
13:12	bordatoue	ohpauleez: but load-file is from repl, what if i want to work output side of repl
13:13	ohpauleez	Nothing is repl-specific
13:13	ohpauleez	You have access to whatever piece of Clojure code you want
13:13	{blake}	justin_smith, There it is. Thanks.
13:21	bordatoue	ohpauleez: clojure.core/read-string works in repl but outside of repl it doesn't parser double quotes so "abcd" become abcd
13:21	bordatoue	i don't know why that is
13:22	justin_smith	bordatoue: I don't think that is true
13:22	justin_smith	bordatoue: how are you verifying this?
13:22	bordatoue	well ;you create a clj project read some fn from an external file with double quotes using read-string
13:22	bordatoue	it gets messed up
13:23	justin_smith	bordatoue: is the function definition inside double quotes?
13:23	bordatoue	justin_smith: no
13:23	justin_smith	and what does "messed up" mean?
13:23	TimMc	You're saying that if I create a file with these 3 characters: \" \a \" and call slurp and read-string on it, I will get... what?
13:24	bordatoue	justin_smith: it means all the double quotes are gone so if i have a (.split "abcd" ".") it becomve (.split abcd .)
13:24	TimMc	I would expect String "a"
13:24	{blake}	(inc justin_smith)
13:24	lazybot	⇒ 114
13:24	TimMc	bordatoue: Please create a SSCCE. This doesn't seem right/
13:24	justin_smith	bordatoue: how do you know that happened?
13:25	Bronsa	bordatoue: http://sprunge.us/bdVi
13:25	bordatoue	i printed it to the console
13:25	justin_smith	bordatoue: that's your problem
13:25	justin_smith	use prn
13:25	justin_smith	,(print "abcd")
13:25	clojurebot	abcd
13:25	justin_smith	,(prn "abcd")
13:25	clojurebot	"abcd"\n
13:25	justin_smith	I knew it
13:25	TimMc	,(print 'abcd)
13:25	clojurebot	abcd
13:26	TimMc	,(prn 'abcd)
13:26	clojurebot	abcd\n
13:26	bordatoue	justin_smith: ok will use prn
13:32	success	Hi
13:33	success	under downloads there is lot of stuff
13:33	success	what do I need to do to just test some clojure
13:33	justin_smith	success: most projects use lein
13:33	justin_smith	success: and either lein test or lein midje will run the tests in most clojure projects, if you literally mean running the unit tests
13:34	justin_smith	if you mean "try using clojure" just download lein and run lein repl
13:36	lynaghk	hiredman: I've been looking at your datalog implementation (https://github.com/hiredman/datalog): do you have any writeups or references about the algorithm it uses?
13:37	bbloom_	is there any notion of an optional dependency?
13:37	lynaghk	hiredman: I just did a naive bottom-up implementation, but yours is about twice as fast on my toy dataset---not sure if it's a difference in algorithm or just some well placed code optimizations. I'm having a hard time following the code, so I thought I'd pop in and ask = )
13:37	bbloom_	ie do one thing if some dependency is available, do something else otherwise
13:38	justin_smith	bbloom_: you could hack something with resolve I guess...
13:39	cbryan	,(if (nil? (find-ns 'blah)) (println "nope, do A") (println "ok do something, B"))
13:39	clojurebot	nope, do A\n
13:39	bbloom_	justin_smith: i'm trying to figure out how to structure a development environment for a multi-component system. i don't want to require every dev run every service all the time while developing
13:39	justin_smith	bbloom_: yeah, makes sense
13:39	justin_smith	find-ns is a nice idea for that too
13:40	bbloom_	(doc find-ns)
13:40	clojurebot	"([sym]); Returns the namespace named by the symbol or nil if it doesn't exist."
13:40	bbloom_	hm
13:40	cbryan	bbloom_: my example was for you ;)
13:40	justin_smith	so you could wrap code in find-ns / resolve
13:40	justin_smith	you still need resolve, or the compilation will fail
13:41	bbloom_	thanks, i'll think about this a bunch
13:41	cbryan	justin_smith: why would resolve be needed?
13:41	nestastubbs	bbloom_: use a services/component model at runtime
13:41	cbryan	(not saying it wouldn't, i just don't immediately see why)
13:41	nestastubbs	bbloom_: and provide mocks/stubs
13:41	justin_smith	cbryan: because your attempt to call things in that ns would fail at compilation time
13:41	nestastubbs	for the components
13:41	bbloom_	nestastubbs: in past projects i've relied on dns, hosts files, etc
13:41	cbryan	justin_smith: oh, duh. ha
13:42	bbloom_	nestastubbs: jetty configs, etc
13:42	justin_smith	cbryan: it's not enough that the code referencing it not be called, it is still looked for when compiling
13:42	nestastubbs	sure, you could have teh system builder look at those to decide how to proceed
13:42	nestastubbs	we use sfnks
13:42	bbloom_	well, i have the added problem of evolving a relatively monolithic app
13:42	nestastubbs	and then a configuration map and a service definition map are combined to make the running system
13:42	justin_smith	bbloom_: when I have made similar things, I opted for passing everything in explicitly rather than using things via their ns.
13:42	clojurebot	Excuse me?
13:42	justin_smith	bbloom_: which is clumsy in its own way
13:43	nestastubbs	bbloom_: highly localized solution then 8)
13:44	bbloom_	would be nice to have only one jvm running, if i can help it
13:45	bbloom_	since it's all clojure and repl-friendly
13:47	cbryan	what's the difference between a function and a "special form"? I assume special forms do something that works with the innards of clojure? http://clojure.org/special_forms#Special Forms
13:47	justin_smith	cbryan: special forms are implemented in java
13:47	Bronsa	cbryan: they have custom evaluation semantics
13:47	cbryan	makes sense. thanks!
13:48	Bronsa	justin_smith: some functions are too though
13:48	Bronsa	e.g. in-ns
13:48	justin_smith	Bronsa: good point, thanks
13:52	success	lein is short for leiningen
13:53	justin_smith	yes, the executable is called lein
13:55	mi6x3m	Bronsa: hey, in tools-analyzer, would resolve-var return nil if the symbol is not a variable?
13:56	Bronsa	mi6x3m: no. resolve-sym would have been a better name but it's too late to change now
13:57	mi6x3m	Bronsa: well what would it do if the symbol is not a var?
13:57	mi6x3m	just return nil to the caller?
13:58	Bronsa	mi6x3m: not sure I understand what you're asking
13:58	mi6x3m	hm, this won't make any sense actually
13:58	mi6x3m	no, wait, was just a bit mind-blurred
13:59	Bronsa	mi6x3m: resolve-var returns whatever the symbol maps to in the namespace
13:59	Bronsa	mi6x3m: if it doesn't map to anything, it will return nil
13:59	Bronsa	mi6x3m: in case of t.a.jvm, resolve-var can return a Var or a Class
14:00	mi6x3m	yes, this was the issue more or less
14:00	mi6x3m	about classes
14:01	Bronsa	mi6x3m: what's the issue? just test with `var?`
14:01	mi6x3m	resolver_"var" is really tricky name :)
14:02	Bronsa	mi6x3m: yes, definitely. it used to actually resolve Vars only back when t.a and t.a.j were still a single entity
14:02	Bronsa	mi6x3m: in the process of making t.a modular & host agnostic foreseeing the implementation of t.a.js resolve-var was changed to return whatever the mapping was but the name remained the same
14:04	mi6x3m	yes that clarifies it
14:04	mi6x3m	it returns a mapping, not a var
14:04	mi6x3m	for jvm :)
14:04	Bronsa	mi6x3m: well in the docstring I talk about a var, not about a Var
14:05	mi6x3m	that's the truth!
14:05	success	should I really put lein in ~/bin and make it executable? i dont know much about security yet, I use ubuntu.
14:06	cbryan	yeah, you can trust it
14:06	cbryan	as long as you got it from https://github.com/technomancy/leiningen i should say
14:07	cbryan	also, ubuntu has it in its repos. try "apt-get install leiningen"
14:07	success	http://leiningen.org/
14:08	success	will sudo apt-et install leiningen put it under bin?
14:08	justin_smith	success: cbryan: ubuntu's version is old isn't it?
14:10	amalloy	suuuuper old
14:10	cbryan	[...] Version: 1.7.1-
14:10	cbryan	eesh
14:11	amalloy	success: download lein from github. putting stuff in ~/bin is a pretty normal thing to do and doesn't have any security issues i'm aware of
14:11	cbryan	^ yeah, ignore the apt-get line :)
14:11	justin_smith	amalloy: well the security issue would have to do with the provenance of the thing you put in ~/bin
14:12	csd_	spending over an hour getting frustrated until realizing i need to `lein clean`, priceless
14:12	justin_smith	but we all use the lein from technomancy's github, so there's that
14:12	cbryan	technomancy's playing the long game
14:12	cbryan	;)
14:13	amalloy	justin_smith: well, that's more an issue of putting stuff anywhere on your PATH, not of ~/bin
14:20	justin_smith	amalloy: right
14:22	success	why are there 3 places to download it from+github?
14:22	success	+ packet manage si mean
14:23	cbryan	to try to make it easy as possible to get started
14:23	cbryan	s/easy/as easy
14:25	success	what editor is the most popular? please dont say emacs :)
14:25	hfaafb	emacs
14:27	amalloy	success: well, if you didn't want emacs as the answer, you asked the wrong question
14:27	success	no eclipse plugin?
14:27	amalloy	the question you may have meant is "what editor should i use?", which has quite a different answer
14:27	Bronsa	success: cursive clojure is great
14:27	cbryan	i use sublime text personally
14:27	joshuafcole	If you really don't want to go with emacs, Light Table isn't nearly as popular (it's very young and has a few rough edges to iron out), but it has a really solid feature set for working with clj/cljs
14:27	hfaafb	LIGHT TABLE
14:27	success	how do i quit the repl
14:27	cbryan	ctrl + d
14:28	joshuafcole	Sublime Text is also popular, though it wasn't flexible enough for my tastes
14:28	justin_smith	(System/exit 0) works too
14:28	cbryan	yeah, im planning to learn emacs asap
14:29	amalloy	success: use whatever editor you're already comfortable with. as long as it's not notepad.exe, there's decent clojure support for it
14:29	amalloy	and you don't really need any editor support anyway: you can load files from the repl, or copy-paste snippets to it, whatever
14:30	amalloy	the important thing is to have as little irrelevant nonsense in the way of learning clojure, and there's little benefit to picking the editor used by clojure experts if you don't know how to use it
14:32	success	how do I run my clojure file as a program rather than run the repl?
14:33	cbryan	https://github.com/technomancy/leiningen/blob/stable/doc/TUTORIAL.md read that
14:35	dbasch	success: the easiest way is probably “java -cp path/to/clojure.jar clojure.main yourfile.clj”
14:35	dbasch	but it’s much better to have a leiningen project
14:36	success	yeah, using leinengen bow
14:36	success	ty all
14:36	success	unforetuneately the status of clojure on android is depressing
14:36	mwfogleman	Yeck, refactoring a file has exposed a circular dependency.
14:42	dbasch	clojure jobs supposedly pay well these days: https://msgooroo.com/GoorooTHINK/Article/16225/Programming-languages--salaries-and-demand-October-2014/17081#.VFfalfTF8a4
14:43	justin_smith	success: yeah, clojure is great but it is kind of resource-hungry
14:43	Glenjamin	interesting, i'm surprised to see fortran so low
14:43	Glenjamin	left-side skewed by lack of data i guess
14:51	EvanR	nice clojure stats there, most expensive, nearly lowest demand
14:52	EvanR	can i haz average clojure weight salary plz
14:52	borkdude	EvanR 60 euros per gram
14:53	mi6x3m	good one
14:54	EvanR	can imagine most job ads literally saying c/c++ which would account for the coincidence of C and "C++ Developer"
14:55	EvanR	wonder where Swift is ;)
14:55	mi6x3m	EvanR: this is non-sense anyhow. a proper job ad should say "experienced developer with some common sense" without mention of any languages
14:55	amalloy	mi6x3m: "strong background in english recommended"
14:55	mi6x3m	hehe
14:56	AimHere	Alternatively other job adverts could follow suit. "Housepainter required. Must have had 3-5 years experience of brown paint"
14:56	borkdude	"should be able to port clojure's persistent vectors in C "
14:56	joshuafcole	(inc AimHere)
14:56	lazybot	⇒ 3
14:56	joshuafcole	heh
14:57	EvanR	"if programming languages were colors of paint"
14:58	EvanR	does polka dot, striped, and plaid count
14:58	borkdude	Hackers and Painters
14:59	cbryan	what if i've mixed other colors together and it ended up brown, but i've never really worked with brown directly...?
15:00	EvanR	3-5 years spaghetti code
15:00	dbasch	https://www.dropbox.com/s/dn6fktq73fxzapk/Screenshot%202014-11-03%2011.59.06.png?dl=0 “if programming languages were…"
15:00	csd_	is spaghetti code still bad if you are working for food service companies
15:01	joshuafcole	heh
15:01	joshuafcole	Depends on the ratio of meatballs
15:01	borkdude	spaghetti's no problem if you can just cut right through it
15:01	joshuafcole	even in the food industry, if it's all spaghetti you're not doing to hot
15:01	csd_	i like my code al dente, mostly
15:01	joshuafcole	s/to/too
15:02	teslanick	That would be a good food service industry startup name: SpaghettiCode.
15:02	joshuafcole	quick tip: If you add a sprinkle of salt to the water before adding the code to the pot, you get improved security for free.
15:02	csd_	haha
15:04	mwfogleman	huzzah, i have resolved this circular dependency. how does everyone here prevent and handle prevent circular dependencies?
15:05	dbasch	mwfogleman: modular design?
15:06	EvanR	refactor
15:06	EvanR	,(distinct [1 1 2 2 1 1])
15:06	clojurebot	(1 2)
15:07	success	(defn -main
15:07	success	"I don't do a whole lot."
15:07	success	[& args]
15:07	success	(println "Hello, World!"))
15:07	success	Java is still a good bet, I mean Clojure might be high in pay but it is low on#jobs
15:08	cbryan	mwfogleman: if i'm where i am now, with incomplete structs :(
15:09	m1dnight_	+go info
15:09	m1dnight_	sorry 'bout that
15:10	success	org.apache.maven:super-pom:pom:2.0
15:10	justin_smith	mwfogleman: usually, by pulling commonalities into something more abstract, like a protocol or defmethod that both sides can refer to
15:11	justin_smith	mwfogleman: or when things are super bad (like fixing someone else's code and things are way tangled and wanting to alter as little as possible while still cleaning up) I may use resolve. It feels dirty when I do that though.
15:12	dbasch	resolve, courage and determination are useful when cleaning other people’s code
15:13	EvanR	luck
15:13	dbasch	luck is useful even when not cleaning someone else’s code
15:13	justin_smith	heh
15:14	Glenjamin	integration/acceptance tests are also handy
15:14	mgaare	it's like cleaning a hotel room after a rock band has been there
15:14	SagiCZ1	hi, anyone know clj-time? i have a datetime object, and i want to have a copy of that object just with a different minutes for example 1970-1-1-16-36 ->1970-1-1-16-n. How can i do that?
15:14	mgaare	if you're lucky, it wasn't John Bonham
15:15	success	after installing lein, how do i install all the necessary java stuff?
15:15	success	1 required artifact is missing.
15:15	success	for artifact:
15:15	success	org.apache.maven:super-pom:pom:2.0
15:15	success	3
15:16	justin_smith	success: lein does it. If it doesn't work then the project.clj or your .lein/profiles.clj should be fixed
15:16	EvanR	SagiCZ1: you can add a number of minutes equal to the difference of 36 and n
15:17	success	1 required artifact is missing.
15:17	success	for artifact:
15:17	success	org.apache.maven:super-pom:pom:2.0
15:17	success	oops
15:17	success	(defproject app "1.0.0-SNAPSHOT"
15:17	success	:description "FIXME: write description"
15:17	success	:dependencies [[org.clojure/clojure "1.3.0"]])
15:17	mgaare	SagiCZ1: either add or build a new object from your old one d like, (date-time (year d) (month d) (day d) (hour d) n)
15:17	SagiCZ1	EvanR: i know, but the difference is what i want to find out.. i have one date, and i want to know how many minutes till some n number of minutes. I can use t/interval for that, but i dont know how to construct the other day
15:17	Bronsa	success: it loks like you're using a super old version of lein if it defaults to clojure 1.3
15:17	SagiCZ1	mgaare: yeah thats what i figured, but thats so ugly
15:18	EvanR	SagiCZ1: the literal difference in minutes if given by subtracting one minutes x from the other minutes x
15:18	EvanR	ah but thats another story entirely
15:19	SagiCZ1	i am basically trying to implement "rounding" of dates to some predefined time periods.. (like tens of minutes, days.. etc) .. cant believe joda doesnt have it
15:19	EvanR	SagiCZ1: if you convert to unix time, truncate mod 60, 3600, or 86400 then this might get you closer
15:19	llasram	(inc EvanR)
15:19	lazybot	⇒ 2
15:20	llasram	Just what I was about to suggest
15:20	mwfogleman	(inc EvanR)
15:20	lazybot	⇒ 3
15:20	mgaare	SagiCZ1: you can also drop down to java, to set: .withMinuteOfHour
15:20	mr_rm	SagiCZ1: use the plus function?
15:20	mwfogleman	justin_smith: can you say more about how resolve is helpful in such a situation?
15:20	mgaare	SagiCZ1: joda has more stuff than clj-time exposes directly
15:20	SagiCZ1	EvanR: that's not a bad idea.. some math though :)
15:21	justin_smith	mwfogleman: it's a hack - resolve takes a keyword and returns the var it reresolves to, so you can call something that was not defined when your code was compiled
15:21	SagiCZ1	mgaare: sounds good
15:21	justin_smith	mwfogleman: it's a sign of bad design, but it can just make things work
15:21	EvanR	hopefully .withMinuteOfHour doesn't modify the Date object in place
15:22	SagiCZ1	doubt it.. isnt joda all about how traditional java date is horrible because it is mutable
15:22	mgaare	EvanR: it does not.
15:22	EvanR	SagiCZ1: to find the number of minutes between to timestamps, you do a time diff, which gives a number of seconds, and round to nearest 60 (div by 60, times 60)
15:22	EvanR	er, forget the times 60
15:23	EvanR	give or take one minute
15:23	mgaare	btw, cider's inspect functionality is great for this kind of thing
15:23	SagiCZ1	EvanR: i know i can find out the difference between two timestamps, but first i have to generate the other timestamps.. for example if i want to round to quarter hours, i have to take the timestamp i want to round, and generate the same timestamp with 00 15 30 45 minutes, then i can do the diff and find the minimal
15:24	mwfogleman	justin_smith: i tried to use resolve to get around the bug i was bumping into with user.clj and defrecord. it was not sustainable.
15:25	joshuafcole	Hmm you can get the minutes, take the mod of the interval as previously recommended, then scale it to 1 and round it
15:25	joshuafcole	to get the nearest
15:25	EvanR	SagiCZ1: what are the special times you are diffing against?
15:25	EvanR	quarter hours?
15:25	joshuafcole	(or just (> (mod minutes interval) (/ interval 2))
15:25	SagiCZ1	EvanR: they are passed as parameter.. it can be anything.. 1 minute, 5 minutes, 15 minutes, 1 hour, 5 hours, 1 week.. so on
15:26	EvanR	integer math on the seconds should work fine
15:26	joshuafcole	I think it still works without focusing on minutes if you use it as a timestamp like mentioned
15:26	EvanR	the next 15 minute timestamp after t is ((t / (15 * 60)) + 1) * (15 * 60)
15:27	EvanR	(integer division)
15:27	SagiCZ1	where t is number of seconds?
15:27	EvanR	yeah
15:27	csd_	,(let [m {:a {:aa 1 :ab 1} :b 2}] (assoc (:a m) :c {:b (:b m)}))
15:27	clojurebot	{:c {:b 2}, :aa 1, :ab 1}
15:27	justin_smith	mwfogleman: well, yeah, resolve would help with vars but I don't think it would help for classes
15:28	arrdem	Why is NaN not a reader sybol...
15:28	EvanR	SagiCZ1: the 15*60 can be your parameter, 1 minute is 60, 1 hours is 3600 etc
15:28	Bronsa	arrdem: it is in tools.reader :3
15:28	justin_smith	,Double/NaN
15:28	clojurebot	NaN
15:28	arrdem	Bronsa: and it is in Oxlang too :P
15:28	EvanR	SagiCZ1: "1 week" works, but note that "1 month" doesnt really
15:28	Bronsa	arrdem: also [+-]Infinity
15:29	llasram	Bronsa: yay!
15:29	EvanR	technically, neither does a year ;)
15:29	llasram	That one has also hit me in the past
15:29	SagiCZ1	EvanR: i am not sure i understand the formula, how did you come up with it?
15:29	SagiCZ1	EvanR: seems robust though
15:29	Bronsa	llasram: arrdem http://dev.clojure.org/jira/browse/CLJ-1074 vote!
15:29	arrdem	Bronsa: pretty much convinced this is worthless but sure
15:30	Bronsa	arrdem: me too but it never hurts
15:30	llasram	Bronsa: I need to remember what other tickets I voted for and remove my votes from there first....
15:30	EvanR	SagiCZ1: well, it relies on properties of integer division
15:30	Bronsa	llasram: I voted so many tickets my vote is worth nothing right now
15:31	TEttinger	EvanR, so it would need some changes from the / fn in clojure
15:31	EvanR	SagiCZ1: maybe you should study the formula (t / d) * d
15:31	rplaca	SagiCZ1: man, it seems a whole lot easier just to stay in joda time and not switch to unix time
15:31	EvanR	TEttinger: guess so
15:31	rplaca	joda time has all the primitives that you need
15:31	TEttinger	,(div 15 60)
15:31	clojurebot	#<CompilerException java.lang.RuntimeException: Unable to resolve symbol: div in this context, compiling:(NO_SOURCE_PATH:0:0)>
15:31	SagiCZ1	rplaca: really? i dont think you are correct.. since i need to handle kinds of time units
15:31	TEttinger	,(quot 15 60)
15:31	clojurebot	0
15:32	SagiCZ1	*all kinds of
15:32	EvanR	,(quot 1234 60)
15:32	clojurebot	20
15:32	EvanR	,(quot-rem 1234 60)
15:32	clojurebot	#<CompilerException java.lang.RuntimeException: Unable to resolve symbol: quot-rem in this context, compiling:(NO_SOURCE_PATH:0:0)>
15:32	SagiCZ1	rplaca: i would need to have different cases to call different functions if i wanted to stick to joda primitives
15:32	TEttinger	looks like quot is what we're after
15:32	EvanR	,(rem 1234 60)
15:32	clojurebot	34
15:32	rplaca	SagiCZ1: joda time has primitives for that, look at DateTimeFieldType
15:33	rplaca	and the use .withField
15:33	EvanR	rplaca: i think that makes his job harder
15:34	rplaca	SagiCZ1: do what feels best to you, though, but rounding to arbitrary units should be really easy
15:34	EvanR	"the next even time mod X" isnt just about zeroing out a field
15:35	rplaca	EvanR: of course. joda has aggregates.
15:36	SagiCZ1	the approach evanR suggested solves all overflows pretty well
15:36	rplaca	but if you feel more comfortable converting to seconds and rounding, go for it
15:37	justin_smith	woo, almost done verifying everything in lazybot/plugins/util.clj
15:37	success	how did you instsall cider?
15:37	mr_rm	will simple rounding work for cases like leap year, daylight savings time, etc?
15:37	EvanR	its not really rounding, but doing this field by field is like trying to do decimal arithmetic by specifically checking the ones place, tens places, etc rather than treating the numbers as an arithmetic field of their own, which timestamps are
15:37	arrdem	success: M-x package-install RET cider RET
15:37	EvanR	mr_rm: yes
15:37	success	nope
15:38	arrdem	success: you'll also need to add cider to your .lein/profile.clj
15:38	success	no match
15:38	arrdem	success: what emacs package repos do you have?
15:38	TEttinger	success, did you type out RET or actually hit newline?
15:38	success	hiw enter
15:38	TEttinger	k
15:39	andyf	Bronsa: arrdem: Alex Miller has said that he often looks at unweighted vote counts on tickets, too, so no need to unvote when voting unless you really want to
15:39	arrdem	Bronsa: yo do you still have ns->sym kicking around somewhere? I seem to have lost it
15:39	EvanR	mr_rm: leap years is a detail of a calendar, this is about time diffs. DST is about certain local times, but i assume hes doing this all in UTC
15:40	arrdem	Bronsa: nvm got it
15:41	Bronsa	andyf: yeah I don't unvote tickets
15:42	andyf	Bronsa: I look at those reports when I regenerate them, so was fully aware :-)
15:42	Bronsa	heh
15:44	mr_rm	EvanR: i missed part of the conversation so sorry if i missed the relevant pieces but it seems like zeroing out the low order fields and using clj-time.periodic does what he wants. or using the plus function after starting from (now). i wasn't sure what you were rounding
15:45	EvanR	mr_rm: which fields are the low order fields?
15:45	mr_rm	anything below the one he wants to use to iterate on
15:46	EvanR	seems like a roundable way to go about it
15:46	EvanR	roundabout
15:48	arrdem	Bronsa: andyf: is there an open ticket for Named over c.l.Namespace?
15:49	success	threading is with Java thread?
15:49	mr_rm	EvanR: it can be but then every leap year and every switch to and from DST seems to cause a lot of issues in large companies where i've worked. sometimes it's actually simpler to just use a well-debugged library.
15:49	EvanR	mr_rm: well, depending on what you think is supposed to happen during DST, my way might be more robust and obviously has less code
15:50	EvanR	attempting to operate on the mixed-base 6-place local time rep as if it was arithmetic could land you directly in an invalid or ambiguous time value
15:50	Bronsa	arrdem: didn't you open one this summer?
15:50	arrdem	Bronsa: that's Named over Vars
15:50	EvanR	mr_rm: and leap years do not apply at all
15:50	success	how would I override a java method from clojure?
15:51	Bronsa	arrdem: ah
15:51	cbryan	success: i would run through this great guide: braveclojure.com
15:51	andyf	arrdem: Not that I recall. Your ticket for Named on vars is the only one related to Named that comes to mind. Caveat: despite rumors to the contrary, I don't have all the tickets in my head :-)
15:51	Bronsa	arrdem: I don't think named over namespace makes sense either :P
15:51	Bronsa	arrdem: there's already ns-name
15:51	mr_rm	EvanR: depends on whether you are trying to manually roll over hours, months, years, etc. but if you're doing it manually you're probably doing it wrong :)
15:51	arrdem	(inc Bronsa)
15:51	lazybot	⇒ 66
15:52	EvanR	mr_rm: head scratch. if the question is how long until X, then theres no rolling over anythin
15:53	SagiCZ1	EvanR: so how would converting time from unix to some joda time handle leap years? why should that be an issue? i assumed it would just work
15:53	mr_rm	EvanR: well he did say he was trying to generate something like a periodic sequence from the current time
15:53	EvanR	SagiCZ1: so far, you havent seemed to need to convert from unix time to joda time
15:54	mr_rm	oh i see... nm... you're going from the epoch, moving it to and from a joda object
15:54	EvanR	SagiCZ1: heh, are you doing a recurring event calendar / scheduler ;)
15:54	SagiCZ1	EvanR: i tested the method you offered but it's not exactly what i need
15:55	SagiCZ1	for example this (align (t/date-time 1970 1 1 15 31) (* 60 5))
15:55	SagiCZ1	results in this #<DateTime 1970-01-01T15:36:00.000Z>
15:55	SagiCZ1	but when i specify period of 5 minutes, i mean 00 05 10 15 20 25 30 35 ... etc
15:55	EvanR	well, what i suggested wouldnt be doing that
15:56	SagiCZ1	https://www.refheap.com/92663
15:57	EvanR	you cant literally use /, thats floating point division
15:57	EvanR	try quot
15:58	SagiCZ1	EvanR: oh.. now its better
15:58	amalloy	SagiCZ1: are you doing something like https://github.com/flatland/chronicle ?
15:58	EvanR	align as you defined it would give you the next such timestamp, aligned to period, in UTC
15:58	arrdem	technomancy: is there a good trick for dropping a REPL in a plugin's dependency injected context rather than in the leiningen bootstrap context?
15:59	SagiCZ1	EvanR: it works well, thank you.. it looks very elegant and robust. i would introduce too many bugs if i went another way
15:59	SagiCZ1	(inc EvanR)
15:59	lazybot	⇒ 4
15:59	EvanR	that chronicle thing also looks good, letting the user specify something more complex
15:59	EvanR	but make sure you understand what happens during DST
16:00	EvanR	and days 29-31
16:00	SagiCZ1	amalloy: Actually, this is an alignement of candlesticks on a stock chart.. i need to always align the first candle to some whole number of periods
16:00	SagiCZ1	EvanR: i think the correct thing happens
16:01	EvanR	hehe the correct thing regarding period across dst change ;)
16:01	EvanR	whatever that is
16:01	EvanR	i think most crons do something unexpected, and no one cares
16:02	SagiCZ1	EvanR: i will test it in the production, no worries ;)
16:11	SagiCZ1	,(disj #{:A :B :D :W} #{:D :W :M})
16:11	clojurebot	#{:A :W :D :B}
16:12	SagiCZ1	why doesnt it remove :D and :W ?
16:12	llasram	(doc disj)
16:12	clojurebot	"([set] [set key] [set key & ks]); disj[oin]. Returns a new set of the same (hashed/sorted) type, that does not contain key(s)."
16:12	justin_smith	SagiCZ1: maybe you want clojure.set/difference
16:12	llasram	SagiCZ1: Try (apply disj ...)
16:12	noonian	SagiCZ1: because you are trying to remove an element which is a set
16:12	justin_smith	or that
16:13	SagiCZ1	oh i see.. thanks
16:17	TEttinger	,(apply disj #{:A :B :D :W} #{:D :W :M})
16:17	clojurebot	#{:A :B}
16:17	SagiCZ1	TEttinger: yeah, i used that
16:17	TEttinger	cool
16:20	mr_rm	(disj #{:A :B :D :W} :D :W :M)
16:20	mr_rm	,(disj #{:A :B :D :W} :D :W :M)
16:20	clojurebot	#{:A :B}
16:20	mr_rm	you are supposed to supply 1 or more keys after the set
16:20	EvanR	SagiCZ1: drawing markers are regular intervals comes up a lot when drawing guis, its easy with integer arithmetic. i just realized all that stuff has not much to do with time ;)
16:22	SagiCZ1	EvanR: i realized the formula is really elementary math, i hope i would be able to come up with that if i focused on unix time... yeah im glad there is incanter so i won't be drawing any ticks on axises by hand
16:30	success	can I not use println with recur?
16:30	SagiCZ1	success: how would you want to use it? println returns nil btw
16:32	success	if (cond) ((println val) (recur (+ val 1))) (println "done"))
16:32	justin_smith	success: you have an extra set of parens
16:32	amalloy	success: () is not a grouping construct; it calls functions
16:32	justin_smith	otherwise it looks decent
16:32	justin_smith	maybe you want (do ...)
16:32	SagiCZ1	try this (if (cond) (println val) (recur (+ val 1)) (println "done"))
16:33	justin_smith	depends if it should print before every recur, it's ambiguous
16:33	amalloy	SagiCZ1: no. (if cond (do (println val) (recur (inc val))) (println "done"))
16:34	amalloy	yes, i suppose SagiCZ1's is a possible interpretation. it seems unlikely to me, but it's not impossible
16:34	SagiCZ1	sorry, i meant it amalloy's way
16:37	success	http://lpaste.net/113712
16:37	success	the println i is never printed
16:37	success	and then i get a nullpointerexception
16:37	success	http://lpaste.net/113712
16:38	amalloy	success: the NPE is because main is trying to use () for grouping again
16:39	dbasch	success: you’re calling the value of (println …) which is nil
16:39	dbasch	actually run-thread
16:39	dbasch	no, println on run-thread
16:39	dbasch	(nil (run-thread))
16:40	success	so how should I do?
16:40	dbasch	success: why do you have that ( on line 25?
16:42	success	Ok that got rid of the nullpointer
16:42	success	but the value of i is never written
16:43	dbasch	success: you never increment i
16:43	noonian	success: thats because in thread-loop, you only recur if i equals 10, so i never is 10 and you just print done
16:44	success	hehe oops
16:44	success	now it works
16:44	dbasch	success: btw, you want dotimes in that situation
16:50	sdegutis	Are there any functionality in Clojure that can't be performed reliably when you deploy the app as an uberjar?
16:51	nestastubbs	reliably?
16:51	nestastubbs	not sur what that means
16:51	nestastubbs	crashes?
16:51	Glenjamin	you can't set jvm opts via project.clj
16:51	nestastubbs	you have to make sure you access resources and not files
16:52	noonian	thats the biggest thing i've ran into
16:52	borkdude	sdegutis logging to a directory outside resources
16:53	borkdude	just logging, to a configurable directory that is
16:54	Glenjamin	stdout 4 life
16:54	success	so how is STM better than locking? you cant have deadlocks?
16:55	SagiCZ1	success: there are no locks
16:56	sdegutis	When I asked that question, I had dynamic features in mind.
16:56	justin_smith	success: it can be faster, because in the common case there is no concurrent change so little overhead
16:56	sdegutis	Such as finding namespaces dynamically at runtime via constructed strings and loading them.
16:56	sdegutis	I am very fond of the convention-over-configuration approach and find it to be very senseful, thus I wish to applicate it to my website.
16:56	llasram	sdegutis: That will work fine as long as the namespace source is actually there
16:56	llasram	sdegutis: OTOH, ewwwwwww
16:57	success	justin_smith, you mean that most of the time when you use locks there will be very few times where it will actually block another thread but it still locks?
16:57	sdegutis	llasram: I too once preferred explicit-over-implicit as the Clojure community favors.
16:57	sdegutis	llasram: But over time, though, I have seen the merit in not writing nearly so much code.
16:57	success	is acquiring a lock expensive? isnt it just reading a bit or two?
16:58	justin_smith	success: a write that can be seen by other threads is expensive, the fewer of them the better
16:59	sdegutis	,(def transdeuce transduce)
16:59	clojurebot	#'sandbox/transdeuce
16:59	justin_smith	success: with a ref, you read, optimistically perform the calculation, compare, (set or retry) - there is only one cross thread visible write
16:59	dbasch	success: if you’re asking that question, you may want to read about locks http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lock_(computer_science)
17:00	sdegutis	,(transdeuce (comp (filter odd?) (map inc)) + (range 10))
17:00	clojurebot	30
17:01	sdegutis	From an API point of view, I don't see why (transduce) isn't just (reduce).
17:01	Glenjamin	(doc transduce)
17:01	clojurebot	"([xform f coll] [xform f init coll]); reduce with a transformation of f (xf). If init is not supplied, (f) will be called to produce it. f should be a reducing step function that accepts both 1 and 2 arguments, if it accepts only 2 you can add the arity-1 with 'completing'. Returns the result of applying (the transformed) xf to init and the first item in coll, then applying xf to that result and the 2nd item, etc. If
17:02	Glenjamin	sounds like reduce :s
17:02	justin_smith	except for the xform arg
17:02	Bronsa	sdegutis: there's no "transducer" type, reduce wouldn't be able to understand whether it had to act like transduce or like reduce
17:02	sdegutis	Ok.
17:05	SagiCZ1	is something wrong with
17:05	SagiCZ1	,(doall (concat (conj [1 2 3 4] 42) [99 101]))
17:05	SagiCZ1	?? can it do anything unexpectd? like not adding the [99 101] coll for some reason?
17:05	clojurebot	(1 2 3 4 42 ...)
17:05	SagiCZ1	,(doall (concat (conj [] 42) [99 101]))
17:05	clojurebot	(42 99 101)
17:07	noonian	,(doc concat)
17:07	clojurebot	"([] [x] [x y] [x y & zs]); Returns a lazy seq representing the concatenation of the elements in the supplied colls."
17:07	noonian	SagiCZ1: you don't need the doall unless you are printing it or something
17:08	noonian	you don't need to worry about lazy seqs losing data if thats what you are asking
17:09	SagiCZ1	noonian: i need the doall, because this call is in a recur and i was getting a stack overflow without it.. i guess the lazinnes was chaining and then tried to explode it in the end..... i found my mistake though, it was something else, thanks
17:10	amalloy	SagiCZ1: just use into instead of concat, and then the doall problem never arises
17:10	SagiCZ1	amalloy: cool, forgot about into
17:11	Bronsa	amalloy: gah I suck at regex
17:11	SagiCZ1	amalloy: into is also 6 times faster than doall concat
17:12	EvanR	gotta love constant factor speed up ;)
17:13	amalloy	Bronsa: do you know about the ?x flag? it can help you organize your thoughts a bit, by adding whitespace and comments to hairy regexes
17:14	amalloy	eg, https://github.com/Factual/drake/blob/develop/src/drake/core.clj#L34-L43
17:14	Bronsa	ah, nice
17:20	amalloy	i forget how you actually include a \space character in ?x mode, actually. i wonder if it's just `\ `
17:20	Glenjamin	[ ] ?
17:21	amalloy	,(re-find #"(?x)[ ]" " ")
17:21	clojurebot	#<SecurityException java.lang.SecurityException: denied>
17:21	Glenjamin	what
17:21	amalloy	WHAT
17:21	amalloy	&(re-find #"(?x)[ ]" " ")
17:21	lazybot	java.util.regex.PatternSyntaxException: Unclosed character class near index 6(?x)[ ] ^
17:21	amalloy	&(re-find #"(?x)" " ")
17:21	EvanR	regex security you know
17:21	lazybot	⇒ ""
17:21	amalloy	oops
17:21	Glenjamin	i guess it's not [ ]
17:21	amalloy	&(re-find #"(?x)\ " " ")
17:21	lazybot	⇒ " "
17:22	amalloy	Glenjamin: no, that would be no good. it's supposed to ignore whitespace so you can put it in whenever you want
17:23	Bronsa	arrdem: FYI not all dynamic Vars have :dynamic true :/
17:23	Bronsa	,(remove (comp :dynamic meta) (filter #(and (var? %) (.isDynamic %)) (vals (ns-map ns))))
17:23	clojurebot	(#'clojure.core/source-path #'clojure.core/command-line-args #'clojure.core/read-eval #'clojure.core/file #'clojure.core/use-context-classloader ...)
17:24	TimMc	Are those the early ones in core?
17:24	arrdem	Bronsa: I'll take a patch :P doing testing rn
17:24	Bronsa	TimMc: I believe those are the ones set as dynamic in Compiler.java or RT.java, I don't remember
17:25	arrdem	trying to coordinate three artifacts into simultaneous releases...
17:26	TimMc	,(filter #(and (var? %) (not (.isDynamic %)) (:dynamic (meta %))) (vals (ns-map ns)))
17:26	clojurebot	()
17:27	Bronsa	TimMc: :dynamic implies .isDynamic, it's the opposite that's not true
17:28	amalloy	Bronsa: well, you can go the other way as well, by altering the metadata to have dynamic after compilng the var as not-dynamic
17:28	amalloy	i don't know if that happens in clojure.core, but i've definitely seen people make that mistake
17:28	success	why is thread 1 only printing stuff? http://lpaste.net/113717
17:29	Bronsa	amalloy: you mean like (def a 1) (defn x [] a) (alter-meta! #'a assoc :dynamic true) ?
17:29	amalloy	Bronsa: yeah
17:29	Bronsa	ah, I guess that's easy to do with declare
17:30	justin_smith	success: the argument to Thread should be callable
17:31	arrdem	fuck yeah lein-grim totally works from 0.1.0 on Clojars
17:31	justin_smith	success: thread-loop is callable, but (thread-loop) does not return a callable I don't think
17:31	Bronsa	uhm, declare might not be problematic after all
17:31	arrdem	okay. Bronsa. you were telling me I'm wrong.
17:31	justin_smith	success: similarly with calling thread-1 with an arg
17:31	Bronsa	arrdem: was I?
17:31	arrdem	something dynamic vars...
17:31	Bronsa	arrdem: ah, pr incoming
17:32	justin_smith	success: so what is happening is that clojure runs your funciton - and the return value of that function is passed to Thread as its constructor argument
17:32	justin_smith	and I think you just want to pass the function itself as the constructor of the thread
17:33	justin_smith	in the case of (thread-1 r) #(thread-1 r) is a zero argument function that should do what you want
17:33	justin_smith	,'#(thread-1 r)
17:33	clojurebot	(fn* [] (thread-1 r))
17:34	Bronsa	arrdem: let me know if you want different indentation
17:34	arrdem	Bronsa: that makes no functional change.
17:35	arrdem	well unless you have a dynamic var with a fn value..
17:35	arrdem	fine
17:35	Bronsa	arrdem: I have no idea what that code is used for, feel free to reject the PR if it's useless :P
17:36	arrdem	Bronsa: it may be functionally dead code :P
17:36	success	justin_smith, ty that worked
17:37	Glenjamin	is there a good way to remove a single item from a vector?
17:37	SagiCZ1	what function would write datastructures to a file, so i could later load them back?
17:37	postpunkjustin	By value or index?
17:37	Bronsa	amalloy: altering :dynamic meta should still make isDynamic return true though, it's just that compiled code won't use it as a dynamic var
17:38	SagiCZ1	(some-write-foo {:a 0 :b 1} "filepath") --- > (def m (load "filepath"))
17:38	Glenjamin	by index ideally
17:39	justin_smith	success: np
17:39	justin_smith	SagiCZ1: (spit "some-file.edn" (pr-str data))
17:39	SagiCZ1	justin_smith: and the loading?
17:40	justin_smith	(clojure.edn/read-string (slurp "some-file.edn"))
17:40	SagiCZ1	justin_smith: thank you
17:40	justin_smith	np
17:40	amalloy	Glenjamin: best solution is time-travel back to before you decided to use vectors
17:40	amalloy	since they are not good at this
17:40	Glenjamin	i'm just pondering that myself
17:41	Glenjamin	this is for a todomvc sample for a cljs workshop
17:41	Glenjamin	so trying to keep things simple :s
17:41	amalloy	although, really, any time you use indexes in clojure is a giant honkin' code smell
17:41	Glenjamin	if i use a map/sorted-map then i have to generate keys
17:42	TEttinger	ordered map?
17:42	TEttinger	uses a lib, but hey
17:43	Glenjamin	i'd still need a key though
17:43	Glenjamin	i need append, random-access modify & random-access delete
17:44	Glenjamin	so map + key is probably sensible
17:44	EvanR	you dont have a key?
17:44	EvanR	is this some sort of queue of values
17:44	Glenjamin	its this: http://todomvc.com/examples/react/#/
17:44	EvanR	possible dups
17:45	{blake}	I'm trying to figure out how hiccup-bootstrap's wrap-bootstrap and include-bootstrap routines manage to point to a particular version of bootstrap (2.2.2) that I don't seem to actually have.
17:45	{blake}	I presume they must be pointing to somewhere on that Internet the kids are all hopped up on, but I can't figger it out.
17:45	EvanR	Glenjamin: so these todos, they are just strings. but surely theres some sort of key associated with them in this framework?
17:46	Glenjamin	i can make one, but there's nothing intrinsic, it's just a client demo
17:46	EvanR	ok
17:46	Glenjamin	i suppose in a server-driven app there'd be an autoinc, so i should do that
17:47	{blake}	What's especially weird is that hiccup-bootstrap-3 ALSO seems to point to 2.2.2, which makes me think that it must be something I've put in somewhere.
17:47	EvanR	and i would imagine a list of todos is... a list. but clojure may have its own sensibilities here. literally lists seem to be unpopular
17:48	Glenjamin	list would work, but edit/remove is then O(n), which implies lists aren't a great fit
17:48	EvanR	theres the presentation and the data storage, among others. they dont all have to be the same
17:50	SagiCZ1	justin_smith: i am getting Underadable form exception when trying to read the file
17:50	justin_smith	SagiCZ1: you probably put objects in the form that are not valid edn
17:50	Glenjamin	bah, now i need fmap
17:50	justin_smith	SagiCZ1: you may want to filter and turn unprintable objects into a placeholder?
17:50	justin_smith	SagiCZ1: some things just can't be read in by the clojure reader
17:50	SagiCZ1	justin_smith: oh i totally did.. joda timestamp object cant be serialized like this
17:50	amalloy	Glenjamin: eh? when are you mapping over a bunch of todos?
17:51	Glenjamin	tick-all
17:51	justin_smith	SagiCZ1: right, but a java.util.Date can be
17:51	SagiCZ1	cool
17:51	justin_smith	SagiCZ1: so you may want to convert before / after saving
17:51	Glenjamin	todos are apparently the worst data-structure
17:51	SagiCZ1	thanks, i could do that
17:51	justin_smith	Glenjamin: clearly a todo should be a prioqueue
17:51	justin_smith	s/todo/todo-list
17:52	EvanR	do you have to update the priority when inserting ?
17:52	SagiCZ1	justin_smith: btw is there a way to dynamicly find out if the object is unprintable?
17:52	EvanR	on a lot of elements?
17:53	Glenjamin	(defn fmap [f m] (reduce-kv (fn [k v] [k (f v)]) m m)) ; is that reasonable?
17:54	justin_smith	SagiCZ1: (try (read-string (prn x)) true (catch Exception _ false))
17:54	justin_smith	which is terrible because exceptions should not be control flow
17:54	justin_smith	but I can't think of any other reliable way to do it?
17:55	EvanR	check if it satisfies the printable interface
17:55	cespare	How can I detect whether something is a function for the purposes of multimethod dispatch?
17:56	noonian	cespare: you can use the fn? and ifn? functions, i'm not sure how that applies to multimethod dispatch
17:57	Bronsa	fn? is not that useful
17:58	justin_smith	EvanR: which interface is that?
17:58	cespare	can someone direct me to the docs for fn?
17:58	cespare	it's not really googleable
17:58	EvanR	justin_smith: yeah i dont know
17:58	noonian	,(doc fn?)
17:58	clojurebot	"([x]); Returns true if x implements Fn, i.e. is an object created via fn."
17:58	noonian	,(doc ifn?)
17:58	clojurebot	"([x]); Returns true if x implements IFn. Note that many data structures (e.g. sets and maps) implement IFn"
17:59	EvanR	Glenjamin: for insertion into a long list there is the finger tree based list, though im not sure if it applies to however your framework does lists
18:01	justin_smith	is there a way to check if a multimethod has an impl for a specific arg?
18:01	justin_smith	the thing wanted is the print-dup multimethod
18:01	amalloy	justin_smith: kinda. there's get-method, which usually turns out not to be what you want
18:03	justin_smith	(get-method print-dup java.util.Date)
18:03	justin_smith	,(get-method print-dup java.util.Date)
18:03	clojurebot	#<instant$fn__6393 clojure.instant$fn__6393@5a311d>
18:03	justin_smith	,(get-method print-dup Object
18:03	clojurebot	#<RuntimeException java.lang.RuntimeException: EOF while reading>
18:03	justin_smith	,(get-method print-dup Object)
18:03	clojurebot	nil
18:03	justin_smith	looks good!
18:04	Glenjamin	in case anyone was wondering, that was not a correct implementation of fmap
18:04	justin_smith	,(defn is-readable [x] (or (nil? x) (boolean (get-method print-dup (class x)))))
18:04	clojurebot	#'sandbox/is-readable
18:04	amalloy	haha, no, i guess it wasn't, was it, Glenjamin
18:04	justin_smith	,(is-readable (java.util.Date.))
18:04	clojurebot	true
18:04	amalloy	looked good, though
18:04	Glenjamin	very close
18:04	justin_smith	,(is-readable (Object.))
18:04	clojurebot	false
18:04	justin_smith	,(is-readable 1)
18:04	clojurebot	true
18:05	justin_smith	,(is-readable {)
18:05	clojurebot	#<RuntimeException java.lang.RuntimeException: Unmatched delimiter: )>
18:05	justin_smith	,(is-readable {})
18:05	clojurebot	true
18:05	Glenjamin	somewhere between the (reduce-kv) and the (into) version
18:05	justin_smith	EvanR: looks like the above def for is-readable is the right thing
18:05	amalloy	justin_smith: you're assuming that printable things are also readable? that's questionable
18:05	justin_smith	amalloy: print-dupable
18:05	justin_smith	that's the point of print-dup
18:06	EvanR	justin_smith: wasnt it "is printable" ?
18:06	EvanR	what is "fmap" ?
18:06	justin_smith	EvanR: anything can be printed, we want the things that can be read in again from a pr form
18:06	Glenjamin	(defn fmap [f m] "Given a map `m`, apply `f` to each value, maintaining keys" (reduce-kv (fn [acc k v] (assoc acc k (f v))) m m))
18:06	Glenjamin	,(defn fmap [f m] "Given a map `m`, apply `f` to each value, maintaining keys" (reduce-kv (fn [acc k v] (assoc acc k (f v))) m m))
18:06	clojurebot	#'sandbox/fmap
18:07	amalloy	mmmm, print-dup is very rarely used, justin_smith
18:07	amalloy	usually it's just print-method
18:07	Glenjamin	(fmap inc {:a 1 :B 2})
18:07	Glenjamin	,(fmap inc {:a 1 :B 2})
18:07	justin_smith	amalloy: it's the basis for prn
18:07	clojurebot	{:B 3, :a 2}
18:07	amalloy	justin_smith: no it's not
18:07	justin_smith	amalloy: he was talking about using prn to a file
18:07	justin_smith	$source clojure.core/pr-on
18:07	lazybot	clojure.core/pr-on is http://is.gd/jApwbc
18:08	amalloy	right. and print-dup is ~never set to true, so it always goes to print-method
18:08	justin_smith	oh
18:09	amalloy	,(binding [print-dup true] (prn [1 2 3]))
18:09	clojurebot	[1 2 3]\n
18:09	amalloy	,(binding [print-dup true] (prn {1 2}))
18:09	clojurebot	#=(clojure.lang.PersistentArrayMap/create {1 2})\n
18:09	justin_smith	ahh, OK
18:09	amalloy	some of these #= methods emitted by print-dup don't even work anymore. the code has moved on, methods in clojure.lang have been renamed, but the print-methods remain
18:10	justin_smith	thanks, so I guess there is no good heuristic for whether a value could be read in after prn
18:10	amalloy	justin_smith: no, not really. i mean, print-dup isn't a terrible guess
18:11	dbasch	justin_smith: I don’t have all the context, but why would you want to “serialize” via prn?
18:12	justin_smith	dbasch: to output a data structure as edn
18:12	amalloy	dbasch: it's kinda the default way to serialize stuff
18:13	dbasch	I usually serialize stuff via java objectoutputstream
18:13	amalloy	for srs?
18:13	dbasch	usually = the few times I needed to serialize huge maps
18:33	justin_smith	.clojure-version
18:33	anybot	⇒ {:major 1, :minor 7, :incremental 0, :qualifier "alpha1"}
18:33	justin_smith	WOO
18:33	justin_smith	lazybot working with clojure 1.7 and the updated irclj
18:33	justin_smith	without clojail failing
18:34	justin_smith	@botsnack
18:34	anybot	justin_smith: Thanks! Om nom nom!!
18:34	arrdem	@botsmack
18:35	justin_smith	@guards
18:35	anybot	SEIZE HIM!
18:35	arrdem	@gourds
18:36	justin_smith	I think I haven't fixed and whitelisted the "silly" plugin yet
18:36	justin_smith	@bf ++++++++[>++++[>++>+++>+++>+<<<<-]>+>+>->>+[<]<-]>>.>---.+++++++..+++.>>.<-.<.+++.------.--------.>>+.>++.
18:36	anybot	{:ptr 6, :cells {6 10, 5 33, 4 87, 3 100, 2 72, 1 0, 0 0}}
18:36	anybot	[72 101 108 108 111 32 87 111 114 108 100 33 10]
18:36	anybot	Hello World!
18:37	justin_smith	(depending on definitions of silly)
18:37	arrdem	lols
18:37	amalloy	there's only one silly plugin?
18:37	justin_smith	amalloy: why of course!
18:38	justin_smith	amalloy: so I had some issues where refs were treated as associative (I think this is a clj version thing?) but clojail just worked
18:38	amalloy	justin_smith: refs treated as associative?
18:38	justin_smith	in lazybot's codebase
18:38	amalloy	you mean like, (get (ref 1) 0)?
18:39	justin_smith	like (get (ref {:a 0}) :a)
18:39	amalloy	i don't think that's worked in any version of clojure
18:39	justin_smith	or maybe something else entirely was going on...
18:39	justin_smith	yeah, probably
18:39	amalloy	it might just be a coincidence
18:39	amalloy	like, lazybot does that, and it fails silently, but everything keeps working
18:39	justin_smith	I probably misunderstood the source of some bug
18:39	postpunkjustin	I've seen something like that work before with refs
18:39	postpunkjustin	It was weird and upsetting.
18:40	amalloy	@bf +[]
18:40	postpunkjustin	But it was definitely a ref pointing to a map that was being implicitly dereferenced
18:40	anybot	Execution timed out.
18:40	justin_smith	amalloy: it's here https://github.com/Raynes/lazybot/blob/master/src/lazybot/irc.clj#L19 irc is a ref
18:40	amalloy	aw, good boy, anybot. i wasn't sure if that was inside the timeout context
18:41	justin_smith	amalloy: it's all inside the timeout context :)
18:42	justin_smith	postpunkjustin: thanks for the validation - I was lost in the version update bugs when it happened
18:42	dbasch	@bf >++++++++++>>+<+[[+++++[>++++++++<-]>.<++++++[>--------<-]+<<]>.>[->[
18:42	dbasch	<++>-[<++>-[<++>-[<++>-[<-------->>[-]++<-[<++>-]]]]]]<[>+<-]+>>]<<]
18:42	postpunkjustin	,(let [foo (ref {:bar "baz"})] (foo :bar))
18:42	clojurebot	"baz"
18:42	Bronsa	justin_smith: look what you've done now
18:42	dbasch	@bf >++++++++++>>+<+[[+++++[>++++++++<-]>.<++++++[>--------<-]+<<]>.>[->[<++>-[<++>-[<++>-[<++>-[<-------->>[-]++<-[<++>-]]]]]]<[>+<-]+>>]<<]
18:42	justin_smith	dbasch: Caused by: java.lang.Exception: invalid commands: missing ]
18:42	justin_smith	haha
18:42	justin_smith	Bronsa: sorry
18:43	arrdem	lol
18:43	anybot	Execution timed out.
18:43	arrdem	Bronsa: hey man it's just fun with a stack machine :D
18:43	arrdem	what to name a test artifact...
18:43	amalloy	justin_smith: what makes you think irc-map is a ref there? it should be the dereffed value
18:44	justin_smith	amalloy: it may be an incompatibility with what we got back from irclj now that I think about it
18:44	amalloy	but it's certainly rather muddy and i can believe the wrong thing might be happening
18:44	Bronsa	wtf refs are actually IFn like Var
18:44	Bronsa	TIL
18:44	dbasch	arrdem: cattiest fart
18:44	postpunkjustin	Yeah, I have no idea why refs implement IFn but atoms do not
18:44	justin_smith	arrdem: the ark of foo
18:45	Bronsa	postpunkjustin: I wouldn't wish atoms implemented IFn tbh
18:45	arrdem	heh
18:46	postpunkjustin	I agree! But I think the inconsistency is even worse.
18:46	justin_smith	&(let [a (ref {:a 0})] (a :a))
18:46	postpunkjustin	I hate this: ,(let [foo (ref {:bar "baz"})] (foo :bar))
18:46	lazybot	⇒ 0
18:46	Bronsa	well I guess I'll continue to ignore refs as I've done til now
18:46	justin_smith	postpunkjustin: jynx
18:46	postpunkjustin	haha
18:46	amalloy	Raynes: we should remove the brainfuck plugin. that implementation from rosetta code doesn't look super good
18:46	postpunkjustin	but yours worked. I'm not super familiar with this lazybot thing.
18:46	Bronsa	yeah well, they are IFn but not ILookup or IKeywordLookup or whatever the interface
18:47	Raynes	amalloy: We should remove like all of them
18:47	justin_smith	postpunkjustin: ##(println "hi")
18:47	anybot	⇒ hi nil
18:47	lazybot	⇒ hi nil
18:47	justin_smith	haha
18:47	Bronsa	lol
18:47	bbloom_	amalloy: too bad you can't have a befunge plugin. would need 2D irc input
18:47	amalloy	bbloom_: i would rather have a snusp interpreter. more fun than befunge
18:48	arrdem	OOH QUICK DOES anybot ignore lazybot?
18:48	bbloom_	http://esolangs.org/wiki/SNUSP
18:48	bbloom_	craziness ^^ amalloy
18:48	justin_smith	amalloy: there is a syntax extension to haskell that looks remarkably like snusp
18:48	justin_smith	haha
18:48	arrdem	##(println "##(println :foo)")
18:48	anybot	⇒ :foo nil
18:48	lazybot	⇒ :foo nil
18:48	arrdem	damnit
18:49	amalloy	bbloom_: i know. https://github.com/amalloy/clusp
18:49	arrdem	well played bots, well played
18:49	bbloom_	amalloy: haha weee
18:49	justin_smith	arrdem: there may be some trick you could pull with int / char conversion and building the trigger string
18:49	amalloy	wrote that on the plane back from the 2011 conj, iirc
18:49	justin_smith	or even just str to fool the regex
18:49	joshuafcole	justin_smith: http://scrambledeggsontoast.github.io/2014/09/28/needle-announce/ ?
18:49	bbloom_	amalloy: a befunge interpreter was one of my first C programs
18:50	arrdem	##(println \# \# "(println :foo)")
18:50	anybot	⇒ # # (println :foo) nil
18:50	lazybot	⇒ # # (println :foo) nil
18:50	arrdem	##(println (str \# \# "(println :foo)"))
18:50	anybot	⇒ ##(println :foo) nil
18:50	lazybot	⇒ ##(println :foo) nil
18:50	anybot	⇒ :foo nil
18:50	lazybot	⇒ :foo nil
18:50	arrdem	HAHA
18:50	arrdem	I wonder if you could quine that..
18:50	justin_smith	joshuafcole: yeah, that is the one
18:51	joshuafcole	Looked fun to play with, though I imagine refactoring it in a text-based interface might not be. :)
18:51	Raynes	arrdem: I will hurt you physically.
18:51	justin_smith	joshuafcole: that's the kind of code where you want a point-and-click editor for sure
18:51	arrdem	Raynes: if you fly out to Texas to do so, beer's on me
18:51	Raynes	That's illegal.
18:51	Raynes	I'm calling the cops.
18:52	arrdem	<3 Raynes
18:52	justin_smith	Raynes: ##(println clojure-version)
18:52	anybot	⇒ {:major 1, :minor 7, :incremental 0, :qualifier alpha1} nil
18:52	Raynes	<3
18:52	joshuafcole	He's got you there, this chat room is logged and you just offered alcohol to a minor.
18:52	lazybot	⇒ {:major 1, :minor 4, :incremental 0, :qualifier nil} nil
18:52	Raynes	Literally got the FBI on the line right now
18:52	amalloy	##(println (str \# \# "(println :foo)"))
18:52	anybot	⇒ ##(println :foo) nil
18:52	lazybot	⇒ ##(println :foo) nil
18:52	Raynes	Also, I'm not a minor.
18:52	anybot	⇒ :foo nil
18:52	Raynes	Just (dec 21)
18:52	amalloy	arrdem: lazybot ignores anybot now
18:52	amalloy	you were too slow
18:52	justin_smith	heh
18:52	arrdem	amalloy: lol
18:53	arrdem	amalloy: I have yet to write my own quine anyway 's k
18:53	amalloy	$logout
18:53	lazybot	You've been logged out.
18:53	technomancy	incf
18:53	technomancy	oops, wrong window
18:54	justin_smith	really, a bot should probably have an ignore on #".*bot$"
18:54	technomancy	you didn't see that
18:54	amalloy	justin_smith: that sounds like it would lead to a scunthorpe problem
18:54	mwfogleman	anyone doing exercism in clojure?
18:55	justin_smith	mwfogleman: I've had some fun on 4clojure, but not actively doing it now
18:55	justin_smith	oh, exirorcisms, I misread
18:55	mwfogleman	justin_smith: no worries. that's http://exercism.io/
18:56	mwfogleman	i've done a bunch of 4clojure, although i too have stopped for now.
18:56	postpunkjustin	I've done some exercism problems
18:56	postpunkjustin	It was fun, but there's not much activity there on the Clojure side, which makes it kind of sad
18:56	amalloy	mwfogleman: the fact that i can't see anything useful on their website without logging in means i will just never do anything there
18:57	amalloy	it's great that they support github login, i was very pleased to see that. but it's just user-unfriendly to make me log in right away
18:57	dbasch	amalloy: it says that you can check out the command line client if you don’t want to log in
18:57	amalloy	yes, i saw that too
18:58	amalloy	but that's about ninety times harder than clicking a link
18:58	mwfogleman	amalloy: yes, their ui is pretty cruddy. still, it's already a great companion to 4clojure (implicit hat tip)
18:58	dbasch	amalloy: I’d expect the exercises to be 100x harder than checking out the cli
18:58	dbasch	or I’d be disappointed
18:58	amalloy	that's okay. if i go to that site it's because i want to do exercises, or at least to read them
18:59	amalloy	i don't want to clone some github project and run code i know nothing about
18:59	mwfogleman	amalloy: they are careful to prevent you from looking at code for problems you haven't solved yet
18:59	mwfogleman	**solutions to
18:59	dbasch	amalloy: also you can donate money without logging in
18:59	amalloy	hah
19:00	mwfogleman	anyway, i just asked because i'm working on the beer problem and was wondering if anyone had finished it.
19:00	dbasch	mwfogleman: you have a beer problem?
19:00	amalloy	the problem of someone having finished your beer?
19:00	mwfogleman	i knew that was coming. generating x-y verses of the song 99 bottles of beer.
19:00	mwfogleman	e.g. 99 to 0
19:02	klyed2	...but don't you go to the store and buy some more?
19:02	anybot	java.lang.RuntimeException: Unable to resolve symbol: ..but in this context
19:02	amalloy	go home, anybot, you are drunk
19:02	mwfogleman	:D
19:02	amalloy	srsly though justin_smith, i'd rather you didn't bring in-development versions of lazybot in here except for the briefest of demos. i test mine out in #4clojure or #()
19:02	justin_smith	OK
19:03	amalloy	thanks. the default config conflicts with lazybot and clojurebot bindings, as you saw
19:03	justin_smith	amalloy: it was going to be a brief demo and then the whole part the channel part kind of slipped my mind
19:04	amalloy	yeah
19:04	amalloy	i forget why now, but i have my lazybot instance set its nick to buttered-toast
19:05	dbasch	amalloy: so that it lands butter-side down?
19:05	justin_smith	I don't really plan on running it long term, really this is about updating the clojure version / irclj version so lazybot is better at staying online
19:06	amalloy	yeah
19:06	dbasch	amalloy: semi-relevant https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Z8yW5cyXXRc
19:09	amalloy	ugh, i left my lazybot-dev configuration at my last job
19:10	justin_smith	I bet they were all like "anybody lose a lazybot?" and then nobody claimed it and then it ended up in the drawer with the left-behind tupperware
19:11	justin_smith	every workplace has that drawer, right?
19:11	justin_smith	$dict hello
19:11	lazybot	justin_smith: interjection: Used to greet someone, answer the telephone, or express surprise.
19:11	justin_smith	TIL
19:12	amalloy	i'm surprised you managed to get by for so long without knowing about "hello"
19:12	justin_smith	$dict foo
19:12	lazybot	justin_smith: noun: A metasyntactic variable used to represent an unspecified entity. If part of a series of such entities, it is often the first in the series, and followed immediately by bar.
19:13	dbasch	$dict dict
19:13	lazybot	dbasch: noun: A saying; a dictum.
19:13	joshuafcole	I think lazybot wins this round
19:13	dbasch	$dict dictum
19:13	lazybot	dbasch: noun: An authoritative, often formal pronouncement: "He cites Augustine's dictum that 'If you understand it, it is not God'” ( Joseph Sobran).
19:13	dbasch	lazybot has spoken
19:14	justin_smith	$should I keep demonstrating random lazybot commands?
19:14	lazybot	justin_smith: Very doubtful.
19:14	justin_smith	OK
19:15	amalloy	justin_smith: i like the unix-jokes
19:16	justin_smith	especially because they are easy to find accidentally
19:16	amalloy	usually it's just echo and ls that get triggered in here
19:16	amalloy	but the one time someone actually typed "mutt"...that was glorious
19:17	joshuafcole	Built in unix jokes?
19:17	{blake}	OK, so, it looks like both bootstrap and bootstrap-3 link to a particular web version of bootstrap rather than a local one.
19:17	joshuafcole	Time to get this running in #lighttable so I have something to banter with
19:17	{blake}	Though I still don't see where.
19:18	{blake}	Oh, wait, they include their own versions which are hidden. Duh.
19:18	{blake}	Crap.
19:19	{blake}	I wonder how disastrous it would be to shoehorn 3.3 in there.
19:20	justin_smith	$will ##(do :it :yes) evaluate?
19:20	lazybot	justin_smith: It is certain.
19:20	lazybot	⇒ :yes
19:26	TEttinger	$will ##(doto (JFrame. "Minor Annoyance") (.setSize 400 300) (.setVisible true)) spawn a window?
19:26	lazybot	TEttinger: My sources say no.
19:26	lazybot	java.lang.IllegalArgumentException: Unable to resolve classname: JFrame
19:26	TEttinger	$will ##(doto (javax.swing.JFrame. "Minor Annoyance") (.setSize 400 300) (.setVisible true)) spawn a window?
19:26	lazybot	TEttinger: Outlook good.
19:26	lazybot	java.awt.HeadlessException: No X11 DISPLAY variable was set, but this program performed an operation which requires it.
19:27	TEttinger	ha
19:27	joshuafcole	it was doing so well
19:27	justin_smith	nice try
19:27	TEttinger	it spawned one on my lapserver before I fixed the vulnerability using clojail
19:27	TEttinger	I can send you the changes I made, if you want it to run on non-headless servers
19:30	justin_smith	TEttinger: just tried that, it did seem to create a jframe, but I don't see it anwhere
19:30	TEttinger	weird
19:30	TEttinger	it might have deleted it
19:30	justin_smith	https://www.refheap.com/92669
19:31	TEttinger	can you def, currently? like with clojurebot
19:31	justin_smith	nope, security exception
19:32	amalloy	that feature does exist in clojail, lazybot just doesn't enable it
19:32	justin_smith	TEttinger: it's on ##anyone if you want to poke at it, but that's where I am testing so expect banal spammy stuff in that room
19:32	justin_smith	(and frequent bot reboots, of course)
19:35	justin_smith	amalloy: do you recall what the "embedded" plugin does? I got a weird error when I try input based on trying to reverse engineer what the regex expects
19:36	amalloy	justin_smith: it's supposed to let you do commands like $will inline
19:37	amalloy	like uh, $#will this work?#$, i dunno if it's enabled in lazybot
19:37	justin_smith	yeah, the version I have macroexpands to a form which calls second with two args and just stacktraces
19:38	justin_smith	,(macroexpand '(->> x second (-> @bot :config :prepends first str) (assoc irc-map :message) registry/try-handle))
19:38	clojurebot	(registry/try-handle (assoc irc-map :message (-> (clojure.core/deref bot) :config :prepends first ...)))
19:39	amalloy	yeah. it looks broken
19:39	justin_smith	,(macroexpand '(-> (clojure.core/deref bot) :config :prepends first str (second x)))
19:39	clojurebot	(second (str (first (:prepends (:config (clojure.core/deref bot))))) x)
19:39	amalloy	which is fine, nobody uses it or wants to
19:39	justin_smith	heh
19:43	justin_smith	$addfortune You would have inherited a larg sum, but the will was stored in mongodb.
19:43	lazybot	Fortune cookie eaten.
19:44	justin_smith	$fortune
19:44	lazybot	Difficulty at the beginning usually means ease at the end...except in bed
19:45	joshuafcole	Ah, good point lazybot
19:45	dbasch	justin_smith: but mongodb is a document store, it doesn’t get much more document-y than a will
19:45	joshuafcole	I think I'll write my next webserver in whitespace
19:46	justin_smith	dbasch: it was meant to be a bit of cleverness about "fortune" and the way the fortunes are stored
19:46	amalloy	justin_smith: s/larg/large, though
19:47	dbasch	justin_smith: :)
19:48	justin_smith	oops!
20:16	razum2um1	how can i insert macros-1 into another macros-2 expanding 1st with for 2nd' given body?
20:19	justin_smith	razum2um1: did you use a macro to construct that question?
20:20	dbasch	is this a meta question about the two previous questions?
20:20	justin_smith	razum2um1: can you rephrase that? I had a hard time parsing the question
20:21	razum2um1	justin_smith: https://gist.github.com/razum2um/16e285945288089dd07a
20:22	dbasch	razum2um1: why is the first one a macro?
20:24	razum2um1	dbasch: it's simplification, it's way longer ))
20:24	razum2um1	but the aim is the same, i want to have try-safe version of the m1
20:27	dbasch	razum2um1: post the whole code, because as it is there isn’t enough information
20:27	dbasch	or at least a reproducible case
20:49	justin_smith	amalloy: Raynes: do you guys know anything about this socrates api in lazybot? lazybot.plugins.knowledge - did it ever work? where does one look for an api key? I'll keep moving on to check other plugins, but I am at a loss with that one
20:50	Raynes	It did work
20:50	amalloy	justin_smith: Raynes wrote that, i think. he probably committed his API key to github at least once
20:50	justin_smith	heh
20:50	Raynes	Die in a fire
20:50	Raynes	I don't think I did write that one
20:50	Raynes	Anyways
20:50	Raynes	Don't worry about it
20:50	amalloy	"die in a fire" is probably his current password
20:50	Raynes	If it were it'd be in github somewhere by now.
20:50	justin_smith	Raynes: OK, just doing due dilligance before calling this done
20:51	TEttinger	hm, let's check this against lazybot
20:51	TEttinger	,(doto (java.awt.Robot.) (.keyPress java.awt.event.KeyEvent/VK_CONTROL) (.keyPress java.awt.event.KeyEvent/VK_C) (.keyRelease java.awt.event.KeyEvent/VK_CONTROL))
20:51	clojurebot	#<CompilerException java.lang.ExceptionInInitializerError, compiling:(NO_SOURCE_PATH:0:0)>
20:52	amalloy	hm, weird. the current lazybot instance does have a username and password for $know, but when i ask him questions he just times out
20:52	TEttinger	##(doto (java.awt.Robot.) (.keyPress java.awt.event.KeyEvent/VK_CONTROL) (.keyPress java.awt.event.KeyEvent/VK_C) (.keyRelease java.awt.event.KeyEvent/VK_CONTROL))
20:52	lazybot	java.lang.SecurityException: You tripped the alarm! clojail.testers.ClojailWrapper@474528f5 is bad!
20:53	TEttinger	nice
20:53	amalloy	$know who is the current president?
20:53	lazybot	Execution timed out.
20:54	hiredman	~apropos president
20:54	clojurebot	President of Chile is a Presidential office. (http://www.freebase.com/view//m/0hqlf)
20:56	nestastubbs	confused by the state of clojure results, specifically "what has been most frustrating"
20:56	nestastubbs	future staffing concerns?
20:56	nestastubbs	language viable over long term?
20:57	nestastubbs	availability of editors?
20:58	nestastubbs	there is no shortage of hackers who want to learn clojure, and there are good ones out there too
20:58	nestastubbs	I guess hiring QA, and support staff?
21:14	arrdem	nestastubbs: "good hackers" are not always cultural/budget fits :P
21:14	amalloy	nor are there a limitless supply of them
21:21	yedi	so what do yall think of boot
21:21	amalloy	seems good if your feet would otherwise get wet
21:23	dbasch	amalloy: but you’d need two, or exceptional hopping skills
21:24	yedi	-______-
21:25	dbasch	yedi: why the long face?
21:25	yedi	hahahhah aiight that gets a pass
21:25	amalloy	+b dbasch
21:31	amalloy	reiddraper: i have a generator that produces a list of things, like integers, and then i'm fmapping a function over that generator, which just maps over those integers and inc's them all. however, i now want to insert an arbitrary letter after each number which is divisible by ten (silly simplification, not my actual generator)
21:31	amalloy	i see how i could do this by switching from fmap to bind, and then reducing over the list with more calls to bind, most of which just terminate in return, but some of which use a generator for letters
21:33	amalloy	but that seems like an awful lot of manual plumbing in the calls to bind. is there something like (sequence :: (Monad m) => [m a] -> m [a]), such that i can just mapcat over the list, returning N generators, and let sequence bind them together for me?
21:36	amalloy	man, sequence is the first dang function in clojure.test.check.generators. but i didn't notice it because it's private
21:37	amalloy	okay well thanks for writing it; consider this a feature request to expose it, i guess
21:40	kenrestivo	someone has written an alternative to lein? :-0
21:52	Raynes	kenrestivo: lol we did that once
21:54	Raynes	We called it cack or cork or something like that
22:09	justin_smith	$max
22:09	lazybot	The most users ever in #clojure is 831
22:11	rpaulo	that's a lot of people
22:23	justin_smith	$metacritic movie alien-re-release
22:23	lazybot	I'm a little drunk. Can't find my keys.
23:21	dgellow	hi guys
23:22	dgellow	is there a way to pprint from within a defrecord method ?
23:24	sm0ke	dgellow: using `pprint` directly has problems?
23:24	amalloy	dgellow: i mean, you just call pprint like you would anywhere. is there something you've tried that doesn't work?
23:25	sm0ke	dgellow: you would need to import it though
23:25	sm0ke	i think its only available in repl, not in core ##(pprint 1)
23:25	lazybot	java.lang.RuntimeException: Unable to resolve symbol: pprint in this context
23:25	dgellow	Yeah, i'm already using pprint but I cannot see any output
23:27	justin_smith	sm0ke: that's because you have to require or use pprint
23:27	gfredericks	dgellow: are you sure it's an issue with defrecord?
23:27	justin_smith	,(use 'clojure.pprint)
23:27	clojurebot	nil
23:27	sm0ke	justin_smith: yes thats what it said
23:27	dgellow	…
23:27	amalloy	my guess is your code is running on some other thread which doesn't have out bound to anything
23:28	sm0ke	or may be he is printing nil
23:28	dgellow	I'm using pprint. it works. But, when I'm using it from within a method implemented in a defrecord, I cannot see any output. I think there is something to do with the stdout ?
23:28	justin_smith	dgellow: is this running in a thread other than your top level repl thread?
23:29	dgellow	amalloy: How can I check that, as I cannot pprint out ?
23:29	gfredericks	(.println System/out ...) is one way
23:29	justin_smith	out is thread local
23:29	gfredericks	you can also do side-effecty things with atoms, for example
23:30	gfredericks	,(def my-outs (atom [])) (then later) (swap! my-outs conj out)
23:30	clojurebot	#'sandbox/my-outs
23:31	sm0ke	dgellow: does normal `print` works?
23:33	dgellow	sm0ke: nop
23:34	sm0ke	dgellow: how about a `log/info` if you have it?
23:35	sm0ke	and for record reloading new changes into a running rep wont work
23:37	justin_smith	dgellow: you should be able to explicitly pass in or bind out (for example in the way gfredericks suggests, or make it an argument passed to the function) and then use (binding [out out-target] ...) or use the optional second arg (pprint val out-target)
23:38	sm0ke	i highly doubt the code is being reached at all, why would the stdout be not binded
23:38	justin_smith	sm0ke: it is common for it to be bound to a place you are not looking
23:38	justin_smith	especially in emacs, for example
23:39	justin_smith	and println / pprint don't use stdout, they use out, which is a dynamic var, these things act can unintuitively when you have threads
23:40	sm0ke	,out
23:40	clojurebot	#<StringWriter >
23:41	sm0ke	yeah well it is better to use loggers, but if its simple enough case this should not happen
23:41	sm0ke	you are assuming he is using emacs and spwaning threads
23:42	justin_smith	emacs is an example - any env where you aren't directly in the owning console can have the same issue
23:43	justin_smith	and yes, I could be wrong, just suggesting a way to deal with it if that is the case
23:44	quizme	Is it possible to use defmethod to make clojure.data.json/write-str to know how to print clj-time.core/now ?
23:44	justin_smith	quizme: there is a protocol you can extend
23:44	justin_smith	quizme: or you can convert the value to a java.util.Date - it knows how to handle that iirc
23:45	quizme	justin_smith: ow... how do i do it by extending the protocol ?
23:46	justin_smith	https://github.com/dakrone/cheshire/blob/master/src/cheshire/generate.clj#L17
23:46	justin_smith	cheshire.generate.JSONable
23:46	justin_smith	has one method, to-json
23:47	justin_smith	there is a convenience function for that: https://github.com/dakrone/cheshire/blob/master/src/cheshire/generate.clj#L229
23:47	justin_smith	add-encoder
23:47	nestastubbs	oh, that reminds me
23:47	nestastubbs	Anyone have a nice clj abstraction for a event based JSON parser?
23:48	nestastubbs	kinda like SAX for JSON
23:48	nestastubbs	the idea is to manipulate parts of a stream of json without having to parse it all into a clojure object
23:48	justin_smith	nestastubbs: cheshire can parse streams lazily
23:49	nestastubbs	lazily won't quite cut it here
23:49	justin_smith	parse-stream
23:49	justin_smith	OK
23:49	nestastubbs	I want to avoid consing massive objects
23:49	nestastubbs	I eventually have to pass the entire stream thru, so lazy won't do it
23:49	sm0ke	nestastubbs: how do you define a `part` in json without actually parsing it?
23:50	nestastubbs	don't treat it as an object, treat is a a sequence of transition events
23:50	justin_smith	nestastubbs: tigris does stream-to-stream escaping https://github.com/dakrone/tigris
23:51	nestastubbs	objec_start, key, sep, value ... object_end ....
23:52	nestastubbs	the idea is you pass thru the events (which have the original string attached to them
23:52	sm0ke	intriguing idea
23:52	nestastubbs	and only muck with the ones you want to change
23:52	nestastubbs	so, if it's a key i want to filter out, I ditch that key event, and then the sep and value event after it...
23:52	sm0ke	but is still think you have parsd it already when you say "objec_start, key, sep, value ... object_end ...."
23:53	nestastubbs	that's a sequence of events, not a list itself
23:53	nestastubbs	you ever used a SAX parser for XML?
23:53	nestastubbs	it's like that
23:53	nestastubbs	SAX parsers didn't produce ELEMENT objects
23:53	nestastubbs	anyways, we throw around large JSON documents, I need one. I guess I'll write one
23:54	nestastubbs	the cost of parsing, manipulating, and then re-JSONing is high
23:54	nestastubbs	same reason why I don't use enlive for large HTML documents
23:54	nestastubbs	use JSoup instead, way faster
23:54	sm0ke	yep i got that part but not quite convinced how you will get those events just by reading a json string
23:55	nestastubbs	by writing a parser?
23:55	sm0ke	nestastubbs: :D
23:55	sm0ke	doesnt that defeat the whole purpose
23:56	nestastubbs	well, I suppose it's really more of a lexer
23:56	nestastubbs	haha
23:56	nestastubbs	actually, a lexer would be sufficient
23:57	sm0ke	yep then a regex-seq should be good enough
23:57	nestastubbs	wonder if writing it in ragel would be performant
23:57	nestastubbs	speaking of regex-seq...
23:58	nestastubbs	re-seq would not be sufficient