2014-11-17
| 00:08 | justin_smith | danielcompton: yeah, that's a pain - I guess you could post a bug report for each one :) |
| 00:09 | danielcompton | justin_smith: each REPL environment or each library? |
| 00:09 | cfleming | danielcompton: Cursive actually does this when AOT compiling, but fiddling with the output of people's REPLs is a sensitive topic :) |
| 00:10 | justin_smith | danielcompton: each library |
| 00:10 | cfleming | justin_smith: It should be possible to hide them in the REPL I think. |
| 00:11 | justin_smith | sure :) I was being somewhat glib |
| 00:12 | cfleming | Hehe, sorry, that got lost in IRC static :) |
| 00:15 | arrdem | yay http://conj.io unbroken! |
| 00:15 | danielcompton | arrdem: new grimoire home? |
| 00:16 | arrdem | danielcompton: well the both point to the same VM :P |
| 00:16 | arrdem | but yeah |
| 00:16 | danielcompton | arrdem: how about http://conj.it |
| 00:16 | ghadishayban | working on reflection "linking" right now, hope i can get it working before the conj |
| 00:16 | arrdem | lol |
| 00:16 | Jaood | arrdem: at first I though you were linking to a clojure conference ;) |
| 00:17 | arrdem | ghadishayban: we're finally online at once :P |
| 00:17 | danielcompton | or http://putamapon.it |
| 00:17 | ghadishayban | i.e. only incur reflection once |
| 00:17 | arrdem | ghadishayban: TL;DR no Oxcart never did actual function inlining itself |
| 00:17 | danielcompton | ghadishayban: how can you only reflect once? |
| 00:17 | arrdem | ghadishayban: the most I ever got working was static method/arity linking. |
| 00:17 | justin_smith | ghadishayban: oh, nice, self-modifying reflection :) |
| 00:17 | ghadishayban | danielcompton: rewrite the callsite with invokedynamic |
| 00:18 | justin_smith | that is nicely meta |
| 00:41 | danielcompton | what's a clojure programmers favourite song? |
| 00:42 | danielcompton | https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=R_uwZZB5Yv0 |
| 00:42 | danielcompton | fn pig, aka fan pig |
| 00:59 | arrdem | '; |
| 00:59 | arrdem | &'; |
| 00:59 | lazybot | ⇒ ; |
| 00:59 | arrdem | :; |
| 00:59 | arrdem | &:; |
| 00:59 | lazybot | ⇒ :; |
| 01:00 | arrdem | &(let [; 1] (+ ; ; ;)) |
| 01:00 | lazybot | ⇒ 3 |
| 01:03 | TEttinger | ,(map int "(let [; 1])") |
| 01:03 | clojurebot | (40 108 101 116 32 ...) |
| 01:03 | TEttinger | ,(map int "[; 1])") |
| 01:03 | clojurebot | (91 894 32 49 93 ...) |
| 01:03 | TEttinger | 894 eh? |
| 01:04 | TEttinger | ,(char 894) |
| 01:04 | clojurebot | \; |
| 01:04 | arrdem | Greek question mark |
| 01:04 | TEttinger | ha! |
| 01:04 | arrdem | conveniently rendered using effectively the same glyph as our old friend ##(int \;) |
| 01:04 | lazybot | ⇒ 59 |
| 01:24 | cfleming | ghadishayban: Looking forward to seeing that working! |
| 01:25 | cfleming | Unicode must open up a whole world of phishing possibilities. |
| 01:25 | arrdem | oh yes |
| 01:25 | arrdem | it's pretty scary |
| 01:31 | Kneiva | cfleming & arrdem: I get these nice spam mails: http://kneiva.raah.fi/unicode.png |
| 01:31 | arrdem | le sigh... |
| 01:31 | arrdem | Grimoire 0.3.9b live |
| 01:32 | arrdem | minor formatting changes, three PRs and a not trash text/plain 404 page for cider-grimoire |
| 01:32 | arrdem | looong overdue on that one |
| 01:37 | engblom | Is there any companion library to Quil for getting widgets? I would want to place things like input boxes and buttons on a Quil canvas. |
| 01:37 | engblom | Or is there any other library giving you a chance to do both animation and placing widgets? |
| 01:39 | kenrestivo | more of a java question than a clojure question, but is there an equivalent in java/clojure to POLLPRI ? i.e. to block waiting for priority data from a file descriptor? |
| 01:40 | kenrestivo | i discovered AsynchronousFileChannel, but not sure if it is the right thing |
| 01:42 | justin_smith | kenrestivo: I am thinking something using WatchService https://docs.oracle.com/javase/7/docs/api/java/nio/file/WatchService.html |
| 01:43 | kenrestivo | will look, thanks. i gotta say, you seem to know the JVM pretty thoroughly. |
| 01:43 | kenrestivo | must have spent a lot of time in the java salt mines. |
| 01:43 | danielcompton | cfleming: I think the browsers have put a fairly tight leash on using unicode in URL's |
| 01:44 | justin_smith | kenrestivo: I am a compulsive reader of docs... |
| 01:44 | justin_smith | kenrestivo: and I often try to do odd things, looking for the tool that will do it |
| 01:46 | justin_smith | I decided to work with watcherservice when I was contributing to ToBeReplaced java.nio wrapper - I wanted something actually useful to be there to go with the directory watching, so I needed to figure out that API |
| 02:02 | ghadishayban | time for bed. just got the one-time reflector working |
| 02:06 | justin_smith | zerkms: hell, I could consume more than that with one line of C if I tried :) |
| 02:06 | justin_smith | zerkms: in all seriousness, yes, clojure uses quite a bit of RAM as a baseline |
| 02:06 | zerkms | seems like I will not finish my program then |
| 02:07 | zerkms | I expected to really use it in production |
| 02:07 | zerkms | but 100+mb per container is too much |
| 02:07 | zerkms | especially keeping in mind it will run on 100+ containers |
| 02:07 | justin_smith | zerkms: why do you need multiple clojure instances running on one machine? |
| 02:07 | zerkms | which is 10+gb of ram in total |
| 02:07 | justin_smith | zerkms: isolating parts of a clojure program is trivial |
| 02:07 | zerkms | they are in different openvz containers |
| 02:08 | justin_smith | zerkms: and this is something that couldn't be done by isolating parts of a single clojure server process? |
| 02:08 | zerkms | I don't understand what you say ;-) |
| 02:09 | zerkms | what "isolating" means here? |
| 02:09 | justin_smith | zerkms: that's what openvz is for, right? isolating processes? I find I can isolate things effectively within one clojure process. |
| 02:09 | justin_smith | thanks to default immutibility, for starters |
| 02:09 | zerkms | openvz isolates resources yep |
| 02:10 | zerkms | so the task - it's ~100 VMs and every needs its own copy of long living program (which I supposed to implement in clojure for fun) |
| 02:10 | justin_smith | OK, so multiple vms is a premise here |
| 02:10 | zerkms | yep |
| 02:11 | justin_smith | then yeah, clojure probably isn't a great fit. You can get OCaml's memory footprint very small, if you are looking for alternatives with similar featuresets (and don't need in-process concurrency) |
| 02:11 | zerkms | what about scala? |
| 02:11 | zerkms | I don't want to do that in python |
| 02:12 | justin_smith | scala is also a memory hog |
| 02:12 | zerkms | that sucks :-( |
| 02:12 | justin_smith | do you have something against OCaml? |
| 02:13 | zerkms | I haven't seen a single line of code for it |
| 02:13 | justin_smith | it's in the ml family, not super far from haskell in it's basic syntax |
| 02:13 | zerkms | ml is more or less acceptable |
| 02:13 | justin_smith | but less theoretical / faster compiling / smaller footprint |
| 02:14 | zerkms | these days I read purely functional data structures, that uses standard ml as a syntax |
| 02:14 | zerkms | with basic erlang/haskel syntax knowledge I understand it without issues |
| 02:14 | justin_smith | the thing is that in ocaml to do threading you need multiple processes running really. Which is annoying. But the programs are small, so it balances out a bit. |
| 02:15 | justin_smith | but if you want one big program, with many threads, and good immutible behavior, and awesome jvm interop, do try clojure |
| 02:15 | zerkms | what about haskell then? |
| 02:15 | justin_smith | clojure is awesome |
| 02:15 | justin_smith | haskell is more of a mem / cpu hog than ocaml |
| 02:16 | zerkms | clojure is awesome indeed |
| 02:16 | shem | what about racket? |
| 02:16 | justin_smith | Racket's decent too, yeah. But not as good performance wise as clojure, not to mention ocaml. |
| 02:17 | zerkms | in my env dummy hello world + (read-line) clojure app takes 65 mb |
| 02:18 | justin_smith | not surprised, yeah, like most other langs, in order to run anything at all you need the full compiler resident in memory |
| 02:18 | justin_smith | *like most other lisps |
| 02:18 | justin_smith | heh |
| 02:20 | shem | racket's compiled, isn't it? and typed racket seems clean and easy to use |
| 02:20 | shem | which is why i've been eyeing it |
| 02:21 | shem | but the syntax seems clunkier than clojure |
| 02:23 | justin_smith | shem: does it have a tree-shaking compiler? |
| 02:24 | justin_smith | shem: clojure compiles all code too. It just doesn't know how to drop unused parts of itself. |
| 02:24 | shem | justin_smith: right. i haven't looked that closely. |
| 02:25 | arrdem | the price of a single pass compiler... |
| 02:25 | engblom | Racket has two things better than Clojure: Better GUI libraries and compilation to native code. |
| 02:25 | arrdem | ish |
| 02:28 | justin_smith | engblom: well, chicken scheme has a native code compiler too, it still doesn't perfrom well at all |
| 02:29 | justin_smith | native-code can mean a lot of things once you are generating the code programatically |
| 02:29 | engblom | That is very true. |
| 02:29 | arrdem | gon store all my values on the stack |
| 02:29 | justin_smith | hehe |
| 02:29 | arrdem | fast 'cause native, right? |
| 02:30 | engblom | Racket, however, is fast. |
| 02:30 | Jaood | afaik distributing a racket executable is like distributing java app excutable where the jvm is bundled in |
| 02:30 | Jaood | racket compiles to bytecode |
| 02:31 | engblom | I still prefer Clojure over Racket, even though I am no expert in either. Clojure is easier if you have some kind of Haskell background. I really like lazy programming languages. |
| 02:31 | Jaood | engblom: clojure is not really lazy |
| 02:32 | justin_smith | Jaood: lazy functions are more common in core clojure libs / idiomatic clojure code than in racket though |
| 02:32 | engblom | ,(take 5 (iterate inc 1)) |
| 02:32 | clojurebot | (1 2 3 4 5) |
| 02:33 | engblom | That was pretty lazy, in my opinion. |
| 02:34 | justin_smith | racket has a lazy flavor available http://docs.racket-lang.org/lazy/ |
| 02:34 | justin_smith | looks pretty comprehensive actually, it's just not the default |
| 02:34 | Jaood | justin_smith: yeah, I meant . Clojure’s laziness does not serve the same purpose as Haskell |
| 02:35 | Jaood | In Clojure, laziness is restricted to sequences, with the rest of the language and its data structures being otherwise entirely “eagerly” evaluated. |
| 02:35 | justin_smith | Jaood: except for promise / delay maybe? |
| 02:36 | justin_smith | though writing your code with a delay on every value and a deref on every usage would get very tedious |
| 02:38 | Jaood | justin_smith: don't think so, laziness in clojure is not used much for controlling execution flow like in haskell, its more of a process data thing in clojure |
| 02:40 | justin_smith | Jaood: not saying it is typically used the same way, just saying it could be used to have the same semantics. Like when I have a let block and don't want certain parts of it evaluated depending on complex conditions, but I don't want to turn it into multiple let blocks, I can use delay |
| 02:41 | engblom | If you need both a canvas for animations and widgets (buttons, input boxes), what libraries are the best options. I was coding with Quil yesterday and really liked it, but I would need some widgets too. I would love to be able to put some widgets floating over a Quil animation. |
| 02:42 | justin_smith | Jaood: actually, looking at those docs, it looks like lazy-racket is more of a lazy lang in the way you are talking about |
| 02:43 | Jaood | justin_smith: that would be dangerous in clojure since since lazy sequences may be batched as a performance optimization |
| 02:43 | Jaood | making the realization of items run ahead of consumption |
| 02:44 | justin_smith | Jaood: yeah, I was not talking about using lazy-seqs to delay evaluations there |
| 02:45 | justin_smith | ,(def d (delay (do (println 42) 0))) |
| 02:45 | clojurebot | #'sandbox/d |
| 02:45 | justin_smith | that's guaranteed not to run until deref |
| 02:45 | justin_smith | ,@d |
| 02:45 | clojurebot | 42\n0 |
| 02:45 | justin_smith | ,@d |
| 02:45 | clojurebot | 0 |
| 02:48 | Jaood | justin_smith: yeah, I see you what mean there |
| 02:48 | justin_smith | definitely clumsier than a lazy language |
| 02:49 | Jaood | justin_smith: right, I was addressing engblom's statement about haskell |
| 02:50 | justin_smith | aha, I just connected the dots, seeing your point above more clearly |
| 03:28 | justin_smith | TIL a nice trick for reading from a fifo, where multiple programs may be writing to the fifo with pauses in between: (apply concat (repeatedly #(line-seq ...))) |
| 03:34 | fairuz | Hi guys, is it possible to have something like (defn foo [x a b] (def x (..computation between a and b here))). And I can call foo like this (foo abc 1 2) so in the end I will get a symbol called abc with some values? |
| 03:34 | justin_smith | fairuz: a macro can do that, a defn no |
| 03:35 | zerkms | but it sounds dirty isn't it? |
| 03:35 | fairuz | justin_smith: ok |
| 03:37 | justin_smith | zerkms: def<foo> forms are popular |
| 03:38 | justin_smith | zerkms: maybe more popular than they should be... |
| 03:39 | fairuz | actually I want to use this for my "seeding initial data" code. I'm thinking to have something like this http://pastebin.com/cNnPwrWE where the first 2 lines will create 2 nodes in the database and the third line will link the former nodes. |
| 03:39 | justin_smith | ,(->> 'clojure.core ns-publics keys (map name) (filter #(.startsWith % "def")) (clojure.string/join " ")) |
| 03:39 | clojurebot | "deftype defstruct definline definterface default-data-readers defn defmethod defonce defn- defprotocol defmacro defmulti defrecord" |
| 03:39 | fairuz | I'm still thinking how I can approach this |
| 03:41 | justin_smith | fairuz: why not a let block instead of def? |
| 03:42 | TEttinger | ugh... I'm hitting a block with trying to get leiningen to compile a java main class that calls clojure code |
| 03:42 | stain | perhaps better let Maven build Java code |
| 03:43 | TEttinger | the thing is the clojure isn't built yet that the java needs to call |
| 03:43 | justin_smith | ,(->> (all-ns) (mapcat (comp keys ns-publics)) (map name) (filter #(.startsWith % "def")) (remove #(.startsWith % "default")) (clojure.string/join " ")) |
| 03:43 | clojurebot | "deftype defstruct definline definterface defn defmethod defonce defn- defprotocol defmacro defmulti defrecord" |
| 03:44 | TEttinger | I'm trying to figure out why Packr fails on clojure projects with a -main fn written in clojure, but works on java main methods |
| 03:45 | TEttinger | https://github.com/libgdx/packr/issues/33#issuecomment-62863164 |
| 03:46 | fairuz | So my first approach is to use EDN something like in the paste bin, then the first line will actually insert into database and normally it will give me reference. So I want to store this reference inside a1. |
| 03:46 | fairuz | Same thing for the second line |
| 03:47 | justin_smith | fairuz: OK. this can all be done in a let block. def is for creating globals |
| 03:48 | justin_smith | clojure is not like js or scheme where def creates local bindings |
| 03:52 | justin_smith | (let [a1 {:action 'create 'a1 {:val1 111 :val2 222}} a2 {:action 'create 'a2 {:val1 111 :val2 222}} a3 {:action 'link 'a3 {:nodeA a1 :nodeB a2}}] a3) |
| 03:52 | justin_smith | ,(let [a1 {:action 'create 'a1 {:val1 111 :val2 222}} a2 {:action 'create 'a2 {:val1 111 :val2 222}} a3 {:action 'link 'a3 {:nodeA a1 :nodeB a2}}] a3) |
| 03:52 | clojurebot | {:action link, a3 {:nodeA {a1 {:val1 111, :val2 222}, :action create}, :nodeB {a2 {:val1 111, :val2 222}, :action create}}} |
| 03:54 | fairuz | oh ok |
| 03:55 | fairuz | looks good! |
| 03:56 | justin_smith | also, may I suggest {:name 'a1 :data {:val1 111, val2 222}} - this form is much easier to work with |
| 03:56 | justin_smith | or you can even lift the data... |
| 03:56 | justin_smith | {:name 'a1 :val1 111 :val2 222} |
| 03:57 | justin_smith | and then you can do ##(group-by :name [{:name 'a1 :val1 111} {:name 'a2 :val 122}]) |
| 03:57 | lazybot | ⇒ {a1 [{:name a1, :val1 111}], a2 [{:name a2, :val 122}]} |
| 03:57 | justin_smith | and other related nice operations |
| 03:58 | fairuz | Let me read this carefully first :) |
| 03:58 | justin_smith | of course |
| 04:02 | fairuz | hm sorry. I'm still confused. :) So with this it's possible if I have {:name 'a1 :val1 111 :val2 222} |
| 04:03 | fairuz | then my function will process this, e.g put 111 and 222 in the database, and get back the reference and put it in a1? |
| 04:03 | justin_smith | what scope should this a1 have? |
| 04:04 | fairuz | Only in this file/function |
| 04:04 | fairuz | I just want to reuse a1 in the other lines |
| 04:06 | justin_smith | then I think you want something like (defn foo [] (let [a1 (create {...}) a2 (create {...}) a3 (link a1 a2)] ...)) |
| 04:06 | fairuz | Since it will be run only once (it's for initial graph data loading) |
| 04:06 | fairuz | Can let [a1 (create {...}) a2 (create {...}) a3 (link a1 a2)] ... comes from a file? |
| 04:06 | fairuz | let say EDN? or something more practical taht you can suggest |
| 04:06 | justin_smith | sure |
| 04:07 | justin_smith | though if you want it all to come from a file you probably just want to do a reduce or walk on the file |
| 04:09 | fairuz | I'm not really sure what read-string from edn uses |
| 04:09 | fairuz | Do you mean to reduce/map them once I read using read-string of edn? |
| 04:10 | justin_smith | ,(reduce (fn [db datum] (assoc db (:name datum) {:data datum})) {} '[{:name a1 :data [0 1 2]} {:name a2 :data "hello"} {:name a3 :links [a1 a2]}]) |
| 04:10 | clojurebot | {a3 {:data {:name a3, :links [a1 a2]}}, a2 {:data {:name a2, :data "hello"}}, a1 {:data {:name a1, :data [0 1 2]}}} |
| 04:10 | justin_smith | yeah |
| 04:10 | justin_smith | so imagine if above, instead of calling assoc, I was running some db insertion |
| 04:10 | justin_smith | and perhaps looking for a :links key, and inserting that link in the db if it was there... |
| 04:11 | justin_smith | and you can get this all from a simple (read-string (slurp "data.edn")) of course |
| 04:14 | fairuz | nice! |
| 04:15 | fairuz | I'll try to make a simple working thing :) |
| 04:17 | justin_smith | fairuz: in fact, reduce is better for a purely functional example for above, but for side-effecting db inserts, doseq may be much clearer |
| 04:17 | fairuz | Both doing the same thing? |
| 04:19 | justin_smith | ,(doseq [e '[{:name a1 :data [0 1 2]} {:name a2 :data "hello"} {:name a3 :links [a1 a2]}]] (print ['i (:name e) [(:data e)] [(:links e)]])) |
| 04:19 | clojurebot | [i a1 [[0 1 2]] [nil]][i a2 [hello] [nil]][i a3 [nil] [[a1 a2]]] |
| 04:19 | justin_smith | doseq returns nil |
| 04:19 | justin_smith | it only runs for side effects |
| 04:19 | justin_smith | so you could imagine instead of printing a vector that starts with 'i it ran an insert |
| 04:21 | fairuz | ok |
| 04:21 | TEttinger | https://github.com/libgdx/packr/issues/33 so this issue only seems to show up when bundling JREs with uberjars made by lein. |
| 04:22 | fairuz | A lot to digest |
| 04:22 | justin_smith | fairuz: sure. How would you usually do this in a language you know well? |
| 04:25 | fairuz | This is quite new since I'm doing this initial data loading for a graph database. The only experience I had with loading a graph database is with a tree-like data structure. So you just need to know the parent (to link the child with the parent). In this case, the initial data file is quite easy, I just make an xml with the child as the sub tag of the parent tag. |
| 04:25 | fairuz | The problem here it's no more a tree-like structure, siblings can have links between them |
| 04:26 | justin_smith | fairuz: have you heard of "adjacency list" graph representation? |
| 04:26 | justin_smith | http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Adjacency_list |
| 04:26 | fairuz | justin_smith: um nope |
| 04:27 | fairuz | ah |
| 04:27 | fairuz | so I want to have something like that. So my idea is to first to create all the nodes. (to get their references) |
| 04:27 | fairuz | Then link them using the references |
| 04:28 | justin_smith | your input could like like [{:name 'a :arrows '[b c]} {:name 'b :arrows '[b a]}] etc. |
| 04:28 | justin_smith | right |
| 04:28 | fairuz | Yep |
| 04:28 | fairuz | that's how I want to proceed |
| 04:28 | fairuz | That's why I need to create the references first |
| 04:28 | fairuz | the re-use it after |
| 04:30 | justin_smith | so I would first (doseq [key (map :name data)] (insert key)) then (doseq [datum data] (make-links (:name datum) (:arrows datum))) |
| 04:30 | justin_smith | and later you may add other keys if the links or nodes need to carry their own info... |
| 04:35 | fairuz | Ok. I'm still struggling reading clojure code, so bare with me. heh |
| 04:35 | fairuz | It's getting easier though, which is good |
| 04:41 | fairuz | Thanks for the help justin_smith |
| 06:25 | crisptrutski | is there a function to see all protocols a type or instance is extending? as opposed to `extenders` available in the other direction |
| 06:28 | crisptrutski | trying to understand the difference between `indexed?` and `sequential?`, and why the former is only in clojurescript and not clojure |
| 06:50 | r4vi | what's a sensible way of doing the inverse of a reduce. I want to reduce a list of functions over a value. value will get passed through each function then the result to the next. kind of like (f3 (f2 (f1 v))) but I have vec with all the functions in [f1 f2 f3] |
| 06:52 | ucb | r4vi: juxt |
| 06:52 | ucb | ,(doc juxt) |
| 06:52 | clojurebot | "([f] [f g] [f g h] [f g h & fs]); Takes a set of functions and returns a fn that is the juxtaposition of those fns. The returned fn takes a variable number of args, and returns a vector containing the result of applying each fn to the args (left-to-right). ((juxt a b c) x) => [(a x) (b x) (c x)]" |
| 06:53 | ucb | oh, right, misread your question |
| 06:54 | ucb | r4vi: you can use -> or reduce over the vector of fns? |
| 06:54 | r4vi | i was thinking reduce too |
| 06:54 | ucb | (-> v f1 f2 f3) is quite readable too |
| 06:55 | r4vi | hmm yes |
| 06:55 | ucb | or would it be (-> (f1) (f2) ...)? |
| 06:55 | ucb | I forget. |
| 06:55 | ucb | I rarely use -> myself |
| 06:55 | ucb | if you have the fns in a vector already, I'd reduce over it |
| 06:57 | r4vi | ,(doc reduce) |
| 06:57 | clojurebot | "([f coll] [f val coll]); f should be a function of 2 arguments. If val is not supplied, returns the result of applying f to the first 2 items in coll, then applying f to that result and the 3rd item, etc. If coll contains no items, f must accept no arguments as well, and reduce returns the result of calling f with no arguments. If coll has only 1 item, it is returned and f is not called. If val i... |
| 06:57 | r4vi | I can't figure out how to get the value to reduce across the functions if I used reduce |
| 06:58 | ucb | (reduce (fn [x f] (f x)) v [f1 f2 f3]) should do the trick I think |
| 06:59 | ucb | ,(reduce (fn [x f] (f x)) 0 [inc inc inc]) |
| 06:59 | clojurebot | 3 |
| 06:59 | ucb | yuppe |
| 07:02 | r4vi | nice thanks |
| 07:34 | rus` | hello guys, could you suggest some good book on Clojure? |
| 07:35 | rus` | ebook maybe, so I can start earlier |
| 07:36 | mearnsh | ~books |
| 07:36 | clojurebot | books is http://www.pragprog.com/titles/shcloj/programming-clojure |
| 07:36 | mearnsh | ~book |
| 07:36 | clojurebot | book is books |
| 07:37 | mearnsh | rus`: what's your programming background |
| 07:37 | rus` | mearnsh: Common Lisp |
| 07:38 | mearnsh | Joy of Clojure might be a good choice then |
| 07:40 | mearnsh | it's faster paced than most but if you're familiar with CL you'll be fine. it's a great book |
| 07:41 | rus` | mearnsh: excellent, thanks! and there is a foreword by Steve Yegge for additional entertainment |
| 07:41 | m1dnight_ | I'm trying to play around with the clojure bot but I can't seem to find the list of command prefixes? |
| 07:41 | m1dnight_ | Is it in the database? |
| 09:00 | engblom | Is anyone here able to tell how I set up an own clojurebot? |
| 09:00 | engblom | There seem to be no documentation boundled with the source. |
| 09:01 | clgv | engblom: if I remember correctly, lazybot has more information available |
| 09:02 | clgv | until he started aging lazybot was the cooler one anyway ;) |
| 09:02 | clgv | &(clojure-version) |
| 09:02 | lazybot | ⇒ "1.7.0-alpha1" |
| 09:02 | clgv | oh interesting |
| 09:02 | engblom | clgv: Yes, lazybot seem to be quite easy to install but requires a mongodb server. I would not be willing to set up this for just a bot. |
| 09:02 | clgv | he seems to have had a rejuvenation potion recently |
| 09:03 | agarman | engblom: mongodb is a 2 minute setup |
| 09:04 | rweir | then years of regret |
| 09:04 | clgv | :D :P |
| 09:04 | clojurebot | Excuse me? |
| 09:05 | clgv | didn't you find rweir's comment funny?? |
| 09:05 | lazybot | clgv: Uh, no. Why would you even ask? |
| 09:05 | engblom | agarman: It is not the work I am against. I am sure it is less work to set up mongodb and lazybot than to get clojurebot to work. It is just that I do not want one service more running on my shell server... |
| 09:06 | clgv | engblom: well you write the maintainer of clojurebot to get more information |
| 09:06 | clgv | engblom: sql? that is so 2000s ;) :P |
| 09:07 | clgv | engblom: clojurebot has a setup.sh and example.config - those should help right? |
| 09:08 | agarman | engblom: mongodb is about the same level of complexity of sqllit |
| 09:09 | engblom | clgv: setup.sh is for setting up a chroot environment. example.config is good to have but I do not know what to rename it to unless I begin plowing through the sources. |
| 09:10 | clgv | engblom: so the easiest way seems to be asking hiredman |
| 09:10 | engblom | agarman: With simple I did not necessary mean less complex. I meant more that it does not require any service running. sqlite is just a library using a file as database. |
| 09:10 | agarman | yeah, mongodb doesn't embed |
| 09:14 | justin_smith | clgv: I updated lazybot to fix its downtime issues, figured I would try updating the clojure version while I was at it, and amazingly enough, it just worked |
| 09:15 | justin_smith | I don't own the repo, I just submitted a huge PR |
| 09:16 | clgv | justin_smith: so you are lazybot's fountain of youth ;) |
| 09:16 | clgv | justin_smith: good job |
| 09:17 | clgv | ,(clojure-version) |
| 09:17 | clojurebot | "1.7.0-master-SNAPSHOT" |
| 09:17 | clgv | clojurebot could be more specific ;) |
| 09:17 | clgv | or is it really tracking bleeding edge master? |
| 09:19 | Guest4839 | hey i'm trying out clojure for the first time |
| 09:19 | mgaare | welcome panther_ |
| 09:19 | panther_ | i know about haskell, ml, and racket |
| 09:20 | mgaare | you should be in good shape then |
| 09:20 | agarman | panther_: clojure will be closest to racket |
| 09:21 | panther_ | racket was pretty cool. i also tried scala but it was too slow (JVM) |
| 09:21 | panther_ | racket, clojure :: lisp dialects |
| 09:21 | agarman | panther_: Clojure is also JVM |
| 09:21 | agarman | panther_: was it the Scala compiler that was too slow, or the running code? |
| 09:22 | panther_ | i just typed 3+1 or something like that into the REPL and it took many seconds to return the result |
| 09:22 | panther_ | i wasn't doing anything crazy like a qsort function |
| 09:22 | agarman | panther_: Scala brings up a REPL prompt quickly, but the first few commands are slow |
| 09:23 | clgv | panther_: that sounds weird. especially as an argument that the language is too slow... |
| 09:23 | panther_ | oooh |
| 09:23 | panther_ | thanks |
| 09:23 | agarman | panther_: when I was doing Scala work, I just hit enter 3 or 4 times after starting the REPL |
| 09:23 | agarman | and that was usually enough to get it going |
| 09:23 | panther_ | i see. Well then i will not judge a language on its first few tries |
| 09:23 | clgv | agarman: is that already some kind o f design pattern? :P |
| 09:24 | panther_ | thanks |
| 09:24 | mgaare | you have to beat scala like a donkey |
| 09:25 | agarman | panther_: but I wouldn't recommend Scala as its implicits make the language arbitrarily complex. And the version to version upgrade is the worst I've ever experienced in a language |
| 09:26 | panther_ | i feel really stupid right now because i'm trying out a language on windows. |
| 09:26 | panther_ | my Linux laptop contains most of my dev stuf |
| 09:39 | H4ns | what would be the best way to track line numbers in an input data file while reading it? i would like to use edn or clojure as syntax in the files, so line-wise reading does not help me too much. |
| 09:42 | stuartsierra | H4ns: maybe Clojure's LineNumberingPushbackReader |
| 09:43 | H4ns | stuartsierra: i've found that, but then got lost in a maze of classes and interfaces and very slim documentation. thanks for pointing me back :) |
| 09:46 | stuartsierra | H4ns: You're welcome. It's not a public part of Clojure, so you won't find any docs, but it shouldn't be too hard to figure out what it's doing from the source. |
| 09:46 | stuartsierra | There's probably a similar line-numbering reader in some (documented) Java library. |
| 09:47 | stuartsierra | Like Apache Commons I/O or Guava. |
| 09:49 | H4ns | stuartsierra: i could steal the usage from https://github.com/dwysocki/lojic/blob/37fc2623f5fb280cf47c38cf2c271015b85e8e82/src/lojic/core.clj#L17, thanks! |
| 09:55 | ordnungswidrig | H4ns: https://docs.oracle.com/javase/7/docs/api/java/io/LineNumberReader.html |
| 10:39 | jobx | Are core.async threads similar in memory size to Golang's threads, excluding JVM startup, ie. additional threads? |
| 10:40 | clgv | jobx: afair the use java threads managed by a threadpool - so threads are reused |
| 10:41 | jobx | clgv: Does this make core.async threads more efficient then? |
| 10:41 | jobx | clgv: I'm new to the JVM |
| 10:42 | clgv | clgv: no idea what golang does. |
| 10:42 | clgv | jobx: ^^ |
| 10:44 | clgv | jobx: but on average there is no overhead due to thread creation. there is only a synchronized queue involved |
| 10:44 | jobx | clgv: Any idea how much RAM per thread? |
| 10:45 | clgv | jobx: no. but you have only a constant number of threads |
| 10:47 | csd_ | What's the best way for me to perform a println that involves concating strings that are built up across several line, including conditionals and inside do statements? |
| 10:47 | jobx | clgv: Hmm, don't quite get it as I read core.async was similar to Golang's lightweight goroutines which can be generated in the 1000's quite cheaply |
| 10:48 | csd_ | I guess I'm wondering whether StringBuilder is my best bet |
| 10:48 | clgv | jobx: core.async uses a fixed size threadpool afair. but you can easily have more "thread" forms in parallel than then number of used threads |
| 10:49 | clgv | jobx: the threads wait for tasks that get submitted to a queue |
| 10:51 | clgv | jobx: for more details you can ask the devs, e.g. tbaldridge |
| 10:51 | eric_normand | jobx: you can make many core.async go-processes |
| 10:51 | eric_normand | jobx: but behind the scenes, to execute them, they use a shared thread pool |
| 10:52 | jobx | eric_normand: I see. Just trying to get a rough comparison or memory requirements Clojure vs Gloang, minus base JVM requirements |
| 10:53 | clgv | jobx: just implement a small benchmark in both and measure? |
| 10:53 | tbaldridge | jobx: go processes in core.async are just callbacks, so there's not much overhead there. |
| 10:53 | jobx | tbaldridge: I see. Thanks. |
| 10:58 | clgv | tbaldridge: is the pattern (if ^boolean (prop? x) ...) just better documented or does ^boolean have an effect on the compiler? |
| 10:59 | Bronsa | clgv: that's a cljs compiler hint |
| 10:59 | sdegutis | Is it too harsh to refuse to re-license a library you mostly wrote so that a semi-major open source programming language which you strongly disagree with can include it in their standard library? |
| 10:59 | clgv | Bronsa: oh I landed in the wrong tree. thanks |
| 11:11 | tbaldridge | sdegutis: depends on the open source language, the licenses etc. |
| 11:12 | sdegutis | Ah. |
| 11:13 | clgv | sdegutis: which semi-major os prog lang are you talking about? |
| 11:13 | sdegutis | Someone wanted to work towards including a Go library I wrote into Go's stdlib. |
| 11:14 | arrdem | why would it be harsh to refuse to re-license something you wrote? it's yours after all. |
| 11:14 | sdegutis | I refused to relicense it and sign whatever thing I would have had to sign, and I'm having a really hard time thinking I made the wrong decision. |
| 11:15 | sdegutis | arrdem: Because it meant they had to rewrite it from scratch if they want to use it in Go's stdlib. |
| 11:15 | sdegutis | They're essentially having to do more work than they would have because of me. |
| 11:16 | arrdem | no, they're doing work they would have done anyway and which you are in a position to save them |
| 11:16 | arrdem | *from repeating |
| 11:16 | tbaldridge | sdegutis: stinks to be them for having a crappy contrib process ;-) |
| 11:16 | arrdem | ^ that |
| 11:16 | arrdem | I choose to give away the stuff I write in my spare time. If you don't like the terms, deal or pay me to change em. |
| 11:17 | arrdem | just my (cynical) 0.02 |
| 11:17 | clgv | tbaldridge: but it wouldnt be that different with clojure, would it? you have to be EPL compatible and sign the CA |
| 11:17 | sdegutis | I usually am find with people using my code, but writing that one Go lib was a painful process in itself, and in the end I abandoned it and deleted the lib, although someone forked it and it lived on. |
| 11:17 | clgv | so GPL is out of scope |
| 11:18 | tbaldridge | clgv: yep, and if I had a GPL lib that the "clojure people" (whoever that is) desperately wanted, I'd say the same thing. |
| 11:18 | sdegutis | So I was really only objecting on principle, because writing it was such a painful process and the end result was ugly, all thanks to the nature of the language. And I don't want to encourage that kind of language being used. |
| 11:18 | tbaldridge | clgv: that being said, I use EPL on all my clojure projects just to avoid that problem. |
| 11:19 | clgv | tbaldridge: the incompatibility is a pain for "itext", you can't use any uptodate version of it in EPL projects... :( |
| 11:19 | sdegutis | So it just feels like I only have an arrogant reason to ultimately make someone else do double work. |
| 11:20 | tbaldridge | sdegutis: what's the current license? |
| 11:20 | emacsnub | Hey everyone, I was told starter kits weren't recommended for clojure dev w/ emacs. Does that mean I should avoid all emacs preconfigs like Prelude or OME? |
| 11:20 | tbaldridge | sdegutis: and have you ever accepted a pull request on the project. |
| 11:25 | arrdem | emacsnub: basically. just take the time to find bits you like and add them to your own config it's rarely worth the trouble that using someone else's wholesale will bring. |
| 11:27 | emacsnub | :arrdem Thanks for the heads up! I've actually tried that a couple of times haha. Its just that I can't even seem to get the basic stuff working :(. |
| 11:27 | luxbock | https://github.com/emacs-tw/awesome-emacs is a good resource |
| 11:29 | emacsnub | :luxbock thanks! |
| 11:30 | emacsnub | Oh yeah, is remmapping caps lock to ctl enough to prevent emacs pinky? I was trying to use ergoemacs, but it clashes w/ paredit a lot, and smartparens has had weird issues for me |
| 11:32 | luxbock | emacsnub: it goes a long way, but that obviously depends on how much of your day you spend in Emacs, and what kind of keyboard you have |
| 11:32 | emacsnub | oh that's true |
| 11:32 | schmir | emacsnub: I'd say try to use the control keys on both sides of your keyboard |
| 11:33 | luxbock | I use mostly my laptop which doesn't have the greatest keyboard so I actually started using evil-mode with Emacs, despite never having used Vim before |
| 11:33 | emacsnub | :schmir but sticking with the default keybindings should be ok, right |
| 11:35 | sg2002 | Wasn't emacs-prelude develed by on of the cider developers? Don't think there would be any conflict. |
| 11:35 | clojurebot | Huh? |
| 11:35 | schmir | emacsnub: get a keyboard that's comfortable for you and make short breaks at least every hour. |
| 11:35 | emacsnub | :schmir I will. Thank you! |
| 11:35 | technomancy | move your control key to your thumb for great justice |
| 11:36 | luxbock | has anyone given this a try yet? https://github.com/promethial/paxedit |
| 11:36 | sg2002 | emacsnub: I'd say go with some starter kit and if something does not work, you can always fix it yourself and learn some more about what that kit does. Later, when you're comfortable, you'd start experimenting with different libraries. |
| 11:37 | technomancy | sg2002: most starter kits have rubbish docs and are difficult to fix when things go wrong |
| 11:37 | emacsnub | :sg2002 thanks for the suggestion! |
| 11:38 | sg2002 | technomancy: Prelude and emacs-starter-lit look fine to me. |
| 11:38 | emacsnub | :technomancy I've used your starter kit and it wasn't too bad. Something weird happened at some point though |
| 11:38 | technomancy | sg2002: emacs-starter-kit is lame |
| 11:38 | sg2002 | technomancy: Possibly, haven't looked into it that well. |
| 11:38 | technomancy | ~geometry |
| 11:38 | clojurebot | It's greek to me. |
| 11:39 | technomancy | ._. |
| 11:39 | technomancy | "Emacs needs some theology and geometry; some taste and decency. I suspect we are teetering at the edge of an abyss." etc |
| 11:39 | sg2002 | technomancy: Personally I use ergoemacs. ;-) Hope I would not get banned for mentioning it. :-) |
| 11:39 | technomancy | we get confused people in the #emacs channel on a daily basis |
| 11:40 | technomancy | prelude, esk, emacs-live, they're all the same |
| 11:40 | technomancy | (probably people just don't ask about ergomacs probably because they know xah has a bad reputation) |
| 11:41 | sg2002 | technomancy: Haha. |
| 11:43 | m1dnight_ | When I run (dorun (apply pcalls <something something>)), can I expect all the functions in that body to return? |
| 11:43 | m1dnight_ | I seem to shut down my agents before they all finish and get refused to execute exception |
| 11:44 | m1dnight_ | https://www.refheap.com/93519 # Source |
| 11:44 | m1dnight_ | When I comment out shutdown-agents it all works fine |
| 11:44 | clgv | m1dnight_: better dont use any of those p(map|calls) ... |
| 11:44 | m1dnight_ | hrm? |
| 11:44 | m1dnight_ | Why not? |
| 11:45 | clgv | your dorun already indicates that you are not interested in semi-lazy sequences that are evaluated in parallel. |
| 11:46 | clgv | you want to run several functions in parallel and use what your hardware offers, right? |
| 11:46 | m1dnight_ | yes, that is correct |
| 11:47 | m1dnight_ | it's a stresstest for my refs implementation |
| 11:47 | clgv | "pmap" will prevent that as soon as your functions have different runtimes |
| 11:47 | sg2002 | technomancy: emacsnub: I still think that it's better start with a kit that includes some large crazy thing like icicles or helm, and go from there. If you start from scratch you just wouldn't know what you're missing. |
| 11:47 | clgv | m1dnight_: oh just use futures then |
| 11:47 | m1dnight_ | yeah, but that's the error i'm getting, the agents are shut down and I seem to add another future to my agents |
| 11:47 | m1dnight_ | so I'm guessing something is returning before all the functions have been executed.. |
| 11:47 | m1dnight_ | I don't really get it |
| 11:47 | m1dnight_ | I didnt change a whole lot in the code, I think |
| 11:47 | technomancy | sg2002: sure, just don't come crying to #emacs when it breaks =) |
| 11:48 | clgv | m1dnight_: you got your code on github or similar? |
| 11:48 | emacsnub | :technomancy I just followed this tutorial/starter kit: https://github.com/technomancy/emacs-starter-kit/ and its great! I couldn't add marmalade or melpa until I added (require 'package) at the top though. Why is that? |
| 11:48 | m1dnight_ | yeah hold on |
| 11:48 | m1dnight_ | https://github.com/m1dnight/stm-in-clojure-leiningen |
| 11:48 | sdegutis | tbaldridge: no, and it's whatever license it is when you don't specify a license |
| 11:49 | m1dnight_ | did a quick push just now :) |
| 11:49 | sg2002 | technomancy: As someone said to me once "Here in #emacs we can help you with any emacs package except cider and icicles." :-) |
| 11:49 | Bronsa | emacsnub: there's no reason for the leading colon before nicks in irc |
| 11:49 | mgaare | Bronsa: don't you want to be a keyword? |
| 11:49 | technomancy | sdegutis: releasing software without a license is a crap move no matter the context |
| 11:49 | emacsnub | Bronsa thanks! |
| 11:50 | sdegutis | technomancy: I was young and care-free :P |
| 11:50 | technomancy | emacsnub: the purpose of that page is mostly to get people to stop using the starter kit rather than actual instruction, but thanks |
| 11:50 | sg2002 | technomancy: Oh, I meant CEDET. ;-) |
| 11:51 | clgv | m1dnight_: which test namespace specifically? |
| 11:51 | clgv | m1dnight_: examples.clj? |
| 11:55 | clgv | m1dnight_: I used the following for parallel tests https://gist.github.com/guv/d91b39ea19c47bc8afed |
| 11:57 | clgv | m1dnight_: if your code within the futures might throw exceptions you should wrap the `deref` into try-catch to make sure all futures get dereferenced |
| 12:00 | m1dnight_ | yes, clgv |
| 12:01 | m1dnight_ | but the exact error I get is Task java.util.concurrent.FutureTask@3c18b340 rejected from java.util.concurrent.ThreadPoolExecutor@79a04d92[Shutting down, pool size = 2, active threads = 2, queued tasks = 0, completed tasks = 8] |
| 12:01 | m1dnight_ | I don't really get it |
| 12:01 | m1dnight_ | I should have 10 completed tasks, so I'm guessing that the tasks aren't in the pool yet before I shut down the agents |
| 12:01 | m1dnight_ | stack trace is pretty vague about it too |
| 12:02 | m1dnight_ | I'll give your code a shot |
| 12:02 | clgv | m1dnight_: ah lol you shutdown agents in the namespace |
| 12:02 | m1dnight_ | yeah :p |
| 12:02 | m1dnight_ | but the point is, the unit test works for the vanilla release (the codebase I received) |
| 12:02 | clgv | m1dnight_: pretty bad idea. you should only do something like that at the end of a -main function |
| 12:02 | m1dnight_ | but I changed a few things in the actor model (a thread-local transaction var is an atom with a map in it, instead of the naked map) |
| 12:02 | m1dnight_ | hrm, okay |
| 12:03 | m1dnight_ | but I'm wondering what could be the cause that my implementation causes this error and the professor's one not |
| 12:03 | clgv | m1dnight_: no that code is evaluated with the namespace, so you shutdown the agent thread pool when the namespace is loaded |
| 12:03 | m1dnight_ | *blink* |
| 12:03 | clgv | that's very likely before the test is run ;) |
| 12:04 | m1dnight_ | but I evaluate (run-tests) before it, when i load the namesapce, no? |
| 12:04 | clgv | does (run-tests) block? |
| 12:04 | clgv | to include it in the namespace is odd anyway |
| 12:06 | clgv | m1dnight_: why do you want to shut it down anyway? my test skeleton, the one I posted, uses futures as well and has no problems with the running threadpool in "lein test" |
| 12:10 | emacsnub | haha, sorry I'm treating this like #emacs, but can someone tell me how to have ido-ubiquotous enabled by default? |
| 12:11 | technomancy | emacsnub: (ido-ubiquitous-mode t) I think |
| 12:16 | emacsnub | technomancy I had this in my init.el: (require 'ido) (setq ido-everywhere t) (ido-ubiquotous-mode t) |
| 12:16 | emacsnub | technomancy and it said symbol's definition is void |
| 12:17 | technomancy | emacsnub: sounds like it isn't installed |
| 12:18 | emacsnub | technomancy if i do M-x ido-ubiquotous-mode I get autocompletions when I want to install packages |
| 12:19 | emacsnub | but without that I don't have autocompletions |
| 12:20 | emacsnub | oh i think it was a typo in my init... |
| 12:22 | emacsnub | technomancy YESSS!! THAT DID IT!!! THANK YOU!!! |
| 12:22 | mmitchell | anyone know if it's possible to generate a class using annotations like this? http://www.sureshpw.com/2013/09/javajson-polymorphic-mapping-using.html |
| 12:23 | mmitchell | I need to add something like @JsonTypeName('foo') - in java, this happens before the class declaration |
| 12:23 | clgv | mmitchell: you should probably define that class in java then |
| 12:24 | clgv | mmitchell: if this is not needed because of legacy code, you should better not use this approach |
| 12:26 | mmitchell | clgv: so define the class that requires annotations in Java - you're last comment sorry not following... Are you basically saying just don't do this in Clojure? |
| 12:26 | mmitchell | s/you're/your |
| 12:27 | clgv | mmitchell: yes |
| 12:27 | clgv | mmitchell: if not for legacy reasons, don't do this |
| 12:28 | mmitchell | Dang, yeah not legacy, but required to interact with a Java framework I'm working with. |
| 12:28 | m1dnight_ | clgv: Yeah, I think I figured it out now |
| 12:29 | m1dnight_ | when I do lein test <namespace> it evaluates the test when loading, then shuts down the pool and then runs the tests again |
| 12:29 | munderwo | Hi all. I’ve been using etags to navigate around in emacs and its been really good. Although I realise they are not mutually exclusive, does cider have something like this? where you can go to the definition of the symbol at your point? |
| 12:29 | m1dnight_ | and that's the problem |
| 12:29 | joegallo | munderwo: M-. |
| 12:29 | technomancy | munderwo: yeah, cider is way better than etags at that |
| 12:29 | munderwo | ahh cool… |
| 12:29 | clgv | m1dnight_: not really the namespace is loaded completely and after that the tests are run |
| 12:30 | m1dnight_ | but it runs the test twice? |
| 12:30 | m1dnight_ | That's why I figured it would run the tests when loading the namspace |
| 12:30 | munderwo | does it work with clojurescript as well? Also when I did that it said it had no nrepl connection buffer |
| 12:30 | clgv | mmitchell: so you must use a framework that assumes classes like that? then just define them in java in your project |
| 12:31 | clgv | m1dnight_: it only runs those twice because you have that (run-tests) in the namespace. just remove that as well |
| 12:31 | clgv | m1dnight_: can you answer the question why you want to shut down the agent threadpool? |
| 12:31 | m1dnight_ | clgv: I'm not sure, it's given code. But my guess is that this project was not in leiningen and simply run with a clojure jar |
| 12:31 | mmitchell | clgv: yes, I have to add those nutty annotations. OK so define the class in Java (in my Clojure project under "src/java" or something right?). Then can I still define the main code in Clojure? |
| 12:31 | m1dnight_ | and therefore they would shut it down |
| 12:32 | clgv | m1dnight_: that might be the case. just remove it and use "lein test" ^^ |
| 12:33 | clgv | mmitchell: yes. see the sample project.clj for a setup for distinct java and clojure source paths |
| 12:33 | mmitchell | clgv: awesome, starting to make sense. Thanks! |
| 12:51 | sdegutis | Are there any (popular or not) alternatives to Compojure? |
| 12:52 | clgv | sdegutis: liberator? |
| 12:52 | sdegutis | Thanks, looking at it. |
| 12:54 | hiredman | ztellman: does riffle have ranged iteration? |
| 12:55 | nkoza | sdegutis: moustache, bishop, bidi, compojure-api, clothesline route-one |
| 12:56 | sdegutis | Bishop eh? Someone likes X-Men. |
| 12:56 | technomancy | or chess |
| 12:56 | sdegutis | Oh right, that too. |
| 12:57 | technomancy | or like ... the Roman Church? |
| 12:57 | sdegutis | ~guards |
| 12:57 | clojurebot | SEIZE HIM! |
| 12:57 | technomancy | my son is named after a bishop |
| 12:57 | sdegutis | Anyway I liked the kitchen scene in Days of Future Past. That's probably my favorite scene in any movie ever. |
| 12:57 | technomancy | (middle name, but still) |
| 12:58 | {blake} | Bishop? Or Alien. |
| 13:00 | ianbishop | Does anyone have experience moving a mid-size org from Java to Clojure via internal training & have a few min to chat? |
| 13:01 | {blake} | Holy synchronicity, Batman! |
| 13:01 | sdegutis | I've been looking into the opposite. |
| 13:02 | emacsnub | how can I enable autoindenting for clojure code in emacs? |
| 13:02 | hyPiRion | technomancy: does your son only move diagonally? |
| 13:02 | technomancy | he'd probably get a kick out of that if I told him, hehe |
| 13:03 | ianbishop | sdegutis: what's your reasoning for that? |
| 13:04 | sdegutis | ianbishop: I've been dabbling with Java 8 and so far I like what I see, and it's faster than Clojure. |
| 13:06 | ianbishop | sdegutis: ah, fair enough. I'm not worried about that size of speed improvement |
| 13:08 | sdegutis | Also I'm starting to find that Java can be non-complex and functional without necessarily being Clojure. |
| 13:14 | clgv | sdegutis: if that static wip branch gets included in clojure 1.7 or 1.8, there is no real argument supporting your claim - except you refer to startup time only with respect to "faster" |
| 13:14 | technomancy | clgv: he's just messing with you |
| 13:15 | munderwo | Hi all, looking for a way to convert [“foo” “bar”] to [[:option “foo”] [:option “bar”]] |
| 13:15 | {blake} | munderwo: (for [x ["foo" "bar"]] [:option x]) |
| 13:16 | {blake} | Wrap that in a "(into [] ...)" to get a vector instead of a list. |
| 13:16 | munderwo | Oh nice! |
| 13:16 | postpunkjustin | ,(mapv (fn [k] [:option k]) ["foo" "bar"]) |
| 13:16 | clojurebot | [[:option "foo"] [:option "bar"]] |
| 13:16 | munderwo | ahh soo many options :) |
| 13:16 | munderwo | I tried map.. but not mapv |
| 13:17 | clgv | technomancy: not sure about that ;) |
| 13:18 | technomancy | clgv: the subtlety is what makes him a master |
| 13:18 | munderwo | hmm actually I tried map with #([:option %]) but that didnt seem to work.. |
| 13:18 | Bronsa | clgv: according to puredanger direct is out of scope for 1.7 |
| 13:18 | munderwo | ,(mapv #([:option %]) ["foo" "bar"]) |
| 13:18 | clojurebot | #<ArityException clojure.lang.ArityException: Wrong number of args (0) passed to: PersistentVector> |
| 13:19 | munderwo | Hmm… why does the above not work? |
| 13:19 | Bronsa | ,'#([:foo %]) |
| 13:19 | clojurebot | (fn* [p1__78#] ([:foo p1__78#])) |
| 13:19 | joegallo | #(...) expects an actual function as its first argument |
| 13:19 | Bronsa | ,(macroexpand-1 '(fn [x] [:foo x])) |
| 13:19 | clojurebot | (fn* ([x] [:foo x])) |
| 13:19 | joegallo | [] is not what you think it is in that context |
| 13:19 | ianbishop | ,(mapv #(vector :option %) ["foo" "bar"]) |
| 13:19 | clojurebot | [[:option "foo"] [:option "bar"]] |
| 13:19 | munderwo | ahhhh… wow… interesting… you learn something everyday :) |
| 13:19 | clgv | Bronsa: ah, too bad. then I have to write a patch macro to achieve something similar. clojure 1.8 probably won't be released unti the end of 2015 I guess |
| 13:20 | Bronsa | clgv: no idea |
| 13:20 | clgv | or are there plans to have shorter release cycles? |
| 13:20 | Bronsa | don't ask me. |
| 13:20 | Bronsa | clgv: I've heard core talking of shorter release cycles since 1.3 |
| 13:21 | clgv | Bronsa: good sign :P |
| 13:21 | mdrogalis | Anyone ever seen a defmulti dispatch work correctly in the REPL, when when AOT'ed - cannot find its defmethod implementation? |
| 13:21 | clgv | Bronsa: 1.3 was the version where I waited the longest before adoption |
| 13:21 | hiredman | you are not loading the namespace where the defmethod is |
| 13:21 | mdrogalis | Printing `methods` inside the defmulti shows that it *should* find its implementation - when AOT'ed, even. |
| 13:22 | Bronsa | mdrogalis: are you using class as dispatch fn? |
| 13:22 | hiredman | oh, are you dispatching on the type of a deftype? |
| 13:22 | mdrogalis | hiredman: The ns load is in the same file as the defmulti |
| 13:22 | hiredman | or defrecord or whatever |
| 13:22 | mdrogalis | Bronsa: Yeah |
| 13:22 | mdrogalis | Record, in fact. Yep |
| 13:22 | mdrogalis | ... I'm about to learn something new/terrible. D: |
| 13:22 | Bronsa | mdrogalis: yeah AOT'ing defmethods with class literals can be problematic |
| 13:22 | hiredman | the type in your dispatch has the same name, but is different |
| 13:22 | Bronsa | ^ |
| 13:22 | hiredman | that can happen for a number of reasons |
| 13:23 | mdrogalis | Is there a common resolution or alternate route that I can take? The records are from Component. |
| 13:24 | ztellman | hiredman: you can do key iteration, but it doesn't keep them in lexicographic order |
| 13:24 | ztellman | hiredman: so bascially, no |
| 13:24 | hiredman | ztellman: ok, thanks, very cool btw |
| 13:24 | ztellman | thanks! |
| 13:25 | hiredman | mdrogalis: well, you can try and figure out how you are ending up with multiple types with that name |
| 13:25 | hiredman | mdrogalis: for aot projects I believe that often comes down to namespace loading order |
| 13:25 | mdrogalis | hiredman: Hmm, okay. That's helpful. |
| 13:26 | stuartsierra | mdrogalis: If you're mixing any AOT-compiled code with live reloading at the REPL, all sorts of strange things happen. |
| 13:26 | mdrogalis | I appreciate the insight. Thanks hiredman & Bronsa. |
| 13:26 | mdrogalis | stuartsierra: Pretty much sums up my situation. |
| 13:26 | stuartsierra | mdrogalis: No hope, then. Pick one or the other. |
| 13:26 | technomancy | AOT-compiled code is fine as long as it's not records/protocols |
| 13:27 | mdrogalis | stuartsierra: Fair enough. |
| 13:27 | stuartsierra | technomancy and I have different biases. I blame everything on AOT-compilation; he blames protocols. |
| 13:27 | Bronsa | I cannot help but believing that at the core of all those issues there's a bug in how the compiler handles the dynamicclassloader |
| 13:28 | technomancy | https://github.com/github/linguist/issues/1721#issuecomment-63344390 <- he claims that the official docs recommend textmate's clojure grammar =( |
| 13:28 | clgv | engblom: your chance to ask hiredman ;) |
| 13:29 | hiredman | wait, what? |
| 13:29 | mdrogalis | technomancy: That was some pretty-looking Racket code. Re Twitter |
| 13:30 | technomancy | mdrogalis: making an art form of hideous highlighting |
| 13:30 | Bronsa | what official docs is he talking about? |
| 13:30 | technomancy | Bronsa: guessing the wiki |
| 13:32 | technomancy | it's not linked from clojure.org, though sublime somehow is |
| 13:32 | mdrogalis | hiredman & stuartsierra: Yeah, seems the defrecord files are loaded twice - once at uberwar compilation time, next at uberwar deployment time inside Tomcat. |
| 13:33 | mdrogalis | Since Ring needs access to the handler var, seems impossible to have it both ways - as stuartsierra said. |
| 13:41 | engblom | Why is this causing an eternal loop: http://pastebin.com/VD7XDGfR (This is quil.core/mouse-pressed? The documentation is here: http://quil.info/api/input/mouse#mouse-pressed_q |
| 13:41 | engblom | It should quit looping as soon as the mouse button is released, but it does not. |
| 13:45 | aperiodic | engblom: that value can only be updated outside of your draw loop (a processing applet, hence quil, cannot do anything else while executing your draw fn). once mouse-pressed? is true, you never give it the chance to update the value. |
| 13:47 | engblom | aperiodic: That was bad for me. As I have quil refreshing 30 times/s I catch too many mouse-pressed? When I want only one click, I get 3-4 clicks. I added those lines to make sure it is considering one click as one click. |
| 13:50 | dgellow | Hi guys and girls. |
| 13:51 | dgellow | Do you know if the clutch project (clojure lib for couchdb) is still active ? |
| 13:51 | dgellow | And if not, what are you using to interface with couch ? |
| 13:52 | dgellow | sorry TimMc, english is not my first language :) |
| 13:52 | TimMc | no worries |
| 13:52 | metellus | we don't really have a good word to match up with "guy" |
| 13:52 | aperiodic | engblom: pass a callback fn as the value of the :mouse-pressed / :mouse-clicked option to sketch / defsketch http://quil.info/api/environment#sketch |
| 13:52 | TimMc | metellus: "gals"? *shrug* |
| 13:53 | metellus | very *shrug* |
| 13:53 | TimMc | heh |
| 13:53 | joegallo | furthermore, since we're getting our jimmies rustled, guy is offensive http://www.etymonline.com/index.php?term=guy&allowed_in_frame=0 |
| 13:53 | technomancy | I've always preferred the good old traditional "GREETINGS, HUMANS" |
| 13:53 | clgv | hiredman: engbloom has questions about the clojurebot setup earlier^^ |
| 13:54 | joegallo | technomancy: that's offensive |
| 13:54 | dgellow | "effigy of Guy Fawkes," leader of the Gunpowder Plot to blow up British king and Parliament" |
| 13:54 | clgv | ~guards |
| 13:54 | clojurebot | SEIZE HIM! |
| 13:55 | TimMc | joegallo: I heard no rustling. |
| 13:55 | TimMc | Perhaps you have better ears than I. |
| 13:55 | metellus | ~gourds |
| 13:55 | clojurebot | SQUEEZE HIM! |
| 13:55 | joegallo | LOL |
| 13:55 | clgv | lol? |
| 13:58 | TimMc | dgellow: It certainly looks worrying -- no activity in 11 months. |
| 13:59 | dgellow | TimMc: Yeah :( |
| 14:00 | TimMc | Maybe it's complete. :-) |
| 14:03 | dgellow | I cannot make it work in project. |
| 14:03 | dgellow | I just opened an issue here https://github.com/clojure-clutch/clutch/issues/85 |
| 14:04 | dgellow | maybe you have an idea of what I'm doing wrong ? |
| 14:15 | tmarble | I'm running [cider/cider-nrepl "0.8.0-20141113.231027-33"] + ~/.emacs.d/elpa/cider-20141116.1221/ yet I still get |
| 14:15 | tmarble | WARNING: The following required nREPL ops are not supported: toggle-trace (??) |
| 14:21 | danielcompton | metellus: I prefer folks |
| 14:22 | danielcompton | but mammals is a more inclusive term, remember, on the internet no-one knows you're a dog |
| 14:22 | xemdetia | carbon based meat popsicles |
| 14:22 | edw | ping |
| 14:24 | dbasch | danielcompton: by now that’s been subsumed by “on the internet no one knows anything” |
| 14:24 | technomancy | haha |
| 14:26 | edw | tmarble: The tracking code was touched recently. Don't know if that may be related. |
| 14:26 | edw | s/tracking/tracing/ |
| 14:27 | edw | But I didn't get that error. Consider `rm -rf ~/.m2/repository/cider/cider-nrepl/0.8.0-SNAPSHOT`-ing. |
| 14:27 | tmarble | edw: I see that in the changelog... What is the best practice here? load *.el from recent github checkout (and hope it matches .m2)? |
| 14:27 | edw | tmarble: I'm using the same version of cider as you are. |
| 14:28 | tmarble | or use cider from MELPA (and hope it lines up with whatever is in .m2)? |
| 14:28 | edw | tmarble: If you blow it away, you'll get the newest. |
| 14:28 | tmarble | edw: I did that.. the versions above are latest |
| 14:28 | sorbo_ | when I open a file with with-open and call line-seq on the BufferedReader, I get my seq of lines (which I want!). however, I want to preserve whitespace in whitespace-only lines, which clojure compacts to empty string |
| 14:28 | sorbo_ | how do I keep whitespace-only lines? |
| 14:29 | edw | tmarble: Huh. Did you happen to `lein clean`? Worth a shot. |
| 14:29 | sorbo_ | e.g. a line of 20 spaces comes in as “” |
| 14:29 | sorbo_ | rather than “ “ |
| 14:30 | ToxicFrog | sorbo_: line-seq is just a really simple wrapper about BufferedReader::readLine() |
| 14:30 | ToxicFrog | So this sounds like some kind of undocumented "feature" of readLine |
| 14:31 | stuartsierra | ,(line-seq (java.io.BufferedReader. (java.io.StringReader. " \n \n \n\n"))) |
| 14:31 | clojurebot | (" " " " " " "") |
| 14:31 | stuartsierra | It's not line-seq. |
| 14:32 | stuartsierra | Or readLine. |
| 14:32 | amalloy | sorbo_: it is something else you are doing, like calling trim or something |
| 14:36 | mwfogleman | engblom: cool! what did you use? |
| 14:38 | engblom | mwfogleman: Quil |
| 14:39 | mwfogleman | can you apply a lein template to an existing project? |
| 14:40 | ghadishayban | if another bug shows up in #'reduced handling I'm going to jump off a cliff |
| 14:41 | Bronsa | ghadishayban: one sec |
| 14:41 | ghadishayban | oh no |
| 14:41 | Bronsa | , (.reduce (list 1 2 3 4 5) (fn [_ a] (if (= a 5) (reduced "foo"))) 1) |
| 14:41 | clojurebot | #<Reduced@1ddd078: "foo"> |
| 14:41 | Bronsa | there |
| 14:41 | Bronsa | I just fixed that |
| 14:41 | ghadishayban | i saw |
| 14:41 | tim__ | sometimes I wonder if it wouldn't be better to do what Python does, and throw StopIteration() |
| 14:41 | ghadishayban | we all thank you Bronsa |
| 14:42 | ghadishayban | Bronsa: btw I implemented a "one-time" reflector last night |
| 14:42 | Bronsa | ghadishayban: luckly clojure's reduce apparently doesn't use PersistentList/reduce |
| 14:42 | tmarble | edw: lein clean did not work, but I removed cider from MELPA and did this instead: (add-to-list 'load-path "/home/tmarble/src/github/clojure-emacs/cider") -- and that worked (no complaints about toggle-trace) |
| 14:42 | ghadishayban | oh it doesn't? |
| 14:42 | sorbo_ | ToxicFrog: nah, no trim |
| 14:42 | sorbo_ | that’s the weird thing |
| 14:43 | sorbo_ | it’s literally just BufferedReader, followed by a (doall line-seq rdr) |
| 14:43 | sorbo_ | since I’ve bound the reader to rdr |
| 14:43 | sorbo_ | and the lines come through perfectly, only the all-whitespace ones are just empty string |
| 14:43 | Bronsa | ghadishayban: no, it uses the internal-reduce impl |
| 14:43 | sorbo_ | not strings of \space |
| 14:43 | sorbo_ | hm |
| 14:43 | dbasch | sorbo_: refheap your code? |
| 14:43 | ghadishayban | Bronsa: i see |
| 14:43 | amalloy | sorbo_: surely you mean (doall (line-seq rdr)). it's hard to debug if you paste code that isn't actually what you're running |
| 14:44 | sorbo_ | amalloy: correct |
| 14:44 | sorbo_ | I’ll tinker with it and post a pastebin in a few if I can’t figure out what I’m doing wrong |
| 14:44 | sorbo_ | thanks guys |
| 14:44 | Bronsa | ghadishayban: I really don't understand why it's neccessary to have CollReduce/InternalReduce/IReduce rather than just one interface and a protocol backing that interface |
| 14:45 | Bronsa | it's really hard to understand what reduce impl will be used for a coll |
| 14:45 | stuartsierra | Bronsa: Partly it's the evolution of reduce to reducers to transducers. |
| 14:45 | ghadishayban | Bronsa: yeah at first I understood but now it just seems like a poor man's polymorphic inline cache |
| 14:45 | ghadishayban | Bronsa: I'm mentioning it briefly in my conj talk |
| 14:45 | Bronsa | stuartsierra: InternalReuce now seems completely unnecessary to me |
| 14:45 | stuartsierra | The different interfaces have caused a lot of confusion for everyone, even making performance patches harder to implement. |
| 14:46 | tbaldridge | stuartsierra: and last Friday Bronsa pointed out to me that ChunkedSeq.reduce is not IReduce.reduce ....yeah.... |
| 14:46 | Bronsa | it's even more confusing since a bunch of collections implement IReduce but that impl will never be used by reduce |
| 14:46 | sorbo_ | so |
| 14:46 | ghadishayban | what you really want is the callsite cache to be on the caller of reduce, not inside core/reduce |
| 14:46 | sorbo_ | the problem is |
| 14:46 | sorbo_ | I am dumb |
| 14:46 | sorbo_ | fixed it |
| 14:47 | Bronsa | tbaldridge: I actually understood the rationale for that, don't remember if I told you about it |
| 14:47 | sorbo_ | the whitespace-only lines I imagined were just \ns |
| 14:47 | sorbo_ | >_< |
| 14:47 | sorbo_ | actually inserting whitespace solved the problem |
| 14:47 | tbaldridge | Bronsa: yeah I get the rationale as well. I just wish there was a better way |
| 14:47 | stuartsierra | Lots of things are unnecessary or, in hindsight, misapplied, but "fixing" them would break something else somewhere. |
| 14:47 | tbaldridge | hence the reason for ReduceInit |
| 14:47 | clojurebot | Gabh mo leithscéal? |
| 14:48 | tbaldridge | clojurebot: fail |
| 14:48 | clojurebot | Pardon? |
| 14:49 | ghadishayban | Bronsa: https://github.com/ghadishayban/reducers/blob/master/src/ghadi/reducers.clj#L7-L14 |
| 14:49 | stuartsierra | tbaldridge solved the problem by implementing his own language. |
| 14:49 | ghadishayban | stuartsierra: lol |
| 14:49 | Bronsa | before reducers this mess was still there but at least all the implementations were consistent |
| 14:49 | Bronsa | now some implementation handle reduced right, some partially, some don't at all |
| 14:49 | ghadishayban | Bronsa: I've found that macro "helpful" https://github.com/ghadishayban/reducers/blob/master/src/ghadi/reducers.clj#L35-L41 |
| 14:50 | Bronsa | ghadishayban: 1.7 should have an unreduced function |
| 14:50 | ghadishayban | not the same thing |
| 14:50 | Bronsa | ah, I missed the else arg sorru |
| 14:50 | Bronsa | sorry* |
| 14:51 | Bronsa | yeah that looks nice |
| 14:51 | ghadishayban | unreduced is useful for transducers though |
| 14:51 | Bronsa | I could actually use that macro for t.a |
| 14:51 | ghadishayban | crib away |
| 14:51 | Bronsa | I just added reduced support to the walking functions and that might help |
| 14:53 | ghadishayban | i very much enjoyed querying the AST using datalog btw |
| 14:53 | ghadishayban | lots of interesting data there |
| 14:55 | ghadishayban | Bronsa: it is *possible* that the IReduceInit special casing in transduce may be applied to reduce as well, making it more likely to hit the bug that you exposed in PersistentList's .reduce |
| 14:55 | Bronsa | ghadishayban: ah yeah, definitely |
| 14:55 | Bronsa | ghadishayban: the bug is in the IReduceInit reduce arity |
| 14:55 | ghadishayban | solution: macros for java |
| 14:56 | amalloy | so wait, what was the bug in IPList/reduce? |
| 14:56 | ghadishayban | reduced handling, the favorite nemesis |
| 14:56 | Bronsa | ,(.reduce (list 1 2 3 4 5) (fn [_ a] (if (= a 5) (reduced "foo"))) 1) ;; amalloy |
| 14:56 | clojurebot | #<Reduced@de04cd: "foo"> |
| 14:57 | Bronsa | amalloy: a reduced in the last iteration of a reduce will not be unwrapped |
| 14:57 | amalloy | i see |
| 14:57 | Bronsa | well |
| 14:57 | Bronsa | of a reduce with init |
| 14:57 | Bronsa | ,(.reduce (list 1 2 3 4 5) (fn [_ a] (if (= a 5) (reduced "foo")))) |
| 14:57 | clojurebot | "foo" |
| 14:57 | amalloy | and this is only if you use .reduce instead of reduce |
| 14:57 | amalloy | eg because you are java code |
| 14:57 | amalloy | right? |
| 14:58 | Bronsa | amalloy: yes but as ghadishayban just pointed out, transduce uses IReduceInit/reduce directly rather than going through CollReduce/reduce |
| 15:01 | Bronsa | stuartsierra: since puredanger's not here, do you happen to know if the clojure/conj talks will be live streamed? |
| 15:06 | stuartsierra | Bronsa: I don't know for certain, but I very much doubt it. Live streaming is expensive. |
| 15:08 | TimMc | and difficult |
| 15:09 | danielcompton | ,(require '[test.check.generators :as gen] |
| 15:09 | clojurebot | #<RuntimeException java.lang.RuntimeException: EOF while reading> |
| 15:09 | danielcompton | ,(require '[test.check.generators :as gen]) |
| 15:09 | clojurebot | #<FileNotFoundException java.io.FileNotFoundException: Could not locate test/check/generators__init.class or test/check/generators.clj on classpath.> |
| 15:09 | danielcompton | worth a try |
| 15:10 | danielcompton | I've got some interesting behaviour with test.check and I'm not sure if it's a bug or feature |
| 15:10 | ghadishayban | Bronsa: so I have a commit that makes (fn [x a] (.concat x a)) only reflect the first time through the function |
| 15:10 | danielcompton | (last (sort (gen/sample gen/s-pos-int 1000000))) returns 100, i.e. the largest int generated in 10 million runs is 100. I expected it to grow larger and larger over time |
| 15:11 | ghadishayban | Bronsa: uses invokedynamic to rewrite the callsite. surprisingly not hard to write. haven't accounted for re-linking it when the target class changes, but it is almost trivial |
| 15:11 | Bronsa | ghadishayban: nice |
| 15:11 | ghadishayban | Bronsa: I also got rid of the ILookupThunk stuff for KeywordInvokes |
| 15:11 | ghadishayban | Bronsa: and instead install a guard on the Record's class, and a direct MethodHandle field access to the particular field |
| 15:12 | Bronsa | ghadishayban: how about the protocol-fn callsites? |
| 15:12 | Bronsa | are the caches there still necessary or can they be avoided? |
| 15:13 | ghadishayban | the static field caches can go away, it's all encapsulated in the CallSite |
| 15:13 | ghadishayban | I have an implementation I made a few months ago for protocol-fn callsite, mimics the callsite caching that is there in the current compiler |
| 15:13 | ghadishayban | But I think I can improve upon it...just not enough time |
| 15:13 | Bronsa | I can relate to that :) |
| 15:15 | akkad | is there an easy way to compare two jars for differences in code? |
| 15:16 | edw | tmarble: That is odd. But all's well that ends well. Also, insert obligatory warning against using non-stable MELPA. (A warning I do not heed myself.) |
| 15:17 | ghadishayban | Bronsa: one thing I have been thinking about recently is a reified callframe |
| 15:18 | ghadishayban | Bronsa: like if all invokes took a Scope/Frame object before the args. Would almost certainly be slow, but it would allow things like a "tracing" mode |
| 15:18 | danielcompton | akkad: you could unpack them and diff the folders? |
| 15:18 | ghadishayban | actually there are probably ways to achieve tracing without having the arg everywhere |
| 15:19 | Bronsa | ghadishayban: that would be a major ABI change |
| 15:19 | ghadishayban | sure would |
| 15:19 | Bronsa | *breaking change |
| 15:19 | ghadishayban | so far everything I have done is compatible |
| 15:20 | wei | any thoughts on freactive so far? |
| 15:20 | ghadishayban | but there are some interesting designs that are possible if not restricted by ABI |
| 15:20 | akkad | danielcompton: that's what I did |
| 15:20 | danielcompton | akkad: did it work? |
| 15:21 | ghadishayban | Bronsa: for example IReduceInit / CollReduce can really be seen as part of the same protocol |
| 15:22 | ghadishayban | Bronsa: and if you had protocols at the bottom of the impl, funny-business like seqFrom could disappear and possibly be optimized https://github.com/clojure/clojure/blob/master/src/jvm/clojure/lang/RT.java#L490-L501 |
| 15:22 | Bronsa | right |
| 15:24 | ghadishayban | inlining across function boundaries/HOFs is a problem that if solved could enable a much bigger jump in performance than a few yak-shaves here or there |
| 15:24 | ghadishayban | This is a preview of my talk on thursday |
| 15:25 | ghadishayban | I have no solutions, btw |
| 15:25 | Bronsa | [spoilers] |
| 15:25 | ghadishayban | heh |
| 15:25 | Bronsa | I look forward to seeing a recording of your talk |
| 15:30 | danielcompton | I'm trying to translate this Java algorithm to Clojure to count the number of high bits in a Long: http://stackoverflow.com/a/109025/826486. I've got it working for input below 256, but it doesn't work above that. I've got a naive working version, and the full algorithm at https://www.refheap.com/93523. Can anyone see what I'm doing wrong? |
| 15:32 | amalloy | danielcompton: by "high bits" you mean bits which are 1? i thought you meant leading 1s |
| 15:32 | ghadishayban | Integer/bitCount + a mask is the shitty answer |
| 15:33 | amalloy | is there a reason you're not just using (Long/bitCount x)? |
| 15:33 | ghadishayban | amalloy: jinx |
| 15:33 | danielcompton | amalloy: yeah, bits that are on. I thought that was what high bit meant but looking now I was wrong |
| 15:34 | amalloy | ghadishayban: i'm curious what bitmask you think is useful here |
| 15:34 | amalloy | if we're already using bitCount |
| 15:34 | ghadishayban | whatever high bits mean |
| 15:34 | ghadishayban | maybe i don't follow |
| 15:35 | danielcompton | Long/bitCount is the answer here |
| 15:35 | dbasch | ghadishayban: he means “set bits" |
| 15:35 | danielcompton | certainly easier than trying to read the bit shifting algorithm |
| 15:36 | dbasch | danielcompton: TIL http://kent-vandervelden.blogspot.com/2009/10/counting-bits-population-count-and.html |
| 15:36 | ghadishayban | the JVM will intrinsify it too |
| 15:36 | ghadishayban | POPCNT instruction i think |
| 15:36 | danielcompton | looks like Java does something similar under the covers: http://grepcode.com/file/repository.grepcode.com/java/root/jdk/openjdk/6-b14/java/lang/Long.java#Long.bitCount%28long%29 |
| 15:38 | dbasch | danielcompton: and by default it uses the cpu instruction in recent versions if available |
| 15:38 | danielcompton | dbasch: thanks, that was really interesting |
| 15:39 | ghadishayban | it's part of the secret sauce to persistent hashmaps |
| 15:39 | ghadishayban | makes them fast |
| 15:41 | danielcompton | ghadishayban: interesting https://github.com/clojure/clojure/blob/master/src/jvm/clojure/lang/PersistentHashMap.java#L752 |
| 15:53 | danielcompton | Wow Long/bitCount takes 2 nanoseconds vs my naive version taking 100 milliseconds |
| 15:55 | danielcompton | The bitshifting version took 50 ns but wasn't giving correct results so it's not particularly useful |
| 15:56 | danielcompton | amalloy: I guess that makes you a 1000x programmer then? |
| 15:58 | amalloy | is that some kind of standard term? i don't think i'm a thousand people. if you're comparing speeds, i have to complain that i'm getting the short end of the stick: i sped up your program by a factor of 50,000! |
| 15:58 | xemdetia_ | it's a logarithmic person scale |
| 16:03 | dbasch | danielcompton: curious how you’re measuring the speed of Long/bitCount |
| 16:03 | danielcompton | dbasch: criterium |
| 16:04 | danielcompton | amalloy: Well I can't pay you 50,000x so 1,000x will have to do |
| 16:04 | danielcompton | dbasch: I thought that would be the right way to get it optimised fully? |
| 16:05 | kenrestivo | it just occurred to me how much adding a new library to a project.clj :dependencies is like building a house of cards. you just never know which one will cause the whole thing to fall over. |
| 16:05 | danielcompton | kenrestivo: usually it's the one you just added :) |
| 16:05 | kenrestivo | right, just like a house of cards. here goes..... WIN! or... here goes... AAWWWW... |
| 16:06 | amalloy | kenrestivo: prophecies foretell of a man who can finally solve the problem of Dependency Hell for all programming languages. he will usher us into a new era of enlightenment |
| 16:06 | kenrestivo | who says it'll be a man? but yeah, it's a Hard Problem. |
| 16:07 | amalloy | kenrestivo: it's true, i could have made it more gender-neutral. but it was tricky to work out the "he" in the second sentence, and plus prophecies are historically sexist anyway? |
| 16:07 | joegallo | indeed, not a man, but a god |
| 16:08 | danielcompton | I'd really like to see a Clojure take on OSGI |
| 16:08 | danielcompton | I know Clojure OSGI exists (and the person who wrote it) but it doesn't seem *simple* to me |
| 16:08 | danielcompton | (inc talios) |
| 16:08 | lazybot | ⇒ 3 |
| 16:09 | bja | A man once solved dependency hell, but his black art of static linkage was abhorrent to all those who witnessed it. |
| 16:09 | dbasch | what is the right pronoun for an AI? |
| 16:09 | amalloy | dbasch: lord and master |
| 16:09 | danielcompton | $google roko's basilisk |
| 16:09 | lazybot | [Roko's basilisk - RationalWiki] http://rationalwiki.org/wiki/Roko's_basilisk |
| 16:10 | danielcompton | Roko's basilisk is still in my top 5 funniest things on the internet |
| 16:10 | hyPiRion | dbasch: they, unless they identify with something |
| 16:10 | hyPiRion | don't think they've come that far yet |
| 16:10 | bja | hyPiRion: #ai #otherkin? |
| 16:11 | bja | sorry, was wasting time on tumblr today |
| 16:12 | amalloy | danielcompton: that is pretty entertaining |
| 16:12 | metellus | dbasch: only for versions of the singularity that are similar to roko's basilisk |
| 16:13 | dbasch | reading now |
| 16:30 | mskoud | having a 2d vector [[0 0 0 0][0 0 0 0]...] im looking for a way to create a rectangle fx [[0 1 1 0][0 1 1 0]...]. I can use assoc-in to update individual positions but how do i make a function to make a comple rectangle. (defn make-rect [2dvector offsetx offsety width height] ?)? |
| 16:31 | amalloy | mskoud: 2dvector isn't actually a legal name |
| 16:31 | annelies | That's a vector of vectors, not a 2D vector. |
| 16:31 | mskoud | no sorry, lets call it d2vector. |
| 16:32 | amalloy | annelies: that seems like even less useful nitpicking than mine |
| 16:32 | mskoud | the problem is i need to assoc-in multiple times using the result from the prev assoc-in in the next assoc-in... |
| 16:33 | amalloy | mskoud: one approach would be to use offset/width to produce a sequence of [x y] pairs, and then reduce over them using assoc-in |
| 16:33 | amalloy | reduce is exactly the pattern fo "do X multiple times, using the result of the previous call to X" |
| 16:33 | dbasch | mskoud: what do you need the original vector for? |
| 16:33 | mskoud | i dont need the org vector, just the result. |
| 16:34 | mskoud | ill look into a solution with reduce. Thanks. |
| 16:35 | dbasch | mskoud: but then you want padding? |
| 16:35 | {blake} | I'm running Eastwood and it's telling me I'm using the wrong arity (for hiccup.form/submit-button, says there should be two parms [attr-map? text], when there's only one [text] that I can see. Also the code works. Should I care? |
| 16:36 | amalloy | {blake}: it sounds like eastwood inspects the :arglists of functions you call, and expects those to reflect what args they actually take |
| 16:36 | amalloy | whereas hiccup fabricates its own arglists. i certainly wouldn't care about that warning |
| 16:36 | mskoud | dbasch: no padding, the 2d vector is just initialised with 0, and (make-rect 1 1 2 2) place a rect inside the 2d-vector at a given position. |
| 16:38 | dbasch | mskoud: so you want ((0 0 0) (0 1 1) (0 1 1)) ? |
| 16:38 | {blake} | amalloy: I think I understand those words. But if I look at hiccup.form, I see the one-arity version. So where does the two-arity version come from? |
| 16:38 | mskoud | yes, but the 2d vector may be larger |
| 16:39 | dbasch | mskoud: the “outer” vector is fixed? |
| 16:39 | dbasch | outer rectangle I mean |
| 16:39 | mskoud | yes |
| 16:39 | {blake} | amalloy: OH, wait! Nevermind, I got it. Thanks. |
| 16:39 | {blake} | (inc amalloy) |
| 16:39 | lazybot | ⇒ 191 |
| 16:39 | amalloy | {blake}: you're sure submit-button is the function it's warning about? |
| 16:40 | {blake} | "Function on var #'hiccup.form/submit-button called with 1 args, but it is only known to take one of the following args: [attr-map? text]" |
| 16:40 | {blake} | Is the exact text. |
| 16:40 | {blake} | But I see now I'm calling it sometimes with one parm, sometimes with two. Which...huh. |
| 16:40 | amalloy | huh. well, i'm a bit puzzled. it sounds like you figured it out; what was going on? |
| 16:41 | {blake} | hang on... |
| 16:43 | amalloy | {blake}: i think you have an older version of hiccup somewhere, because it used to be that submit-button was defined via defelem, which included an optional attr-map |
| 16:43 | amalloy | search for "defelem" on https://github.com/jonase/eastwood, for example |
| 16:43 | {blake} | amalloy: Yes. That is how submit-button is defined. |
| 16:44 | amalloy | {blake}: it's not anymore |
| 16:44 | {blake} | amalloy: I wonder if it's a cursive thing. The code IS working. |
| 16:44 | amalloy | oh, nm |
| 16:44 | amalloy | yes it is |
| 16:45 | {blake} | amalloy: OK, so I'm not crazy. (At least this isn't evidence of same.) |
| 16:45 | {blake} | amalloy: Why is passing two parameters working? Macro magic? |
| 16:45 | amalloy | {blake}: tldr: submit-button adds support for an optional attr-map, by accepting any number of args, and lies about how it works by producing a fake :arglists entry; this confuses eastwood and is a known issue |
| 16:46 | amalloy | (defelem submit-buttom "" [text] ...) expands to something like (defn ^{:arglists [attr-map? text]} submit-button [& args] (let [[attrs text] (magic args)] ...)) |
| 16:47 | {blake} | amalloy: Right. I got it now. Lies...all is lies. |
| 16:47 | amalloy | yep |
| 16:48 | {blake} | And that's cool, man. |
| 16:49 | mgaare | lisp's parens are like Zuckerberg's hoodie |
| 16:49 | justin_smith | it's a signifier that we are all douchebags? |
| 16:49 | justin_smith | unpeet: stop spamming |
| 16:49 | justin_smith | technomancy: ^^^ |
| 16:51 | mgaare | simple syntax means you don't waste energy on low-value syntax decisions (unlike, say, Scala). Zuckberberg wears the same hoodie every day so he doesn't have to waste energy on thinking about clothes |
| 16:51 | mi6x3m | hey, can anyone recommend a templating library for clojure code itself? |
| 16:55 | dbasch | mgaare: he probably likes to wear hoodies, and came up with an ok rationalization for his taste (unlike the lisp syntax which is indeed awesome) |
| 16:55 | SagiCZ1 | is there any variant of sort function that returns lazy sequence? i guess that makes no sense huh.. |
| 16:56 | dbasch | mgaare: I don’t like to worry about clothes so I live in a portable cardboard box |
| 16:56 | tuft | SagiCZ1: if you make one sell it for $10e6 =) |
| 16:56 | dbasch | I also don’t waste time leaving the house because I take it with me |
| 16:57 | mgaare | dbasch: could substitue Steve Jobs's turtleneck for Zuck's hoodie and have the same effect |
| 16:57 | SagiCZ1 | tuft: but there are some algorithms that can sort by batches and then merge them or something.. |
| 16:57 | dbasch | mgaare: or randomly grab whatever is clean, which is what most of us do |
| 16:58 | joegallo | one could write a lazy version of a selection sort... but why would you... |
| 16:59 | SagiCZ1 | joegallo: what if you cant fit the collection you want to sort in memory.. |
| 17:00 | SagiCZ1 | *what if you cant fit the collection in memory |
| 17:00 | joegallo | external merge sort |
| 17:00 | amalloy | it's certainly not impossible to write a lazy version of a mergesort. haskell does it in like one line |
| 17:01 | annelies | Perl probably does it in five characters. |
| 17:01 | amalloy | but it's not a good solution to "too big to fit in memory" |
| 17:01 | SagiCZ1 | amalloy: so did the author get $10e6? |
| 17:01 | mi6x3m | any way to get a namespace from a symbol? |
| 17:01 | amalloy | &(doc find-ns) |
| 17:01 | lazybot | ⇒ "([sym]); Returns the namespace named by the symbol or nil if it doesn't exist." |
| 17:02 | mi6x3m | thanks amalloy |
| 17:02 | dbasch | SagiCZ1: https://github.com/chrismgray/clojure-heap-sort |
| 17:02 | mi6x3m | you need an inc, i'll give you an inc |
| 17:02 | dbasch | (haven’t looked at it, but read the blog post) |
| 17:02 | mi6x3m | (inc amalloy) |
| 17:02 | lazybot | ⇒ 192 |
| 17:02 | SagiCZ1 | dbasch: thanks |
| 17:02 | tuft | mi6x3m: you can get them from var metadata too if it's not a symbol literal in code you're working with |
| 17:02 | dbasch | wow, amalloy is only 8 karma from his second life-sized cardboard cutout of rich hickey |
| 17:03 | technomancy | (inc dbasch) |
| 17:03 | lazybot | ⇒ 17 |
| 17:03 | amalloy | dbasch: i've been dying to get a picture of the two of them high-fiving each other |
| 17:04 | dbasch | amalloy: (concat hickey-cutout (reverse hickey-cutout)) |
| 17:04 | dbasch | that would work better if it were a sequence of legos or something |
| 17:04 | mearnsh | haha |
| 17:05 | justin_smith | dbasch: that sounds like paper dolls to me |
| 17:15 | gfredericks | does anybody know why nrepl uses an atom to hold the session? |
| 17:17 | dbasch | gfredericks: because it’s the obvious way to do it? |
| 17:17 | gfredericks | I don't know of any case where it's mutated |
| 17:18 | gfredericks | by "the session" I mean the map of dynamic vars to their values |
| 17:20 | gfredericks | hmmm; looks sticky |
| 17:20 | gfredericks | I just want to sit down for a week and refactor nrepl |
| 17:20 | danielcompton | Is there any way to destructure anonymous function literals? i.e. #()'s |
| 17:21 | amalloy | danielcompton: do you mean, destructure the arguments to them? destructuring a function itself is such a wrong question i almost fell out of my chair |
| 17:21 | dbasch | amalloy: danielcompton surely meant “deconstruct” as in Derrida |
| 17:21 | danielcompton | amalloy: yes destructuring the args. Not sure how to destructure a function |
| 17:21 | {blake} | post-modern programming |
| 17:22 | amalloy | danielcompton: no. if you need to do anything at all complicated in a #() function, just use a real (fn []) lambda instead |
| 17:22 | danielcompton | amalloy_: thought that was the case but I'd try and ask anyway. It's not an easy thing to google for |
| 17:26 | danielcompton | (inc amalloy) |
| 17:26 | lazybot | ⇒ 193 |
| 17:27 | danielcompton | getting closer... |
| 17:30 | annelies | I want to write an AWK-like library for Clojure. |
| 17:30 | annelies | I love AWK and I love Clojure. |
| 17:32 | justin_smith | annelies: cool |
| 17:32 | justin_smith | annelies: I was thinking an expect tool for clojure would be neat |
| 17:32 | justin_smith | speaking of text streaming / text processing madness |
| 17:32 | TimMc | yak streaming |
| 17:33 | justin_smith | annelies: you could call it boston-clock |
| 17:33 | justin_smith | aka clawk |
| 17:33 | mi6x3m | annelies: do you love popcorn? |
| 17:33 | annelies | No, it always gets between my teeth and takes ages to get it out. |
| 17:33 | annelies | And it doesn't taste very well either. |
| 17:33 | mi6x3m | then don't write a popcorn library for clojure |
| 17:33 | annelies | So it'd be near grapefruit if it were a fruit. |
| 17:34 | mi6x3m | anyone knows a templating library for clojure source? |
| 17:34 | joegallo | that is, creating more clojure source from templates where you'll fill in the blanks in the clojure source? |
| 17:35 | danielcompton | mi6x3m: lein templates? |
| 17:35 | danielcompton | mi6x3m: what are you trying to do with it? |
| 17:35 | mi6x3m | define a template, specify variables through clojure code |
| 17:35 | mi6x3m | and get clojure code as string |
| 17:36 | joegallo | that's macros and, well, normal clojure... |
| 17:36 | mi6x3m | I need it formatted though |
| 17:36 | danielcompton | mi6x3m: use a pretty printer? |
| 17:36 | joegallo | clojure.pprint/pprint does a decent enough job |
| 17:36 | mi6x3m | not in this case, anyhow, time for bed :) |
| 17:38 | annelies | Something like this: https://gist.github.com/rightfold/1fe7b754a2d0248e1cfb |
| 17:44 | annelies | But generalised to work in any kind of sequence, not just with strings. |
| 17:45 | arrdem | a good text munging lib would be nice to have |
| 17:46 | dbasch | arrdem: what things would you want to do with a text munging lib? I’ve done a fair amount of text munging in various places but haven’t shared most of it |
| 17:47 | arrdem | dbasch: that's a legitimate question and I don't have a good answer |
| 17:48 | arrdem | the text munging tools I've built for myself are stuff like paragraph/block detection and indentation/unindentation |
| 17:50 | bobpoekert | arrdem: does instaparse maybe do what you want? |
| 17:50 | technomancy | instagrammar |
| 17:50 | annelies | |
| 17:50 | arrdem | does Instaparse support context sensitive grammars? I don't think it does.. |
| 17:51 | arrdem | should set up a repo that's just Instaparse grammars for known PLs |
| 17:51 | arrdem | it'd be fun |
| 17:51 | bobpoekert | I think it supports PEG |
| 17:51 | arrdem | want to parse $OTHER_PLEB_LANGUAGE? we have a library for that.. |
| 17:52 | bobpoekert | you could probably write a shim around IntelliJ's plugin architecture |
| 17:52 | bobpoekert | or eclipse |
| 17:52 | bobpoekert | people have already written intellij and eclipse plugins for pretty much everything |
| 17:53 | bobpoekert | wouldn't be as clean but it'd be hecka less work |
| 17:56 | annelies | Not for Eiffel. :( |
| 17:57 | bobpoekert | aww |
| 18:32 | danielszmulewicz | I don't understand following leiningen behavior. If I put the following line in my project.clj :production {:dependencies [[org.clojure/tools.nrepl "0.2.5"]]}, and then run `lein with-profile production uberjar`, I am getting the following error java.io.FileNotFoundException: Could not locate clojure/tools/nrepl/server__init.class |
| 18:32 | danielszmulewicz | |
| 18:33 | panther_ | Clojure's Fast! :D |
| 18:33 | danielszmulewicz | The only way to get it to produce the uberjar is with the dependency defined in the base dependencies. |
| 18:34 | danielszmulewicz | In other words, can't I have production specific dependencies with leiningen? |
| 18:35 | technomancy | danielszmulewicz: someone opened a bug about a problem specific to tools.nrepl; this might be that. does it occur with other deps too? |
| 18:35 | danielszmulewicz | technomancy: I don't know. I can try. |
| 18:37 | danielszmulewicz | technomancy: Yes! It looks like Ddpendencies are not picked up when set in production. |
| 18:38 | technomancy | danielszmulewicz: on 2.5.0? |
| 18:39 | danielszmulewicz | correct. |
| 18:39 | technomancy | can you open an issue? |
| 18:39 | danielszmulewicz | Sure. |
| 18:39 | jkj | earlier i hit a problem with lein compiling the aot classes only for uberjar... though i made the profiles exactly the same |
| 18:39 | jkj | didn't find any uberjar magic in code though, so i gave up and blamed sunspots |
| 18:42 | technomancy | uberjar strips out the default profiles, probably in a way that's subtly wrong |
| 18:47 | {blake} | Config info. How to load/store in Clojure. Atom? |
| 18:48 | akurilin | Has anybody ever attempted to turn results of large joins into distinct sets of values once they make it back to clojure? e.g. you select * join tables foo and bar, and when you parse the results you split them into [foos] and [bars] ? |
| 19:42 | justin_smith | akurilin: yes, caribou does this extensively |
| 19:43 | justin_smith | in fact building trees |
| 19:43 | justin_smith | (unless I misunderstand you) |
| 20:20 | mmitchell | how can i add simple annotation to a gen-class? The java equivalent is simply @Stage -- I'm trying this in my gen-class, but not working: :name ^{java.lang.annotation.Target [com.foo.Stage]} classNameHere |
| 20:29 | raspasov_ | hey guys, I'm trying to run lein autoexpect but I'm getting Exception in thread "main" java.lang.AssertionError: Assert failed: (vector? (:dependencies project [])) |
| 20:30 | dbasch | raspasov_: sounds like your project.clj is incorrect |
| 20:30 | raspasov_ | the non auto-refresh command "lein expectations" compiles fine |
| 20:30 | raspasov_ | but as long as I add [lein-autoexpect "1.4.0"] |
| 20:30 | raspasov_ | to :plugins |
| 20:30 | raspasov_ | it errors |
| 20:31 | amalloy | it sounds like the :dependencies in your project are wrong |
| 20:31 | dbasch | paste your project.clj somewhere |
| 20:32 | raspasov_ | https://gist.github.com/raspasov/78d79ba54278d9a28168 |
| 20:33 | raspasov_ | I've been dealing with a bunch of project.clj files in the last 1.5 years - I don't see any apparent problem (my project compiles fine otherwise) |
| 20:33 | raspasov_ | it's just that "lein autoexpect" fails |
| 20:35 | danielcompton | raspasov_: so it compiles with autoexpect in, you just can't run lein autoexpect? |
| 20:35 | raspasov_ | yes |
| 20:36 | danielcompton | raspasov_: can you past the full stacktrace somewhere? |
| 20:36 | danielcompton | paste |
| 20:37 | raspasov_ | https://gist.github.com/raspasov/9c7fda31d0c6cf7dfc3f |
| 20:39 | amalloy | raspasov_: lein-environ looks suspicious |
| 20:39 | amalloy | using lein-jacker, and depending on clojure 1.2.1, makes me think it is super old |
| 20:39 | raspasov_ | hm I think it's out of date |
| 20:39 | raspasov_ | thanks for the hint - let me try upgrading it! |
| 20:47 | dbasch | raspasov_: it’s actually lein-protobuf |
| 20:47 | raspasov_ | yes I just found that |
| 20:48 | raspasov_ | by removing lein-protobuf it seems to work |
| 20:49 | amalloy | dbasch: welllll, whether it is an issue with lein-protobuf or with leinjacker depends on the lein spec |
| 20:50 | amalloy | lein-protobuf converts (rather pointlessly, but that's neither here nor there) :dependencies into a lazy seq rather than a vector, and leinjacker throws up if it finds a non-vector. who is at fault? |
| 20:50 | danielcompton | amalloy: both |
| 20:50 | dbasch | amalloy: lein-protobuf is bringing in an old version of leinjacker, that’s what I meant by “is” :) |
| 20:51 | amalloy | dbasch: whaaaaaat. i barely touched lein-protobuf, but i didn't think we used leinjacker |
| 20:51 | danielcompton | leinjacker should be checking for sequential? instead of vector? |
| 20:51 | amalloy | danielcompton: the newer version in fact does that |
| 20:51 | amalloy | https://github.com/sattvik/leinjacker/commit/a2d631915a2f3adc3f0c68833ceaa72d139a91a1 suggests |
| 20:51 | dbasch | Possibly confusing dependencies found: |
| 20:51 | dbasch | [lein-protobuf "0.4.1"] -> [leinjacker "0.4.0"] |
| 20:51 | amalloy | as of two friggin years ago |
| 20:51 | amalloy | man, it totally does, dbasch. that is so gross |
| 20:52 | amalloy | i guess it must have made sense two years ago, during the lein2 revolution |
| 20:52 | danielcompton | maybe lein autoexpect is at fault for messing with the deps in the first place? |
| 20:53 | amalloy | danielcompton: i believe i've heard technomancy say that messing with deps in a plugin basically always breaks things. otoh, a lot of plugins do it, so i dunno |
| 20:53 | danielcompton | https://github.com/jakemcc/lein-autoexpect/blob/master/autoexpect/src/leiningen/autoexpect.clj#L10-L11 seems unnecessary if the user added them at install time |
| 20:53 | raspasov_ | yea I found some other unrelated github issues around this (vector?) checking |
| 20:54 | mmitchell | ugh, i've tried everything I can think of. If anyone could give me a tip on how to add an annotation to a class via gen-class, it would make my week. |
| 20:54 | danielcompton | talios: ? |
| 20:54 | talios | hullo |
| 20:55 | danielcompton | talios: can you help mmitchell? You're pretty clued up about that kind of stuff |
| 20:55 | raspasov_ | so any idea if I can fix this on the fly? :) |
| 20:55 | danielcompton | raspasov_: the solution to plugins messing with your dependencies is to write your own plugin to put the dependencies back together |
| 20:56 | talios | mmm, annotations - lets think. annotation on the _actual_ class? |
| 20:56 | talios | i.e. @Foo public class xxxx {} |
| 20:56 | talios | hrm - not sure if clojure actually lets you do that - hrm |
| 20:57 | raspasov_ | danielcompton: any way I can maybe bump up the lein-protobuf dependency to leinjacker 0.4.2 |
| 20:57 | raspasov_ | I think this might fix it |
| 20:57 | dbasch | talios: https://github.com/clojure/clojure/blob/master/test/clojure/test_clojure/genclass/examples.clj#L34 |
| 20:57 | raspasov_ | (but not sure) |
| 20:57 | mmitchel_ | sorry lost my connection there. Did I miss anything? :) |
| 20:58 | dbasch | mmitchel_: https://github.com/clojure/clojure/blob/master/test/clojure/test_clojure/genclass/examples.clj#L34 |
| 20:59 | talios | ah you can do it from (gen-class - not :gen-class on the NS - keep forgetting their's the alternative |
| 21:00 | mmitchell | dbasch: thanks, will have a look! |
| 21:01 | mmitchell | dbasch: ok so it's just metadata on the class name? |
| 21:02 | danielcompton | raspasov_: you could try adding leinjacker "0.4.2" to your dependencies, I'm not sure if that will be included. I would guess not because it's being evaluated in leiningen, not your project |
| 21:02 | danielcompton | though |
| 21:02 | raspasov_ | ok thanks! I'll give it a shot |
| 21:02 | dbasch | mmitchell: haven’t tried it but I assume that test passes |
| 21:14 | QPrgrm | hello baby |
| 21:15 | QPrgrm | ==bby |
| 21:34 | seancorfield | dakrone: I had some code using clj-http 0.6.3 that POSTed JPG images to a server - I updated to 1.0.1 and the POSTs no longer work: the POSTed data is no longer a valid image... I've dug through the commit history but don't seem anything obvious that I need to change in my code :( |
| 21:39 | raspasov_ | btw guys I bumped up the leinjacker dependency on lein-protobuf to 0.4.2 and now lein-autoexpect seems to work |
| 21:40 | raspasov_ | sent in this pull request as well https://github.com/ninjudd/lein-protobuf/pull/10/commits |
| 21:45 | akurilin | justin_smith: which part of caribou can I find that in? |
| 21:55 | danielszmulewicz | java.lang.StackOverflowError, compiling clojurescript on one machine. No problem on another. |
| 21:59 | justin_smith | akurilin: caribou.model does that sort of stuff |
| 22:00 | greenyouse | anyone know how to use .lein-classpath for testing leiningen plugins? (to avoid "lein install") |
| 22:02 | akurilin | justin_smith: wow that's a big ass library |
| 22:02 | akurilin | what exactly is caribou again? |
| 22:09 | justin_smith | akurilin: it was developed as a RAD system for webapps |
| 22:09 | justin_smith | akurilin: a replacement for RoR kind of stuff |
| 22:23 | akurilin | justin_smith: googling for RAD system is totally not what I expected to find |
| 22:23 | justin_smith | hah |
| 22:23 | akurilin | justin_smith: so ActiveRecord-style ORM? |
| 22:23 | justin_smith | kind of |
| 22:23 | justin_smith | yeah |
| 22:23 | justin_smith | basically data models defined in clojure edn |
| 22:24 | justin_smith | and that is translated to sql db |
| 22:24 | justin_smith | with a web based admin for defining said models, and making entries |
| 22:24 | justin_smith | and specific webapp stuff like creating pages and assigning controllers / actions / templates via point and click |
| 22:25 | justin_smith | the system reads all the page definitions from the db, and turns it into a running app |
| 22:42 | akurilin | interesting |
| 22:42 | akurilin | that sounds pretty cool |
| 22:43 | akurilin | defininetly and impressive amount of work went into that |
| 22:44 | justin_smith | heh, yeah |
| 22:44 | justin_smith | it was my first clojure project, but I just came in to help a friend |
| 22:45 | justin_smith | many things I would do differently today (as with him, I am sure) |
| 22:45 | justin_smith | it's less active since the company laid us off and stopped using clojure (for client reasons) |
| 22:45 | csd_ | Why does the idiom (when (= (loop (recur)) :continue)) work? Best as I can tell, it works with any keyword. This doesn't appear to be mentioned in the docs. |
| 22:46 | justin_smith | csd_: wait, that looks wrong |
| 22:46 | justin_smith | (loop (recur)) is not valid |
| 22:47 | csd_ | thats truncated |
| 22:47 | justin_smith | OK, I just don't even get what it's truncated from |
| 22:47 | csd_ | or abbreviated rather |
| 22:48 | csd_ | http://pastebin.com/tqj9r6Ac |
| 22:49 | csd_ | i found the idiom searching for how to nest loop statements |
| 22:49 | justin_smith | (when (= :anything) :continue) is absurd |
| 22:49 | justin_smith | it always returns continue |
| 22:49 | justin_smith | err sorry |
| 22:49 | justin_smith | that's not what it is |
| 22:49 | csd_ | the :continue is within the = |
| 22:50 | justin_smith | (when (= x y) :continue) |
| 22:50 | justin_smith | right |
| 22:50 | justin_smith | oh, shit |
| 22:50 | justin_smith | (when (= x continue)) |
| 22:50 | justin_smith | is silly - it always returns nil |
| 22:50 | justin_smith | and the when does nothing, it may as well be do |
| 22:50 | justin_smith | or not be there |
| 22:51 | csd_ | oh i think i see |
| 22:51 | justin_smith | it's actually very odd code, to my eye |
| 22:51 | csd_ | the code within is being evaluated for its side effects, and so it doesnt matter of the test is false because it still gets evaluated |
| 22:51 | justin_smith | right, the when does nothing |
| 22:52 | csd_ | its from http://rosettacode.org/wiki/Loops/Nested#Clojure |
| 22:52 | justin_smith | the return value of = is not making any difference |
| 22:52 | csd_ | I was just lucky that it happened to work for my purposes |
| 22:52 | justin_smith | hehe |
| 22:52 | justin_smith | yeah, that is weird code |
| 22:52 | csd_ | I think its just there to prevent clojure complaining about the second recur statement |
| 22:52 | andyf | i haven?t seen this code, but if the condition of the when is false, the forms in its body will not be executed, side effects or not |
| 22:53 | justin_smith | csd_: ? why would multiple recur statements even matter? |
| 22:53 | justin_smith | andyf: empty body |
| 22:53 | csd_ | i was getting an error about tail recursion earlier |
| 22:53 | justin_smith | it's a when that only has the condition part |
| 22:53 | justin_smith | csd_: the when macro is not going to make a difference there |
| 22:53 | csd_ | oh interesting |
| 22:54 | justin_smith | OK, in print-matrix, there is actually a body in both the when blocks |
| 22:54 | justin_smith | so that makes more sense |
| 22:54 | justin_smith | it's still just common lisp that someone is trying to make clojury |
| 22:54 | justin_smith | it's not really clojure per se |
| 22:54 | justin_smith | I mean it's technically valid... |
| 22:54 | justin_smith | but it's common lisp code |
| 22:55 | andyf | see the code now in csd_'s paste. The loop looks like it always returns nil, so the (= (loop ...) :continue) will always be false. |
| 22:55 | justin_smith | andyf: but it doesn't matter |
| 22:55 | justin_smith | because there is no body |
| 22:55 | justin_smith | and yeah, it will not return :continue |
| 22:55 | andyf | right. So you can remove the outer when, leaving only the loop, and it should do exaclty the same thing. |
| 22:55 | justin_smith | exactly |
| 22:56 | justin_smith | also, the nested when in the rosetta code is silly |
| 22:56 | csd_ | ok you're right that does work |
| 22:57 | justin_smith | ,(= (for [x (range 10) y (range 10)] [x y]) (for [x (range 10)] (for [y (range 10)] [x y]))) |
| 22:57 | clojurebot | false |
| 22:57 | andyf | The rosetta code actually can return :continue from the inner loop, though, so it can make a difference in the overall behavior. |
| 22:57 | justin_smith | err |
| 22:58 | andyf | I'm not saying that I know what the rosetta code is trying to do yet, or how I might write code to achieve the same effect, but at least the comparison to :continue is not always false. |
| 22:58 | justin_smith | ahh, now I see what it was doing |
| 22:58 | justin_smith | andyf: yeah, true that |
| 23:10 | fairuz | justin_smith: hey. I'm still confused about yesterday :( |
| 23:12 | justin_smith | OK... |
| 23:12 | fairuz | I come out with this edn. http://pastebin.com/WhMWdsYU |
| 23:13 | fairuz | Still confused on how to pass the reference to link them |
| 23:16 | justin_smith | ,(def edn '{:create [{:ref ct1 :node { :label "BrandType" :name "type A" :desc "This is a description"}} {:ref ct2 :node { :label "BrandType" :name "type B" :desc "This is a description"}} {:ref ct3 :node { :label "BrandType" :name "type C" :desc "This is a description"}}] :link [{:ref ctl1 :label "BrankLink" :name "isLinkedTo" :nodeA ct1 :nodeB ct2} {:ref ctl2 :label "BrankLink" :name "isLinkedTo" :nodeA ct1 :nodeB ct3} {:ref ctl3 |
| 23:16 | justin_smith | :label "BrankLink" :name "isLinkedTo" :nodeA ct2 :nodeB ct3}]}) |
| 23:16 | clojurebot | #<RuntimeException java.lang.RuntimeException: EOF while reading> |
| 23:16 | justin_smith | err oops |
| 23:16 | justin_smith | too verbose for irc |
| 23:18 | justin_smith | fairuz: so does the graph api take identifiers when making a retrieval or link call? |
| 23:19 | fairuz | For link call yes |
| 23:19 | fairuz | we will get the indentifier when doing retrieval or creating new nodes |
| 23:20 | justin_smith | so you may want something like (map (fn [[n [d]]] (insert n d) n) (group-by :ref (:create edn))) - that will do all the inserts, and then return all symbols inserted |
| 23:20 | justin_smith | oh, the insert returns you identifier... |
| 23:20 | fairuz | yep |
| 23:21 | fairuz | So basically the map in :create should gives me the list of identifiers that I can use in :link |
| 23:21 | justin_smith | so you may want something like (map (fn [[n [d]]] [n (insert n d)]) (group-by :ref (:create edn))) - that sill insert each item, and then return a vector containing the :ref key and the identifier as a pair |
| 23:21 | justin_smith | if you wrap that in (into {} ...) you get a hash map, from :ref key, to the indentifier that was inserted for that key |
| 23:22 | justin_smith | then you can use a lookup |
| 23:23 | justin_smith | (def edn '{:create [{:ref ct1 :node { :label "brtp" :name "type A" :desc "This is a description"}} {:ref ct2 :node { :label "brtp" :name "type B" :desc "This is a description"}} {:ref ct3 :node { :label "brtp" :name "type C" :desc "This is a description"}}] :link [{:ref ctl1 :label "BrankLink" :name "to" :nodeA ct1 :nodeB ct2} {:ref ctl2 :label "BrankLink" :name "to" :nodeA ct1 :nodeB ct3} {:ref ctl3 :label "BrankLink" :name "to" :no |
| 23:23 | justin_smith | ct2 :nodeB ct3}]}) |
| 23:23 | justin_smith | man, still too long |
| 23:23 | justin_smith | ,(def edn '{:create [{:ref ct1 :node { :label "brtp" :name "type A" :desc "This is a description"}} {:ref ct2 :node { :label "brtp" :name "type B" :desc ""}} {:ref ct3 :node { :label "brtp" :name "type C"}}] :link [{:ref ctl1 :label "BrankLink" :name "to" :nodeA ct1 :nodeB ct2} {:ref ctl2 :label "BrankLink" :name "to" :nodeA ct1 :nodeB ct3} {:ref ctl3 :label "BrankLink" :name "to" :nodeA ct2 :nodeB ct3}]}) |
| 23:23 | clojurebot | #'sandbox/edn |
| 23:24 | justin_smith | ,(into {} (map (fn [[n [d]]] [n (hash d)]) (group-by :ref (:create edn)))) |
| 23:24 | clojurebot | {ct1 1330914623, ct2 -568547736, ct3 -302159458} |
| 23:24 | justin_smith | that's pretending that "hash" is the function that returns you identifier |
| 23:25 | justin_smith | now you can use that map to lookup id from key, right? |
| 23:26 | fairuz | yep! |
| 23:26 | fairuz | need some time to digest and test :) |
| 23:26 | justin_smith | you can do a doseq (or if you consume the results, a map) to create links |
| 23:26 | justin_smith | right |
| 23:26 | justin_smith | that destructuring is a bit funky to be sure |
| 23:27 | justin_smith | [[n [d]]] is taking a hash-entry [k v] and extracting the key, calling it n, and then getting the first entry of the value, calling that first entry v |
| 23:28 | fairuz | *in my mind* whattttt |
| 23:28 | fairuz | :) |
| 23:29 | justin_smith | ,(let [[[n [d]]] '(a '(b c d))] {:n n :d d}) |
| 23:29 | clojurebot | #<UnsupportedOperationException java.lang.UnsupportedOperationException: nth not supported on this type: Symbol> |
| 23:29 | justin_smith | err |
| 23:29 | justin_smith | ,(let [[n [d]] '(a '(b c d))] {:n n :d d}) |
| 23:29 | clojurebot | {:n a, :d quote} |
| 23:29 | justin_smith | there we go (and oops |
| 23:29 | justin_smith | ) |
| 23:29 | justin_smith | ,(let [[n [d]] '(a (b c d))] {:n n :d d}) |
| 23:29 | clojurebot | {:n a, :d b} |
| 23:29 | justin_smith | maybe that helps? |
| 23:35 | fairuz | hmm, I'm not getting the last one |
| 23:37 | arrdem | besides exist, what do the Clojure docs not do for you? |
| 23:38 | arrdem | search I suspect is gonna be the big one |
| 23:40 | justin_smith | ,(let [[n [d]] '(a (b))] {:n n :d d}); fairuz - what about this? |
| 23:40 | clojurebot | {:n a, :d b} |
