#clojure – 2008-12-26

2008-12-26

00:30	lisppaste8	holmak pasted "Math/sqrt failure" at http://paste.lisp.org/display/72665
00:30	holmak	Clojure won't let me use Math/sqrt from the Java library - any idea why that would happen?
00:31	holmak	It works perfectly well when I type it directly in the REPL, but not if I try to defn a function or use it in a file.
00:31	holmak	I have the latest version of Clojure, 1162.
03:03	yangsx	I've come across this strange error java.lang.IncompatibleClassChangeError after defining a function and evaulating it at slime-repl
03:04	hiredman	what function
03:05	hiredman	lisppaste8: url
03:05	lisppaste8	To use the lisppaste bot, visit http://paste.lisp.org/new/clojure and enter your paste.
03:05	yangsx	Is it a bug with my function or the compiler?
03:05	hiredman	bug your function
03:06	hiredman	it manes you tried to use something as something it cannot be
03:06	hiredman	means
03:14	yangsx	hiredman: thanks, I'll review my code once more.
03:16	hiredman	,(name ns)
03:16	clojurebot	java.lang.IncompatibleClassChangeError (NO_SOURCE_FILE:0)
03:42	yangsx	hiredman: my error was due to use disj as dissoc by mistake
03:43	yangsx	btw, is there a Clojure counterpart of CL's subseq?
03:46	hoeck	yangsx: there is subvec for vectors
03:48	hoeck	yangsx: and subseq :)
03:51	yangsx	hoeck: my data structures happen to be a vector, thanks. I was looking for samething general for seq in vain.
04:12	Lau_of_DK	Good morning all
04:15	hoeck	good morning Lau_of_DK
04:55	Lau_of_DK	Since assoc doesnt work, how do I change a key/val pair in a PersistantArrayMap ?
05:10	hoeck	Lau_of_DK: not shure what you mean, assoc works on PersistantArrayMap too
10:46	hiredman	clojurebot: ping
10:46	clojurebot	PONG!
12:16	chrisn	hello?
12:19	hiredman	clojurebot: java?
12:19	clojurebot	hmm... sounds like your out of heap space
12:20	hiredman	clojurebot: java is <reply>?
12:20	clojurebot	Roger.
12:37	danlarkin	clojurebot: java
12:37	clojurebot	?
12:37	wwmorgan	Does a function already exist that does this? (foo 3 [:a :b]) => ((:a :a :a) (:a :a :b) (:a :b :a) (:a :b :b) (:b :a :a) (:b :a :b) (:b :b :a) (:b :b :b))
14:08	Lau_of_DK	Slow night... anyone working on anything interesting? :)
14:10	Kerris7	Lau_of_DK: I'm planning to port Lisp in Small Pieces to Clojure
14:10	Lau_of_DK	How do you mean ?
14:10	Kerris7	I just want universities to start teaching Lisp again :(
14:10	Lau_of_DK	But you do realise that Clojure is a Lisp right? :)
14:11	Kerris7	Yeah, it's mostly a syntax thing
14:11	Kerris7	I daresay Clojure is the most accessible Lisp at the moment
14:11	Lau_of_DK	k, got a public repo somewhere?
14:11	Kerris7	therefore* it would be a boon to have educational material using Clojure syntax
14:12	Kerris7	*just had dinner, can't really think straight
14:13	Kerris7	Lau_of_DK: would something like Stuart Holloway's Practical Lisp port do?
14:13	Lau_of_DK	In terms of providing teaching-material?
14:14	Kerris7	yeah, also in terms of public repo, i.e. using github
14:15	Lau_of_DK	oh... In terms of the material I dont know, havent read the book, but Github is :)~
14:27	chrisn	don't mix opengl and lazy evaluation
14:28	chrisn	next thing you know you get a hardcore crash because the opengl calls get evaluated in a thread with no active context
14:30	chrisn	I have a couple buddies working through "the structure and interpretation of computer programs" http://mitpress.mit.edu/sicp/full-text/book/book.html
14:31	chrisn	They are doing it in scheme, I think. If we had that, we wouldn't need much else.
14:35	Lau_of_DK	chrisn: You said OpenGL and SICP in the same sentense ?
14:35	chrisn	nope
14:35	chrisn	first two comments were exasperation
14:35	chrisn	second two were chiming in
14:35	chrisn	sry
14:41	Lau_of_DK	clojurebot: SICP?
14:41	clojurebot	Pardon?
14:41	Lau_of_DK	chrisn: I think I remember seeing an whole site with conversions from Scheme/SICP to Clojure
14:42	Kerris7	Lau_of_DK: http://codepoetics.com/wiki/index.php?title=Topics:SICP_in_other_languages ?
14:42	chrisn	hah
14:42	chrisn	yep
14:45	Lau_of_DK	That looks like it... though they ported it to C++ I see... they really must have missed the point of that lecture
14:45	Kerris7	I'm only planning the Lisp in Small Pieces port at the moment, the strongest candidate I'm considering for a Lisp to Clojure port would be Simply Scheme
14:46	Lau_of_DK	Im looking forward to seeing what you come up with
14:47	chrisn	C++ involved a lot of extremely smart people who were amazingly adept at missing the point.
14:48	chrisn	So did Java.
14:48	Lau_of_DK	hehe, looks like that happend to Ruby as well
14:58	aperotte	hello all
15:06	Lau_of_DK	Hi aperotte
15:08	aperotte	seems like things are a little slow on the channel today
15:11	Lau_of_DK	Very, almost unbearable :)
15:11	aperotte	hahaha
15:12	aperotte	have you been working on a clojure project?
15:14	Lau_of_DK	yea
15:21	aperotte	what kind of project is it ... if you don't mind me asking
15:25	aperotte	Lau_of_DK: I'll be back in a few
15:32	Lau_of_DK	aperotte: Me and kotarak have been hacking away at ClojureQL, an attempt at turning SQL statements into higher order functions
15:33	Lau_of_DK	dk.bestinclass.clojureql> (execute (sql (query [id name language iq]
15:33	Lau_of_DK	developers.employees
15:33	Lau_of_DK	(< iq 100))))
15:33	Lau_of_DK	{:iq 85, :language Python, :name Frank, :id 1}
15:33	Lau_of_DK
15:34	aperotte	Lau_of_DK: haha ... very nice
15:34	aperotte	Lau_of_DK: I haven't used SQL much or done much web programming at all, but sounds cool
15:35	Lau_of_DK	yea it'll be nice when its done
15:36	aperotte	have you looked at compojure at all?
15:37	Lau_of_DK	Of course
15:40	Lau_of_DK	Did you think that the two are related aperotte ?
15:41	dudleyf	Lau_of_DK: Is the source up anywhere?
15:41	aperotte	not really, I've been keeping an eye on compojure
15:41	aperotte	I'd like to try my hand at web programming once there's more documentation
15:41	Lau_of_DK	dudleyf: http://github.com/Lau-of-DK/clojureql/tree/master
15:41	Chousuke	Lau_of_DK: do you have any plans regarding input sanitisation with clojureql
15:42	dudleyf	Lau_of_DK: Thanks
15:42	aperotte	I hadn't seen any mention of clojureQL on their site, so I didn't think it
15:42	Lau_of_DK	aperotte: In this game, I wouldnt wait for the docs :)
15:42	Lau_of_DK	But Compojure is cool, so you can dig into it
15:42	Lau_of_DK	ClojureQL is not web-related, its only for databases, so that
15:42	Lau_of_DK	SELECT id,name FROM database1 WHERE id = 5
15:42	Lau_of_DK	becomes
15:43	Lau_of_DK	(sql (query [id name] database1 (= id 5)))
15:43	Lau_of_DK	Chousuke: In which way to you mean sanitisation ?
15:44	Chousuke	like, if you wanted that 5 to depend on user input somehow
15:44	chrisn	how do I type my variables in clojure again?
15:45	chrisn	I think I am running into some lag doing generic lookups on an interface where I know the type
15:45	Chousuke	I guess you could use clojureql to generate SQL with placeholders
15:45	Lau_of_DK	Chousuke: We're implementing it with unquote, so that you could do (let [x 5] (sql (query id table1 (= id ~x))))
15:45	Chousuke	Lau_of_DK: yes but that's dangerous
15:45	Lau_of_DK	What do you fear ?
15:45	Chousuke	x being something like bobby tables' name :P
15:46	Lau_of_DK	haha
15:46	Lau_of_DK	But thats not really my concern is it? If you choose to fire a script with unvalidated data, then thats your call as a developer
15:47	dudleyf	Lau_of_DK: Since databases have mechanisms for avoiding injection like that,
15:48	dudleyf	if you're implementing a database library, it is your concern, I think
15:48	Chousuke	I mean constructs like INSERT INTO foo VALUES (?,?,?,?) and then using some programming language function to execute that query with supplied values
15:49	chrisn	(for [#^float i (range -50 50) #^float j (range -50 50)]
15:49	chrisn	Something like that?
15:50	dudleyf	I guess it depends on whether your library is a database interface or just a sql string generation library
15:50	dudleyf	But I imagine that line gets pretty blurry
15:50	Lau_of_DK	dudleyf: We're sending everything through with JDBC, if that makes a difference
15:51	Lau_of_DK	Chousuke: Your statement would be (sql (insert foo [x y z] [~x ~y ~z])) But what you bind those vars to, is totally up to you
15:51	dudleyf	Lau_of_DK: Then I would think you'd want to allow for PreparedStatements and such
15:52	Chousuke	Lau_of_DK: but what kind of sql does that generate?
15:52	Lau_of_DK	I mean, even JDBC will let you destroy your DB if you want, I really dont see why I should police that
15:52	Lau_of_DK	That would expand into INSERT INTO foo VALUES (x, y, z) ' and then the literal evalutated values of those vars, at the time of using (sql ..)
15:52	Chousuke	Lau_of_DK: if it generates INSERT INTO foo values (x, y, z) then it's dangerous unles x, y and z are all "?"
15:53	Lau_of_DK	dudleyf: Everything gets fitted into a preparedstatement
15:53	Lau_of_DK	Why dangerous? they're all seperately stored when you unquote them
15:53	Chousuke	separately stored?
15:53	Chousuke	they're dangerous becuase they become part of the SQL string
15:54	Chousuke	user-supplied values should never be part of the SQL string. That's why placeholders exist.
15:54	Lau_of_DK	I think we end up paramterizing (?) them, so that in the SQL string theyre @x @y @z
15:54	Lau_of_DK	And then we add them to a prepared statement
15:54	Chousuke	ah, that sounds like it's safe.
15:57	Chousuke	so you do something like PreparedStatement("INSERT INTO FOO VALUES (@x, @y, @z)").executeWithParameters(x,y,z)? (pseudocode, I can't remember the api right now)
15:58	Lau_of_DK	Yes
15:59	Lau_of_DK	I can dig it up for you if you want, one sedc
15:59	Chousuke	sounds good
15:59	Lau_of_DK	SqlConnection conn = new SqlConnection(_connectionString);
15:59	Lau_of_DK	conn.Open();
15:59	Lau_of_DK	string s = "SELECT email, passwd, login_id, full_name " +
15:59	Lau_of_DK	"FROM members WHERE email = @email";
15:59	Lau_of_DK	SqlCommand cmd = new SqlCommand(s);
15:59	Lau_of_DK	cmd.Parameters.Add("@email", email);
15:59	Lau_of_DK	SqlDataReader reader = cmd.ExecuteReader();
15:59	Lau_of_DK
15:59	Chousuke	right.
15:59	Lau_of_DK	Can I stamp it "Approved by the Chousuke" ? :)
16:00	Chousuke	yes.
16:00	Lau_of_DK	Sweet
16:00	Chousuke	seriously though, that looks really cool :)
16:01	dudleyf	Wait, where did that come from?
16:02	Lau_of_DK	I got the idea/link from someone in here a few days ago
16:02	Lau_of_DK	http://www.codinghorror.com/blog/archives/000275.html
16:03	dudleyf	I was looking for it in the github repo you posted earlier, but I didn't see that
16:03	Lau_of_DK	Oh, We've only just got Query working, now moving on to INSERT :)
16:03	Lau_of_DK	But Query actually works almost perfectly now, which is sweet
16:04	dudleyf	Awesome
16:04	Lau_of_DK	(execute (sql (query [id name iq] developers.employees (or (and (> id 3) (< id 5)) (and (> id 8) (< id 10))))))
16:04	Lau_of_DK	{:iq 100, :name Mark, :id 4}
16:04	Lau_of_DK	{:iq 100, :name Arnold, :id 9}
16:05	Lau_of_DK	Thats a pretty nested WHERE clauses, yet is compiled like it should
16:29	chrisn	found an awesome bomb in gllpanel
16:29	chrisn	It destroys the gl context sometimes when resizing.
16:29	chrisn	Meaning you have to reload all buffers; be they textures, glsl programs, etc.
16:31	Lau_of_DK	Any egg users here?
16:35	tyusupov	quit
17:48	nomothetis	Hi all. Can someone help me with setting up classpaths for some tests that I'm trying to write for my application?
17:49	Lau_of_DK	Shoot
17:49	nomothetis	ok.
17:49	nomothetis	So right now, I have a folder that contains the source file rumi-logic.clj.
17:50	nomothetis	I want to write tests using the fact.clj library.
17:50	nomothetis	Which i've put in ext/fact.clj
17:50	nomothetis	and I want to write tests for my functionality in test/rumi-logic-test.clj
17:50	nomothetis	I'm trying to run rumi-logic-test.clj from the REPL that I started in the ~ folder.
17:51	nomothetis	(~ being the root development folder, where rumi-logic.clj is)
17:51	nomothetis	I thought taht this:
17:51	nomothetis	(ns rumi-logic-test
17:51	nomothetis	(:require rumi-logic ext.fact))
17:51	nomothetis	would work.
17:52	nomothetis	But it tells me that it cannot locate rumi_logic_init.class or rumi_logic.lj.
17:52	nomothetis	(the code is in the rumi-logic-test.clj file).
17:52	nomothetis	I'm obviously completely misunderstanding how things work, so I was hoping someone would explain it to me.
17:52	Chousuke	nomothetis: the file must use underscores instead of dashes
17:52	Chousuke	file name that is
17:53	nomothetis	really? Interesting.
17:53	nomothetis	ok, let me try that.
17:53	Chousuke	so namespace foo.bar-zonk = foo/bar_zonk.clj
17:53	Lau_of_DK	if ~/ is in your classpath, then you can put test.clj in ~/src/nomo/rumi/test.clj, then you can require nomo.rumi.test), and test.clj but also start with (ns nomo.rumi.test)
17:53	Lau_of_DK	If Im mistaken, The Chousuke can correct me
17:54	Chousuke	otherwise correct, but it must be ~/src/ in the namespace :)
17:54	Chousuke	er
17:54	Chousuke	classpath
17:54	nomothetis	@Lau_of_DK: Alright, i'm going to change the names, and then I'll try what you said. I'll let you guys know how it coes. Thanks.
17:55	Lau_of_DK	kthxbye
17:56	Chousuke	nomothetis: use the directory layout and naming here as an example: http://github.com/Chousuke/clojurebot
17:57	Lau_of_DK	Chousuke: Are you now maintaining the clojurebot, or have you just forked it?
17:57	Lau_of_DK	For your own coding pleasure
17:58	Chousuke	well I made the github project of it, and hiredman forked it to make a github project for himself too :P
17:58	Lau_of_DK	oh :)
17:58	Lau_of_DK	clojurebot: where are you ?
17:58	clojurebot	http://github.com/hiredman/clojurebot/tree/master
17:58	Lau_of_DK	aha
17:59	Chousuke	the clojurebot here is still "version 1" unless I'm mistaken
17:59	Lau_of_DK	clojurebot: version?
17:59	clojurebot	Gabh mo leithsc�al?
17:59	Lau_of_DK	clojurebot: rev?
17:59	clojurebot	Gabh mo leithsc�al?
17:59	Chousuke	which is just fine, as I haven't yet really improved it. just did some restructuring of the code
17:59	Lau_of_DK	,(map println (range 10))
17:59	clojurebot	(nil nil nil nil nil nil nil nil nil nil)
18:00	Lau_of_DK	k
18:01	Chousuke	could probably make the svn stuff not depend on running the actual svn executable (instead make it work with a java library or something)
18:02	Lau_of_DK	,(doseq [i (range 5)] (println i) (Thread/sleep 100))
18:02	clojurebot	0 1 2 3 4
18:02	Lau_of_DK	Chousuke: When did SVN get tried into this ?
18:02	Chousuke	tried?
18:02	Chousuke	clojurebot: latest?
18:02	clojurebot	latest is 1185
18:02	Lau_of_DK	tied
18:02	Chousuke	svn rev 1185
18:03	Chousuke	Lau_of_DK: clojurebot actually runs the svn command
18:03	Lau_of_DK	oh ok
18:03	Chousuke	... or at least, it should
18:03	Chousuke	looks like it's not working
18:03	Chousuke	clojurebot: svn rev 1185
18:03	clojurebot	hiredman.clojurebot$term__102@15f157b is http://clojure.googlecode.com/svn/trunk/
18:03	Chousuke	.. hm
18:03	Chousuke	that's... not right. :)
18:04	Lau_of_DK	you mean SVN in general or? .. :)
18:04	Chousuke	the weird java signature thingy :P
18:05	Chousuke	I still need to work on the dispatch stuff for my version though. it selects the first method that matches, so the order of lookup matters :/
18:06	Lau_of_DK	how will you work around it?
18:06	Chousuke	don't know yet
18:13	nomothetis	ok, I got it working. Thanks guys! I appreciate the help.
18:14	Lau_of_DK	:D
18:16	nomothetis	quick question: is there a way to find out, from the REPL, what the location the REPL was launched from was?
18:19	chrisn	(. (java.io.File. ",") getCanonicalPath)
18:21	Chousuke	,?
18:21	nomothetis	cool, thanks.
18:22	Lau_of_DK	Try (System/getProperty "user.dir")
18:22	chrisn	ignore dk. Do what I said.
18:22	nomothetis	that works as well.
18:24	Lau_of_DK	http://java.sun.com/j2se/1.4.2/docs/api/java/lang/System.html
18:27	Chousuke	except using "." is evil
18:27	Lau_of_DK	Evil you say ?
18:28	Chousuke	yes, evil
18:28	Chousuke	.. is twice as evil
18:28	Lau_of_DK	oh, you're talking about chrisn attempt to produce code?
18:29	Chousuke	yes.
18:29	Lau_of_DK	Oh ok ... :D
18:30	chrisn	why is . evil?
18:30	Lau_of_DK	Its primarily because The Chousuke said so
18:31	Chousuke	mostly, yeah. but lisp forms are supposed to begin with an operator, and . is not a very informative operator.
18:31	Chousuke	it just says "java interop is going to happen"
18:32	Lau_of_DK	I second that critique
18:33	Lau_of_DK	But chrisn, that important thing is that you tried, and I encourage you to keep going :)
18:33	Chousuke	yeah, well, you can keep on using .
18:34	Chousuke	I just like the .field syntax much more :)
18:35	chrisn	I wish (.field obj) would return something you could apply
18:36	chrisn	I was wondering how to get a member function pointer, at it appears you have to use reflection
18:36	Lau_of_DK	(apply #(Class/function %) ...) ?
18:36	chrisn	does that work for instance functions?
18:37	Chousuke	there's (memfn method)
18:37	Chousuke	it still requires the object attribute though
18:37	Chousuke	but (partial (memfn method) obj) won't :)
18:38	chrisn	That is exactly what I wanted.
18:38	Chousuke	I think Rich might be considering making ".foo" things auto-memfn whenever it makes sense.
18:38	chrisn	no thanks to lau
18:38	chrisn	:)
18:39	Chousuke	so you could map java methods "directly" instead of wrapping them in memfn
18:39	Lau_of_DK	man youre coming down hard on me tonight
18:39	Chousuke	but memfn isn't too much work for now
18:40	chrisn	http://gpwiki.org/index.php/OpenGL:Codes:Simple_GLSL_example
18:40	chrisn	I just got that working on clojure
18:40	chrisn	in
18:40	Chousuke	hmm
18:40	Lau_of_DK	Post the code
18:40	chrisn	But the code looks like shit because the jogl gl interface is difficult to work with
18:41	chrisn	dude.
18:41	Chousuke	opengl is probably not the best fit for a functional language either :)
18:41	Lau_of_DK	Alternative, modify the wiki page with your code, and remove the old
18:41	chrisn	http://github.com/cnuernber/lambinator/tree/master/src/lambinator
18:42	chrisn	there is the code. I am trying to set up a good environment for trying out some different ideas I have about rendering
18:42	chrisn	Probably nothing that actually does anything is a good fit for a functional language
18:43	Lau_of_DK	thanks
18:43	Chousuke	chrisn: hah
18:44	Chousuke	funcctional style actually works with many problems.
18:45	Lau_of_DK	chrisn: you're code compiles fine but dont run
18:45	chrisn	I can't believe it compiled.
18:45	Chousuke	a big problem with functional programmin is that it's very different from imperative style; you don't actually control the machine directly.
18:45	Lau_of_DK	java -jar lambinator.jar
18:45	Lau_of_DK	Failed to load Main-Class manifest attribute from
18:45	Lau_of_DK	lambinator.jar
18:45	Lau_of_DK
18:45	chrisn	You have to just run from the repl
18:45	Lau_of_DK	which one of those ~100 files do you want me to run ?
18:45	Chousuke	or rather, that's not a problem with functional programming; it's a problem with programmers.
18:45	chrisn	get it loaded into the repl, ensure have have jogl
18:45	chrisn	the jar file
18:46	chrisn	check out the repl test file
18:46	Lau_of_DK	k
18:46	Chousuke	the bigger problem is that most existing code is not really compatible with a functional programming style
18:46	chrisn	it contains some halfway stuff.
18:46	chrisn	That seems like an assumption, Chousuke.
18:47	Chousuke	well, it is.
18:47	Chousuke	but I'm fairly sure it's true enough
18:47	chrisn	lau: you have to create an app frame
18:47	chrisn	(def fm (lambinator.ui/create_app_frame "lau is crazy"))
18:47	chrisn	Get that far.
18:48	Lau_of_DK	chrisn: Sorry I have to get to bed, I'll check it out tomorrow
18:48	chrisn	Then go to the about box and check out your opengl extensions
18:48	chrisn	lates.
18:48	Lau_of_DK	:\|
18:48	chrisn	Lau is nonplussed.
18:48	chrisn	I think the larger problems is all the bullshit people hear about functional programming
18:49	chrisn	I have tried to evangelize it in various places.
18:49	chrisn	Usually I get really strange responses.
18:50	chrisn	Its time has come, however.
18:50	chrisn	The largest problem with programming is how popular C-based languages are in general.
18:50	chrisn	People all think about problems in only very certain ways.
18:50	Chousuke	well, yeah
18:51	Chousuke	languages grew up in an environment where software had to be fast and the only way to be fast was to control the hardware directly.
18:51	Chousuke	nowadays, that's no longer true.
18:52	Chousuke	but the damage is done
18:52	chrisn	It was never true as true as people thought it was unless you were on a commodore 64 or something like that. A complex system is never fast due to the language. If it is fast, it is due to good design.
18:53	chrisn	no kidding
18:53	Chousuke	yeah, but they simply didn't have to tools to make functional languages go as fast as imperative, direct-control languages.
18:54	chrisn	only in very certain cases. LISP has had types and binary compilation forever.
18:54	chrisn	although it isn't functional, I guess.
18:54	Chousuke	I guess that wasn't early enough :/
18:54	chrisn	heh
18:55	Chousuke	the growing number of multicore systems might help functional programming style gain more followers though
19:36	chrisn	Is there a function that returns both the passing and failures of a filter function?
19:36	chrisn	In two separate seqs?
19:36	gnuvince	chrisn: there's something in clojure-contrib
19:36	chrisn	I have that
19:36	chrisn	?
19:36	chrisn	name?
19:36	gnuvince	hang on
19:36	gnuvince	looking for the name
19:36	gnuvince	separate
19:37	gnuvince	(doc separate)
19:37	clojurebot	I don't understand.
19:38	chrisn	heh
19:38	chrisn	thanks
19:38	gnuvince	happy to help
19:48	gnuvince	hmmm
19:48	gnuvince	weird...
19:48	gnuvince	I can't use it...
19:52	nomothetis	Is anyone familiar with the Fact unit testing library?
19:52	gnuvince	How come i don't see anything with (ns-publics 'clojure.contrib.seq-utils)
19:52	gnuvince	?
20:09	mib_4tvgjgnr	hello?
20:13	gnuvince	mib_4tvgjgnr: hi
20:14	danlarkin	mib_4tvgjgnr: greetings!
20:15	mib_4tvgjgnr	mmm it's my first time on the clojure room
20:15	mib_4tvgjgnr	is it usually pretty lively?
20:35	danlarkin	people always leave before I can answer them :-/
20:57	kabny	Im reading the wikipedia article on monte carlo methods(implemented the pi-approximation algorithm before) http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Monte_Carlo_method. but what Im not sure of is if it makes any sense to generalize the algorithm. ie is it possible to abstract out most of it or do I kind of have to rewrite everything for each different monte carlo simulation I want to do?
20:58	kabny	also, which is the best java lib for doing simple 2d graphics(still and moving)? like pythons pygame... is it swing or that is just GUIs?
21:00	chrisn	If you use swing then you can use openGL later if you want more pizzaz
21:04	kabny	but opengl seems so complicated to just the simpel stuff even
21:04	chrisn	it is
21:04	chrisn	the key word was later
21:05	chrisn	swing has a 2d rendering library
21:05	chrisn	You don't have to use widgets.
21:06	chrisn	create a jpanel with nothing in it and overload the paint method with something you care about