#clojure – 2008-12-13

2008-12-13

00:01	gp	why is he callling max in his function though? seems liek a mistake
00:02	Chouser	good point. I'm sure it's a typo
00:43	gp	why arent tags and metadata between functionname and argslist?
00:46	Chouser	functions can take multiple arglists, but the metadata goes is for all of them and attached to the var.
00:48	Chouser	(defn #^Integer foo "returns int" ([x] (Integer. x)) ([x y] (+ x y)))
00:53	gp	user=> (= '(1 2) [1 2])
00:53	gp	true
00:53	gp	does that really make sense?
00:54	gp	Chouser: but that doesnt change the fact that you cpuld put the meata data between f-name and argslist
00:54	gp	is there a program to run unittests on all functions ina file?
00:55	Chouser	hm, that is a bit surprising: (= '(1 2) [1 2] (first {1 2}))
00:56	Chouser	gp: I suppose you could, but between which fn-name and which arglist?
00:58	Chouser	gp: (clojure.contrib.test-is/test-ns 'my-ns)
00:59	Chouser	test-ns runs all tests in a namespace.
01:11	gp	hmm having tests inside a function is pretty ugly though, is there unittesting framework too?
01:12	Chouser	test-is provides deftest and some helpful functions.
01:13	Chouser	There are other frameworks as well, such as "fact": http://groups.google.com/group/clojure/browse_thread/thread/193023afbf87698d
01:21	danlarkin	I am liking just using deftest
06:55	ben1	how can I output the current time in clojure?
07:00	StartsWithK	ben1: http://www.rgagnon.com/javadetails/java-0106.html
09:54	fanda	hello all!
09:54	fanda	could you help me please a little?
09:54	fanda	i am trying to write a function which transforms
09:54	fanda	(def data '("a" "b" 1 2 "c" 3 "d" "e" "f" 4 5))
09:54	fanda	into
09:54	fanda	=> [["a"] ["b" 1 2] ["c" 3] ["d"] ["e"] ["f" 4 5]]
09:54	fanda	it generally groups strings and numbers together
09:55	fanda	i tried loop/recur, but not there yet :-(
09:57	fanda	this goes well with iteration idioms: http://groups.google.com/group/clojure/browse_thread/thread/fa9859614535f634
09:57	fanda	:-)
10:06	alphazero	hi all, need some help with newb questions.
10:08	rhickey	fanda: http://paste.lisp.org/display/72092
10:09	RSchulz	Is there a built-in fn that simply returns true unconditionally?
10:10	rhickey	(doc constantly)
10:10	clojurebot	Returns a function that takes any number of arguments and returns x.; arglists ([x])
10:10	rhickey	so, (constantly true)
10:10	fanda	rhickey: thanks for the help!
10:11	rhickey	fanda: sure
10:11	rhickey	no one's done partition-when yet?
10:12	alphazero	one is regarding import. Don't understand what is happening in REPL but why does it seem to need full java class name after an import?
10:12	RSchulz	rhickey: Thanks.
10:12	alphazero	(import '(import java.util.HashMap))
10:12	alphazero	(new HashMap) => java.lang.IllegalArgumentException: Unable to resolve classname: HashMap (NO_SOURCE_FILE:9)
10:12	rhickey	(import '(java,util HashMap)) note space before HashMap
10:13	alphazero	rhichey: Oh! thanks.
10:13	pjb3	I'm trying to learn how to use zippers
10:13	pjb3	given this xml doc: http://paste.lisp.org/display/72095
10:13	pjb3	I can get the name of each bucket with the XPath query '/ListAllMyBucketsResult/Buckets/Bucket/Name'
10:13	pjb3	With a zipper, how do you do something like that?
10:14	pjb3	Seems to have only the direction methods, not ones for looking for children with certain names
10:14	alphazero	Next question is given:
10:14	alphazero	(def jmap (new HashMap))
10:14	alphazero	(.put jmap :key :value)
10:16	alphazero	is there any way to specify the 'put' method reflectively?
10:16	rhickey	pjb3: did you look at Chouser's zip-filter?
10:17	pjb3	no, is that in clojure-contrib?
10:17	rhickey	pjb3: zip is pretty much just nav, zip-filter adds search
10:17	rhickey	http://clojure-contrib.svn.sourceforge.net/viewvc/clojure-contrib/trunk/src/clojure/contrib/zip_filter.clj?revision=239&view=markup
10:18	rhickey	and: http://clojure-contrib.svn.sourceforge.net/viewvc/clojure-contrib/trunk/src/clojure/contrib/zip_filter/xml.clj?revision=256&view=markup
10:20	Zephtar	I saw that there was a discussion of Xronos yesterday, but I was away from my computer at the time.
10:20	Zephtar	I maintain the project and would be glad to answer any questions.
10:47	pjb3	Nice, the answer to the aforementioned question of how do I do the Xpath Query:
10:48	pjb3	/ListAllMyBucketsResult/Buckets/Bucket/Name
10:48	pjb3	in clojure, is:
10:48	pjb3	(xml-> ex :Buckets :Bucket :Name text)
10:49	pjb3	where ex is the xml-zip
12:05	csf	Is there a problem in the Slime REPL when getting user input - specifially (read-line)? It never returns
12:56	arohner	has anyone tried running htmlunit from clojure?
12:56	arohner	I'm getting some kind of classloader issue
13:22	danlarkin	this is amusing, http://jonex.info/dump/yolisp.jpg
13:24	arohner	gah. Why is it that code can break when switching class loaders?
13:42	Chouser	Should .clj files in clojure-contrib be more explicit about being part of the Clojure project, such that the CAs are enforcable?
14:14	rhickey	Chouser: sure
14:14	Zephtar	I saw that there was a discussion of Xronos yesterday, but I was away from my computer at the time.
14:15	Zephtar	I maintain the project and would be glad to answer any questions.
14:27	drewr	What do you guys like for doing SOAP?
14:33	clojurebot	svn rev 1159; proxy perf tweaks Note breaking change if you are using the proxy interface other than the proxy macro itself - proxy maps are now maps of (preferably interned) strings to fns, not symbols to fns, and if you construct a proxy manually you must establish initial map with init-proxy
14:57	RSchulz	rhickey_: Possible trouble in SVN 1159:
14:57	RSchulz	Sorry. Here it is:
14:57	RSchulz	java.lang.AbstractMethodError: clojure.proxy.java.util.concurrent.atomic.AtomicReference$IRef.__initClojureFnMappings(Lclojure/lang/IPersistentMap;)V (repl_ln.clj:65)
14:57	RSchulz	Happens upon start-up
14:59	drewr	He warned that there might be a breaking change.
14:59	RSchulz	Caused by: java.lang.AbstractMethodError: clojure.proxy.java.util.concurrent.atomic.AtomicReference$IRef.__initClojureFnMappings(Lclojure/lang/IPersistentMap;)V
14:59	RSchulz	OK. Just reporting.
15:00	rhickey_	RSchulz: startup of what?
15:00	RSchulz	Clojure REPL
15:00	rhickey_	ant clean?
15:00	RSchulz	No. Just default build. Hang on...
15:01	RSchulz	OK. False alarm. Sorry.
15:32	Lau_of_DK	Evenings gents
15:33	danm_	hello
15:37	Zephtar	lau: good evening
15:37	Zephtar	damn_: hello
15:40	danm_	what's up?
15:44	mfredrickson	i seem to have consistent issues with doto
15:44	mfredrickson	I'm following along with http://clojure.org/jvm_hosted
15:45	RSchulz	Lau_of_DK: You seem confused. It's early afternoon.
15:45	Lau_of_DK	Oh, right... Im besides myself, sorry
15:48	mfredrickson	but I always get "java.lang.Exception: Unable to resolve symbol: setSize in this context (NO_SOURCE_FILE:50)
15:48	mfredrickson	Or whatever the first action in the (doto f ...) call is
15:48	RSchulz	mfredrickson: Odd. I was just seeing something similar with (new FileWriter ...)
15:49	RSchulz	I assumed it was my problem, but I haven't figured it out yet.
15:49	Lau_of_DK	Schulzy, you still use the new keyword?
15:49	RSchulz	I do have an import for (java.io FileWriter)
15:49	RSchulz	I was right now.
15:50	Lau_of_DK	Cute
15:50	RSchulz	Same thing if I do (FileWriter. file-name)
15:50	RSchulz	That's the new syntax, right?
15:51	Lau_of_DK	I wouldnt say 'new' anymore, but yea, its more recent
15:51	Zephtar	What is the official #clojure timezone?
15:52	RSchulz	Earth Standard Time
15:52	mfredrickson	RSchulz: For mine I needed (doto pojo (.method args))
15:52	Zephtar	So GMT, which means it is evening :D
15:52	Lau_of_DK	clojurebot: rev 1121
15:52	clojurebot	Titim gan �ir� ort.
15:52	Lau_of_DK	clojurebot: svn rev 1121
15:52	clojurebot	svn is https://clojure.svn.sourceforge.net/svnroot/clojure/
15:55	durka	it does work if you change all the setSize to .setSize
15:55	mfredrickson	durka: yup. just got that
15:56	RSchulz	How does Clojure choose the right overload when there are multiple methods of a given name and arity?
15:56	mfredrickson	to submit a bug report/patch for the code on website, should I diff clojure.markdown?
15:57	AWizzArd	RSchulz: first multimethod for which the dispatch fired the equal result
15:57	RSchulz	Multimethod?
15:57	RSchulz	I'm asking about calling methods of Java classes. Or, in this case, a constructor, if that matters.
15:57	AWizzArd	well, you said "multiple methods"
15:57	mfredrickson	hmm. it's not in there
15:57	RSchulz	Yes. I _didn't_ say multimethod...
15:57	AWizzArd	but multiple methods
15:58	AWizzArd	anyway, the constructors in Java dispatch on type
15:58	AWizzArd	and arity
15:58	RSchulz	So Clojure uses reflection to choose?
15:58	AWizzArd	in as few cases as possible
15:59	RSchulz	So take java.io.File. I have two cases in my code, (string?) and (isa? ... java.io.File), which correspond to two of hte constructors in java.io.FileWriter
16:00	RSchulz	(I should have said "...take java.io.FileWriter...")
16:01	rhickey_	mfredrickson: the web site generally documents the release, with the exception of the API page - the body docs will get updated next release, hopefully soon
16:02	mfredrickson	rhickey_: good stuff. thanks.
16:03	AWizzArd	Chouser: did you have some successful runs with your applet tests yesterday?
16:07	RSchulz	rhickey_: What are possible causes for "Unable to resolve classname" when I know the class name is valid and imported?
16:08	rhickey_	RSchulz: you know how? Did you check ns-imports?
16:08	RSchulz	(ns rrs.io-helpers
16:08	RSchulz	(:import (java.io
16:08	RSchulz	File
16:08	RSchulz	BufferedWriter
16:08	RSchulz	FileWriter))
16:08	RSchulz	)
16:08	RSchulz	java.lang.IllegalArgumentException: Unable to resolve classname: (new FileWriter file-spec) (io_helpers.clj:21)
16:09	RSchulz	I tried tagging file-spec with #^String, too, to no avail.
16:10	rhickey_	What's on line 21?
16:10	RSchulz	Here's everything non-blank on 21: (-> (new FileWriter #^File file-spec) (new BufferedWriter))
16:11	RSchulz	(That's the (isa? file-spec File) case)
16:13	rhickey_	user=> (macroexpand-1 '(-> (new FileWriter #^File file-spec) (new BufferedWriter)))
16:13	rhickey_	(new (new FileWriter file-spec) BufferedWriter)
16:13	AWizzArd	that makes it clear
16:13	RSchulz	Is the chaing / thread thing wrong? Or just a poor choice?
16:13	RSchulz	Do you recomment the explicit (new ...) syntax?
16:14	rhickey_	RSchulz: it works better without new IMO, I use (Classname. ...)
16:14	RSchulz	OK.
16:14	kotarak	(-> file-spec FileWriter. BufferedWriter.)
16:14	rhickey_	right
16:15	RSchulz	I had it all mangled is what you all are saying. Not a surprise...
16:15	RSchulz	Do the type tags matter? Do they help? (In a case like this?)
16:16	AWizzArd	I think they should never help for calling the right constructor, but instead they help to reduce runtime overhead in some cases.
16:19	RSchulz	Now I have this: ((#^File file-spec FileWriter.) BufferedWriter.) ... and it's producing: java.lang.ClassNotFoundException: FileWriter. (io_helpers.clj:21)
16:19	AWizzArd	shouldn't the list begin with a dot and a space?
16:20	RSchulz	It even does it if I fully qualify java.io.FileWriter!
16:20	kotarak	Shouldn't it be (reverse)d? (BufferedWriter. (FileWriter. file-spec))?
16:20	danlarkin	clojurebot: todo
16:20	clojurebot	todo is http://richhickey.backpackit.com/pub/1597914
16:21	RSchulz	kotarak: I don't think so. I want to wrapp the BufferedWriter around the FileWriter.
16:22	kotarak	??? So you pass the BufferedWriter into the FileWriter or the other way around? (I would suspect the "other way around")
16:23	RSchulz	No. In Java it would be new BufferedWriter(new FileWriter("file-name"));
16:24	kotarak	So in Clojure it's (BufferedWriter. (FileWriter. "file-name"))
16:25	RSchulz	Well, I have a lot of trouble getting things write, but one thing remains constant: java.lang.ClassNotFoundException: FileWriter. (io_helpers.clj:21)
16:25	RSchulz	Again, even if I fully qualify the name: java.io.FileWriter.
16:25	RSchulz	This has got to be something else really stupid I'm doing (wrong).
16:25	AWizzArd	Are you allowed to post the first 25 LOC in the lisp paste?
16:26	rhickey_	RSchulz: this is how to say it manually: (new BufferedWriter (new FileWriter file-spec))
16:26	RSchulz	Me? Sure. It's my code. And nothing sensitive or proprietary or anything like that. The whol method is exactly 25 lines long. Is that the past site's limit?
16:27	rhickey_	both news can become Classname. : (BufferedWriter. (FileWriter. file-spec))
16:28	RSchulz	That's what I've got, but it still fails. What's the URL for that (one of those) paste site(s)?
16:28	rhickey_	-> can thread inside out
16:29	rhickey_	http://paste.lisp.org/new/
16:30	AWizzArd	RSchulz: the paste limit is much higher, but it makes sense to only show small parts of the code, so one could concentrate on the challenging part.
16:31	RSchulz	OK. I'm doing it now.
16:31	kotarak	RSchulz: choose the clojure channel. Then a link is posted by a bot.
16:32	RSchulz	I tried once, but something went wrong. It never showed up in the list.
16:32	rhickey_	bot is not logged in, don't choose a channel, just enter the url is gives you here
16:33	RSchulz	I just get a blank page after I click Submit and it's not in the list.
16:33	AWizzArd	works for me
16:33	RSchulz	Is registration required?
16:33	kotarak	no
16:33	AWizzArd	well, maybe you can paste it here then http://pastebin.com/
16:34	danlarkin	lisppaste wasn't working for me yesterday
16:34	rhickey_	paste.lisp works, choose no channel
16:34	AWizzArd	Well, for me it does work (right now).
16:36	RSchulz	Oy. http://paste.lisp.org/display/72108
16:41	RSchulz	I got that paste through, but paste.lisp.org seems to be having problems.
16:46	RSchulz	So does anybody see why that function causes an error when I (use 'rrs.io-helpers)?
16:47	rhickey_	RSchulz: I get and error for @ (are you trying to write a macro?):
16:47	rhickey_	java.lang.RuntimeException: Can't embed object in code, maybe print-dup not defined: clojure.lang.LispReader$UnquoteSplicing@1396ec
16:48	AWizzArd	RSchulz: what means (file-spec java.io.FileWriter.)? Is file-spec a function?
16:48	RSchulz	Oh. That's left over from a macro attempt, yes. But the error comes on the FileWriter constructor calls.
16:48	rhickey_	(isa? file-spec File) should be (instance? File file-spec)
16:48	rhickey_	No error there for me
16:48	RSchulz	It should be clear. It's either a String or a File
16:48	RSchulz	OK. So it may never take those paths, but I get the error when I (use ...) that file.
16:50	RSchulz	So the (new form works) when I fix the macro left-overs. But the commented lines still give the ClassNotFoundException
16:50	kotarak	RSchulz: (FileWriter. ...) expands to (new FileWriter ...), but only if FileWriter. is the first argument. Otherwise Clojure tries to resolve it as class name. Hence you get a FileWriter. not found error.
16:51	rhickey_	kotarak: that's in comments now, RSchulz are you talking about the comments not working?
16:51	RSchulz	Yes. The lines that are commented fail. Rich's form works. The macro junk was causing a separate error and that was confusing me further.
16:52	RSchulz	I've probably been "diagnosing" several problems at once, which is my bad, of course.
16:52	kotarak	RSchulz: the correct form is (FileWriter. file-spec)
16:52	kotarak	And not (file-spec FileWriter.)
16:52	RSchulz	OK. I was sure someone suggested the form I had (and I thought I copied and pasted from IRC), but I'm not entirely sure any more.
16:53	danm_	http://paste.lisp.org/display/72062#1
16:53	danm_	can anyone tell me if that's how alter is intended to be used?
16:53	rhickey_	Might be worth rereading: http://clojure.org/java_interop
16:54	danm_	I feel as though I've improved the function over my earlier paste, but now it won't work (haha)
16:55	RSchulz	rhickey_: I assume that's to me. I thought I had but ...
16:55	rhickey_	danm: no - the idea behind alter/commute is that they manipulate the state, you wouldn't use the var in the altering fn
16:55	rhickey_	danm_: what's in quote-db ?
16:55	danm_	quote-db is intended to be a hash of sorted-maps
16:55	danm_	so, financial quotes from yahoo
16:56	danm_	where the key in the map is the symbol, and then it's a list of quotes sorted by their date
16:56	rhickey_	danm_: we don't call maps hashes in Clojure as some of them are trees - so it's a map?
16:56	danm_	sorry, yeah
16:56	AWizzArd	One thing that I really suggest to all the people who never did Lisp before is http://www.cs.umd.edu/~nau/cmsc421/norvig-lisp-style.pdf
16:57	AWizzArd	it also covers indentation
16:57	danm_	I assumed hash-map was a has, and sorted-map was a tree
16:57	danm_	but alas
16:57	AWizzArd	rhickey_: aren't they both tries under the hood?
16:58	rhickey_	danm_: so your alter fn should take that map as it's first argument, and should return a new map
16:59	danm_	ok
16:59	rhickey_	(alter quote-db (fn [qmap] (assoc qmap sym sorted-map-from-dq)))
16:59	danm_	thanks, that would explain the runtime error
17:00	rhickey_	AWizzArd: no hash-maps are tries and sorted-maps are red/black trees
17:02	RSchulz	Is it possible to (binding out ...) in a macro expansion?
17:03	rhickey_	RSchulz: you should put your with-open outside the binding, and don't use out in with-open
17:04	RSchulz	How do you get a contextual redirection of input or output? I'm working towards a kind of shell-like environment.
17:06	rhickey_	RSchulz: binding out is the right way, (with-open [a-local (open file)] (binding [out a-local] ...))
17:06	RSchulz	Ah. OK.
17:06	RSchulz	That's for bearing with my ineptitude.
17:07	RSchulz	Duh. _Thanks_ for ...
17:07	rhickey_	RSchulz: np
17:26	arohner	If I set a var to contain a class, how do I create a new instance of it?
17:26	arohner	(def myvar java.util.map)
17:26	arohner	(new myvar) doesn't work
17:27	rhickey_	arohner: ick - are you sure you want to do that?
17:28	arohner	not really, but I'm not sure how else to do it
17:28	AWizzArd	arohner: new is a special form, not a function
17:28	arohner	I guess I could create a factory function
17:28	AWizzArd	it treats it's arguments special and does not necessarily evaluate them
17:29	rhickey_	with only the class you'll have to use reflection:
17:29	rhickey_	(def myvar java.util.HashMap)
17:29	rhickey_	(.newInstance myvar)
17:30	rhickey_	but you could instead store a constructing fn:
17:30	rhickey_	(def myvar #(java.util.HashMap.))
17:30	rhickey_	(myvar)
17:30	arohner	thanks
17:31	rhickey_	the latter could be extended to take args, newInstance can't
17:31	rhickey_	the latter will be much faster
17:32	arohner	I'm writing tests for a webapp. Webdriver (a java tool) has several different implementations, firefoxDriver, safariDriver, etc. I was hoping to store the desired implementation in a var so I could re-run the tests with the driver bound to a different implementation
17:32	arohner	a constructing fn is a good solution though
17:32	arohner	i can just (binding) that
17:33	arohner	thanks
18:16	AWizzArd	What is the easiest way to shuffle a list/vector? (sort-by rand col) does only rarely randomly enough.
18:16	RSchulz	I finally sorted out my >> macro (it's macro again, as it must be), but the imports seem not to work. Would someone look at http://paste.lisp.org/display/72108#1 an suggest why that might be?
18:18	RSchulz	AWizzArd: You could interleave the random numbers with the collection and then sort the pairs on the random integer element.
18:18	RSchulz	And project out the original collection elements of each pair.
18:21	Chouser	clojurebot: shuffle is http://groups.google.com/group/clojure/msg/a2816f1b51d99b79
18:21	clojurebot	Alles klar
18:22	Chouser	^^ AWizzArd
18:23	AWizzArd	thanks Chouser
18:25	RSchulz	Chouser: Did you have any ideas about the DOT problem I was seeing?
18:36	danm_	Chouser: can you point me at a starting point for spit/slurp with objects the reader doesn't understand?
18:36	danm_	for instance, I have a j.u.Date in a structmap that I'd like to read/write
18:37	danm_	I'm not sure where to look in the docs :\|
18:39	danlarkin	arbitrary java objects don't get reader support
18:41	danm_	danlarkin: ok, thanks
18:41	kotarak	RSchulz: http://paste.lisp.org/display/72108#2, this works for me.
18:42	danlarkin	you'll have to use a serialization format, perhaps clojure-json :)
18:42	RSchulz	Well, that's good, but do you have any explanation why the imports don't seem to work and why I have to use fully qualified names there?
18:42	danm_	danlarkin: is that a project you're responsible for? :)
18:42	rhickey_	danm_: user=> (read-string "#=(java.util.Date. \"Sat Dec 13 18:38:53 EST 2008\")")
18:42	rhickey_	#<Date Sat Dec 13 18:38:53 EST 2008>
18:43	danm_	google tells me yes
18:43	danlarkin	d'oh there I got opening my big mouth too quickly
18:43	kotarak	RSchulz: as you may note, my annotation doesn't use qualified names and it works for me.
18:43	danm_	rhickey_: neato
18:43	rhickey_	you can define a print-dup method for any type and print with print-dup on to get print/read serialization of anything
18:43	RSchulz	Yes, I see that. But still...
18:44	kotarak	RSchulz: then I don't the your problem...
18:44	kotarak	I don't see
18:44	rhickey_	danm_: http://groups.google.com/group/clojure/msg/e21bf475b45bd2d5
18:46	RSchulz	Are you saying you can't replicate the "Unable to resolve classname" error in my code if you remove the java.io. qualification on FileWriter and BufferedWriter?
18:47	RSchulz	By the way, I see the not about multiple evaluations of file-spec, and I'll fix that, but all my testing has been with simple constants like "file-name" or (new File "file-name").
18:48	kotarak	RSchulz: works fine for me
18:48	kotarak	RSchulz: also your version w/o qualified names.
18:48	RSchulz	So there's something idiosyncratic about my set-up...
18:48	RSchulz	I wonder what it could be.
18:48	RSchulz	I'm using Sun JDK 1.6.0_11 on x86 Linux.
18:49	danm_	rhickey_: thanks, that's perfect.
18:49	kotarak	1.5 on Mac
18:50	kotarak	RSchulz: about the multiple eval: this is just a general remark.
18:50	RSchulz	Sure. And I'm glad you pointed it out.
18:51	RSchulz	Even my generic Lisp is very (_very_) rusty, let alone Clojure's uniquenesses.
18:51	danlarkin	danm_: sorry about that :-o
18:51	danm_	danlarkin: meh, no problem :)
18:54	RSchulz	What's available in the way of a pretty-printer for Clojure forms?
18:56	danlarkin	Chouser has a nice one in the mailing list
18:56	rhickey_	RSchulz: emacs clojure-mode
18:56	rhickey_	:)
18:56	RSchulz	Apart from Emacs!
18:56	kotarak	RSchulz: vimclojure
18:56	kotarak	;)
18:56	RSchulz	Oh?
18:56	RSchulz	I didn't know vimclojure had pretty-printing.
18:57	RSchulz	Does that require the Ruby thing?
18:57	kotarak	Not really. You have to add the linebreaks and then just ggGV= for the indeting.
18:57	RSchulz	But apart from external dependencies or IDE (-like) tools, is there any Clojure code for pretty-printing Clojure forms?
18:58	kotarak	No Ruby. Pure VIm.
18:58	kotarak	ggVG= actually...
18:58	RSchulz	Ah. OK. I'll have to try that.
18:58	RSchulz	What's the V part?
18:58	RSchulz	(I'm pretty much stuck on the original Vi subset of Vim!)
18:58	kotarak	visual mode
18:58	RSchulz	('Cause I'm so old...)
18:59	RSchulz	Still, when people need a "pure Clojure" solution to something other than "blob-mode" printing, what do they do?
19:01	danlarkin	RSchulz: there's a nice pretty printing thread on the group, with (at least) 2 implementations, once of which (Chouser's) I am using successfully
19:02	RSchulz	OK. I thought I saw something somewhere.
19:02	RSchulz	I'll search the archives.
19:05	hiredman	kotarak: as long as you are here, I have a vim theme I like, but it doesn't give any special color to :keywords , any idea how I could fix this?
19:06	RSchulz	Ah. That's nice. That will make comprehending (macroexpand ...) output _much_ easier!
19:08	kotarak	hiredman: just a sec
19:11	kotarak	hiredman: make sure it assigns a color to the Operator syntax group
19:13	hiredman	hah
19:13	hiredman	it assigns "white"
19:13	wipewindows	any good clojure benchmarks?
19:13	wipewindows	how much faster is clojure than Python?
19:14	hiredman	if I add a line like that to my ~/.vimrc will it override the theme?
19:15	zakwilson	How much faster at what calculation? With what optimizations?
19:16	hiredman	nm
19:16	hiredman	I figured it out
19:16	hiredman	thanks a bunch
19:16	kotarak	hiredman: depends on the quality of your color scheme developer
19:16	hiredman	oH.
19:18	kotarak	hiredman: if the colorscheme uses highlight default ...., it will work.
19:18	kotarak	w/o default it won't
19:19	hiredman	hmmm
19:26	csf	how is the clojure vim support....i'm no fan of emacs, but it's got slime.
19:29	hiredman	clojurebot: contrib?
19:29	clojurebot	I don't understand.
19:30	RSchulz	clojurebot: Be more generous!
19:30	clojurebot	No entiendo
19:30	danlarkin	clojurebot: you have no sense of humor
19:30	clojurebot	Gabh mo leithsc�al?
19:30	hiredman	clojurebot: clojure.contrib?
19:30	clojurebot	clojure is the bestest programming language available.
19:31	hiredman	useless
19:31	hiredman	clojurebot: contrib is http://sourceforge.net/projects/clojure-contrib/
19:31	clojurebot	'Sea, mhuise.
19:32	RSchulz	How many languages does ClojureBot speak?
19:32	hiredman	none, but it can type a few
19:33	RSchulz	Right... How many (which) languages are represented in its response database?
19:34	hiredman	4?
19:34	hiredman	I think I had to delete the russian one because something somewhere was mangling it
19:34	RSchulz	Sure. Four. What language is "'Sea, mhuise."?
19:35	hiredman	irish
19:43	RSchulz	Is that so?
20:17	gp	how is clojure for imagemanipulation? anyone tried fjui or fiji ir what its name is? is it fast? does it take advantage of multiple cores?
20:55	francois_	Hi all!
20:56	francois_	I have an imperative question :)
20:56	francois_	Regarding this code (it doesn't work at the moment): http://gist.github.com/35596
20:57	francois_	This is the main processing loop for receiving forms on stdin (a socket, but who cares :)) and building an RPN calculator
20:57	francois_	So, anyway, the forms are received, and I can reliably process them
20:57	francois_	Except, how do I recurse with the new stack sequence?
20:59	hiredman	(recur (conj stack new-thing))
20:59	francois_	But, can't I do that only from the end of the loop?
20:59	francois_	I can't do it on line 8, where I detect that I found a number
21:00	francois_	I thought of introducing a local that I'd modify, and I would then recurse on that
21:00	francois_	I'm thinking that I should abstract the processing into a new function, and let the return value of that function be the new stack
21:00	francois_	I would then detect quit and syntax errors using exceptions
21:00	francois_	What do you think?
21:01	hiredman	I would move everything into the (cond ...) form
21:01	francois_	Let me try that
21:01	hiredman	and if it is a number (recur ...)
21:01	hiredman	if not do other sutff
21:03	gnuvince_	francois_: you from Montreal (or around)?
21:03	francois_	@hiredman: it works!
21:04	francois_	Here's the new version: http://gist.github.com/35596
21:04	francois_	@gnuvince_ I'm from Sherbrooke
21:04	francois_	I visit Montreal pretty regularly
21:04	francois_	gnuvince_: And you?
21:04	gnuvince_	francois_: one hour west of Montreal; small village in Soulanges
21:05	francois_	Can't say I ever heard of it :)
21:05	gnuvince_	Highway 20W, exit 9.
21:06	francois_	I'm 2 hours east of Montreal
21:06	gnuvince_	Nice to see fellow Quebecers
21:06	francois_	Yeah
21:07	francois_	BTW, why do I often see messages like this? Exception in thread "main" java.lang.IllegalArgumentException: No matching method found: println for class java.io.PrintWriter (rpn.clj:0)
21:07	francois_	I guess this is found at compile time, rather than execution time
21:07	francois_	That's why the line number would be 0?
21:08	gnuvince_	francois_: what do you do?
21:09	francois_	I'm a Ruby on Rails developer by trade
21:09	francois_	I work with GiraffeSoft, a Montreal-based company
21:09	gnuvince_	Never heard of them...
21:09	francois_	We consult, but we plan on building our own applications soon enough
21:09	francois_	Sell products instead of consulting gigs
21:09	francois_	I'm the lead developer on http://xlsuite.com/
21:10	gnuvince_	Cool; I do Django development
21:10	francois_	Great! A Python developer!
21:10	gnuvince_	Yeah :)
21:10	francois_	Do you know about Montreal Python?
21:10	gnuvince_	No; is that a user group?
21:10	francois_	Yes
21:11	gnuvince_	ok
21:11	francois_	They meet in the same room the Montreal on Rails (now Montreal.rb) group meets in
21:11	francois_	I'd have to ask when's the next meeting
21:11	gnuvince_	I did some Ruby and Rails a few years ago.
21:11	gnuvince_	Even wrote a tutorial for Rails 0.7 and 0.8
21:11	francois_	Wow!
21:12	francois_	You started even earlier than I did
21:12	gnuvince_	http://wiki.rubyonrails.org/rails/pages/TodoListTutorial
21:12	gnuvince_	That was a long time ago though
21:12	francois_	I deployed http://weputuplights.com/ (what eventually became XLsuite) on Rails 0.12
21:12	francois_	Last time I did Python was when I was active in the Subversion dev community
21:13	gnuvince_	These days, I'm more into Haskell and Clojure.
21:13	francois_	Just fell in the Clojure soup
21:13	gnuvince_	(In my free times I mean)
21:13	francois_	I rather like what I'm seeing
21:13	gnuvince_	Clojure is awesome.
21:13	francois_	I made an REPL through a socket in about 45 minutes
21:14	francois_	I was pretty impressed
21:14	gnuvince_	All the goodness of Lisp plus the immutability stuff of Haskell without all the restrictions with the gigantic library of Java.
21:14	francois_	:)
21:14	francois_	Yes, I like that
21:14	francois_	I'm also discovering JRuby at the same time, so it looks like the JVM's winning me back
21:15	francois_	I did a lot of Java coding a couple of years ago, before I met Ruby
21:15	gnuvince_	I never did any Java
21:15	gnuvince_	Thankfully :)
21:15	francois_	Ah!
21:15	francois_	Syntax is verbose, but the JVM itself is very good
21:16	bradbev	should there be any real difference between these functions? (defn spawn [f]
21:16	bradbev	(. (Thread. f) start))
21:16	bradbev	(defn spawn [f]
21:16	bradbev	(send-off (agent nil) (fn[a] f)))
21:16	bradbev	(lisppaste still broken?)
21:16	gnuvince_	francois_: that's pretty much the philosophy of Clojure; good platform, bad language
21:18	francois_	K, gotta run
21:18	francois_	@hiredman: thanks again for your help
21:19	bradbev	If it makes a difference, spawn is being called from an agent that was started with send-off. I expect no difference, but the function using send-off doesn't appear to actually get started properly
21:23	hiredman	uh
21:24	hiredman	you may want to (f)
21:24	hiredman	if f is a func
21:25	bradbev	no, it's not a syntax problem. I have an agent that listens on a socket for data, and it gets a lot of data. I want another thread to draw the gui periodically
21:26	bradbev	I use spawn for the gui-redraw - but the send-off version doesn't actually ever get a chance to run because the socket thread is practically a busy spin loop
21:26	hiredman	uh, if you are passing a function to that function it is a syntax problem
21:27	hiredman	it wi;; never run
21:27	bradbev	sorry, you're right
21:27	bradbev	but my problem remains - I'd just written that now to illustrate
21:28	bradbev	when socket data stops arriving the send-off version will actually update
21:29	bradbev	so is there some difference between creating a new thread & using one from a thread pool like send-off does?
21:29	hiredman	dunno
21:29	bradbev	me either :(
21:29	hiredman	is your socket thread also doing send-offs like that?
21:31	bradbev	no. There is a server socket that send-offs the socket handler. When the socket handler gets an "init" command it spawns the render loop.
21:33	hiredman	send-offs from within a running agent are held until the agent completes
21:33	hiredman	maybe that has something to do with it?
21:39	bradbev	oh
21:39	bradbev	that very well could be the problem
21:39	bradbev	I did not know that
22:35	gnuvince_	Anyone knows how to have timeouts in Java for sockets? My comics script tries to access PBF Comics, but the site is down. I'm trying to figure out how to skip over a site after a certain amount of time.
22:37	gnuvince_	Found it
22:38	gnuvince_	(System/setProperty "sun.net.client.defaultConnectTimeout", "5000")
22:42	dmiles	(System/setProperty "sun.net.client.defaultConnectTimeout", "5000") == (.setProperty System "sun.net.client.defaultConnectTimeout", "5000") ?
22:43	Chouser	no, the latter won't work anymore.
22:44	hiredman	clojurebot: latest?
22:44	clojurebot	latest is 1159
22:44	hiredman	clojurebot: svn rev 1159
22:44	clojurebot	svn is https://clojure.svn.sourceforge.net/svnroot/clojure/
22:44	Chouser	svn rev 1159
22:44	hiredman	svn rev 1159
22:44	clojurebot	svn rev 1159; proxy perf tweaks Note breaking change if you are using the proxy interface other than the proxy macro itself - proxy maps are now maps of (preferably interned) strings to fns, not symbols to fns, and if you construct a proxy manually you must establish initial map with init-proxy
22:44	clojurebot	svn rev 1159; proxy perf tweaks Note breaking change if you are using the proxy interface other than the proxy macro itself - proxy maps are now maps of (preferably interned) strings to fns, not symbols to fns, and if you construct a proxy manually you must establish initial map with init-proxy
22:45	hiredman	whoops
22:45	Chouser	:-)
22:45	dmiles	oops ;P .. i am trying to make a lisp dispatch reader macro that can convert Clojure forms to jcall/jstatic/jclass/jfield forms.. someone have one laying around?
22:47	dmiles	this is still suposed to work? (.. System (getProperties) (get "os.name"))
22:47	Chouser	not anymore
22:47	Chouser	svn rev 1158
22:47	clojurebot	svn rev 1158; force instance member interpretation of (.method ClassName), e.g. (.getMethods String) works
22:48	Chouser	hm, anyway, you need Classname/staticMethod now
22:49	dmiles	and (Classname/instanceMethod instancevar arg1 arg2) ?
22:49	Chouser	no, (.instanceMethod instance arg1 arg2)
22:49	dmiles	oh so its just for statics.. right on.. i like that partial disabiguaty
22:52	dmiles	(. instance-expr member-symbol) for instance fields?
22:52	Chouser	I think that still works, but (.member instance) is still preferred.
22:54	mmcgrana	i have some NaN
22:55	mmcgrana	popping up in some numerical Clojure code I have, but I have no idea from where: are there any ops besides eg (Math/sqrt -2) that would return NaN?
23:03	durka	0/0?
23:04	mmcgrana	raises ArithmeticException
23:04	mmcgrana	at least in repl
23:04	durka	with ints yes
23:05	durka	but apparently the behavior is different for floats
23:05	mmcgrana	user=> (/ (float 0) (float 0)) NaN
23:05	mmcgrana	hmmm
23:08	mmcgrana	as it happens i don't have any calls to / in my program (or (float x) for that matter); i guess i'll keep poking around
23:11	asbjxrn	Anyone using slime and jswat?
23:12	asbjxrn	I'd like to get exceptions trapped in jswat, but it looks like slime grabs them first.
23:22	rhickey	Chouser: (.. System (getProperties) (get "os.name")) still works, only (.instanceMethod classname ...) was changed to force class instance
23:25	dmiles	rhickey: ah.
23:28	dmiles	how do i change the search thru packages for System/getProperties Math/PI .. assuming it first search in java.lang.*;
23:33	dmiles	not (import '(java.util ) ) ?
23:33	hiredman	what?
23:34	hiredman	you have to import specific classes
23:34	hiredman	(import '(java.util someclass))
23:34	dmiles	did i have to import java.lang.Math and java.lang.System .. or did those come for free?
23:35	hiredman	you have to import everything other then stuff in java.lang
23:36	hiredman	java.lang.Math and java.lang.System are sperate packages from javalang
23:36	dmiles	ok makes sense
23:48	Chouser	rhickey: I keep findind more opportunities to use PersistentQueue (legitimitely, I think)
23:49	Chouser	finding
23:51	gnuvince_	Any idea why when I add a Java lib with add-classpath in SLIME and then I C-c C-c a source file, I get a message that the lib I just included isn't found?
23:51	hiredman	add-classpath is lame
23:52	gnuvince_	What's the alternative?
23:52	hiredman	at start up slime adds all jars in ~/.clojure to the cp
23:53	gnuvince_	There's no temporary way?
23:54	hiredman	not that I am aware of
23:54	gnuvince_	So what does it look like the ~/.clojure?
23:54	hiredman	its a directory where you put jars
23:54	gnuvince_	plain old /home/foo/baz.jar?
23:55	gnuvince_	oh
23:55	gnuvince_	it's a directory
23:55	gnuvince_	fuck