#clojure – 2015-10-08

2015-10-08

00:50	nXqd	!help
00:50	nXqd	,(def a "something")
00:50	clojurebot	#'sandbox/a
00:51	nXqd	a bit offtopic, how is this clojurebot created ? it's pretty neat
00:51	justin_smith	nXqd: it's a repl with a whitelist and sandbox, the source is easy to find on github
00:52	justin_smith	nXqd: made by hiredman
04:27	sm0ke	is there something like doseq which returns list instead of side effect?
04:28	wmealing	dorun ?
04:28	schmir	sm0ke: doall
04:28	sm0ke	,(for [x (range 10)] (inc x))
04:28	wmealing	isnt what is returned.. what you want ?
04:28	clojurebot	(1 2 3 4 5 ...)
04:28	sm0ke	i guess i can use `for`
04:29	sm0ke	i always seem to forget about `for` in clojure
04:30	sm0ke	its such an underrated expression in clojure tbh
04:33	patrkris	/part/part
04:33	borkdude	sm0ke for, or map
04:34	borkdude	sm0ke but for is more similar to doseq, with a fancy binding and :let, :when
04:34	borkdude	sm0ke possibly multiple bindings yielding a cartesian product
04:37	sm0ke	yes multiple bindings is also unique about `for` compared to a map
04:38	sm0ke	a single map in short can be an equivalent of chains of map filter
04:38	muhuk	suppose (unique? [1 2 3]) => true & (unique? [:x :x]) => false, what should (unique? nil) or (unique? []) do?
04:38	borkdude	I never realized that doseq also supports multiple bindings until now
04:39	sm0ke	,(doseq [x [1 2] y 3] (prn (str x "," y)))
04:39	clojurebot	#error {\n :cause "Don't know how to create ISeq from: java.lang.Long"\n :via\n [{:type java.lang.IllegalArgumentException\n :message "Don't know how to create ISeq from: java.lang.Long"\n :at [clojure.lang.RT seqFrom "RT.java" 535]}]\n :trace\n [[clojure.lang.RT seqFrom "RT.java" 535]\n [clojure.lang.RT seq "RT.java" 516]\n [clojure.core$seq__4116 invokeStatic "core.clj" 137]\n [clojure.co...
04:39	sm0ke	,(doseq [x [1 2] y [3]] (prn (str x "," y)))
04:39	borkdude	sm0ke 3 should be [3] there
04:39	clojurebot	"1,3"\n"2,3"\n
04:39	sm0ke	nice i didnt knew this either
04:40	sm0ke	does it also supports :when ?
04:40	sm0ke	heh
04:40	borkdude	hmm
04:40	sm0ke	oh it does
04:40	sm0ke	"with bindings and filtering as provided by "for""
04:41	borkdude	yes, it does!
04:41	borkdude	wow
04:41	sm0ke	,(doseq [x [1 2] y [1 3]] (prn (str x "," y)) :when (= x y))
04:41	clojurebot	"1,1"\n"1,3"\n"2,1"\n"2,3"\n
04:42	sm0ke	huh
05:18	TEttinger	,(doseq [x [1 2] y [1 3] :when (= x y)] (prn (str x "," y)))
05:18	clojurebot	"1,1"\n
05:18	TEttinger	sm0ke: ^
05:19	sm0ke	heh thanks TEttinger
05:19	TEttinger	no prob, those :when and :while etc. are handy
07:51	bordeltabernacle	Hi! I'm new to Clojure (and IRC!) and just thought I'd introduce myself and "join in the conversation" y'know.
07:53	dstockton	hey bordeltabernacle
07:53	dstockton	welcome
07:53	bordeltabernacle	Hi dstockton, thanks.
07:53	bordeltabernacle	feel kinda high school goofy!
07:55	dstockton	things seem quiet today
07:56	snowell	Welcome, bordeltabernacle!
07:57	bordeltabernacle	Thanks, snowell!
08:07	noncom	what's the most idiomatic way to update all values in a {} by a function? (except for reduce, if possible)
08:07	noncom	or is reduce the most idiomatic one?
08:08	dstockton	i'd say its fine noncom, or you can (into {} (for [kv] ...
08:08	dstockton	there is also https://clojure.github.io/algo.generic/clojure.algo.generic.functor-api.html#clojure.algo.generic.functor/fmap
08:08	dstockton	user=> (fmap inc {:a 1 :b 3 :c 5})
08:08	dstockton	{:a 2, :b 4, :c 6}
08:09	noncom	oh wow
08:09	dstockton	this uses the into (empty m) version
08:09	noncom	right
08:09	noncom	interesting!
08:09	dstockton	https://github.com/clojure/algo.generic/blob/aa028f7467d193a5cfad0626b324f4c682b91c15/src/main/clojure/clojure/algo/generic/functor.clj#L29
08:10	dstockton	there was a whole load of discussion here yesterday about it
08:11	noncom	gotta read that from the archive
08:11	noncom	dstockton: is it going to be in the core sometimes?
08:12	dstockton	don't know, actually i didn't catch all of the discussion yesterday either
08:13	noncom	well, good that the bots are taking care of logs
08:16	dstockton	most of it was about type systems and haskell
08:21	noncom	dstockton: yes, i already found it! just yesterday me and a friend of mine were talking about the same thing, also mentioning haskell, but we did not see it here. what a synchronicity!
08:36	taharqa	Hi there !
08:36	taharqa	I'm new to Clojure as well, what can I say to someone that told me "Clojure is not a Lisp" ?
08:39	MasseR	taharqa: what was his reasoning?
08:42	taharqa	MasseR: « a lisp should be a langage built on top of functions that are primitives (atom, quote, eq, car, cdr, cons, cond, lambda, apply, etc ) and should rely entirely on this primitives »
08:44	opqdonut	well clojure is built on top of the primitives
08:44	opqdonut	listed on http://clojure.org/special_forms
08:45	opqdonut	and what does it matter what some guy thinks
08:45	opqdonut	clojure certainly isn't a very traditional lisp
08:45	opqdonut	maybe you can settle on calling it lisp-like :)
08:45	MasseR	Besides, that's the first I've heard of that kind of condition for being a lisp
08:46	taharqa	opqdonut: the guy in my opinion mix the language and the platform
08:47	taharqa	opqdonut: the fact that Clojure share with java may seems to them that those are not primitives
08:47	opqdonut	MasseR: it's quite widely repeated, see e.g. http://steve-yegge.blogspot.fi/2006/04/lisp-is-not-acceptable-lisp.html
08:48	taharqa	MasseR: yes strange, he points me to http://axisofeval.blogspot.fr/2010/04/why-i-ignore-clojure.html
08:48	opqdonut	or http://stackoverflow.com/questions/3482389/how-many-primitives-does-it-take-to-build-a-lisp-machine-ten-seven-or-five
08:48	taharqa	opqdonut: excellent ^^
08:49	opqdonut	even axisofeval ends with
08:49	opqdonut	> Now, go ahead and have fun using Clojure if it floats your boat, but stop whining about how it's a more modern or better Lisp. That doesn't make the slightest bit of sense.
08:51	noncom	taharqa: clojure is a lisp because it is a list processing language and it is homoiconic. it is not the grahams lisp, however, and it is not scheme and it is not common lisp. it is clojure...
08:52	noncom	taharqa: it has some jvm interop which may frighten pure lisp people, but this is the reality of jvm and actually a bliss
10:51	gfredericks	apparently the 4clojure test suite has been broken (uncompileable) for over two years
10:53	gfredericks	it's made it through six or so commits without anybody noticeing
11:07	sobel	is there a prettier way to say this: (merge-with (fn [_ s] s) default-config file-config)
11:07	sobel	specifically the (fn [_ s] s)
11:10	michaniskin	(comp peek vector)
11:11	luma	sobel, isn't that just using the value from the second map, so the same as (merge default-config file-config)
11:12	tdavis	is there any way to expand to a symbol's full namespace a-la syntax quote when inside a quoted list? as in, '(reify SomeClass (foo [bar baz] ...)) i need 'SomeClass' to be 'com.ns.SomeClass' because it's being used in a macro expansion.
11:15	sobel	luma: thx
11:35	justin_smith	tdavis: syntax-quote does namespace expansion, not class-name, I think...
11:35	justin_smith	,`String
11:36	clojurebot	java.lang.String
11:36	justin_smith	oh, never mind :)
11:40	justin_smith	,'String
11:40	clojurebot	String
11:51	tdavis	has anybody ever gotten "NullPointerException clojure.lang.Reflector.invokeNoArgInstanceMember" just trying to call macroexpand on something?
11:52	justin_smith	tdavis: no, but if a macro is buggy, it can npe while expanding
11:52	tdavis	is there any way to debug it?
11:53	tdavis	i wrote a macro, it works fine, but calling it in a loop from a function is NPE'ing despite the fact that i've confirmed none of the arguments are nil.
11:53	tdavis	and for whatever reason i can't even expand the call to see what could be wrong
11:54	justin_smith	maybe try expanding the surrounding loop form?
11:54	tdavis	i pulled it out of the loop entirely, same result.
11:57	tdavis	progress, maybe! ClassCastException clojure.lang.PersistentList cannot be cast to clojure.lang.Symbol clojure.core/ns-resolve (core.clj:4216)
11:57	justin_smith	sobel: michaniskin: I benchmarked a few variants, #(do %2) was the fastest shorthand, (comp second list) was slowest, (comp peek vector) did OK https://www.refheap.com/110425
11:59	justin_smith	yeah, that sounds like a macro that is either broken, or being used improperly
12:00	justin_smith	sorry, beyond expanding things I don't have any good macro writing / macro debugging tips
12:00	justin_smith	I'm not so great at macros myself, maybe someone else can help
12:01	tdavis	justin_smith: yeah... once i eliminated all the other macros involved (i forgot, e.g., `let') i'm getting more of a stack trace. might be something to do with (to-array) usage... Constructor.newInstance() usage is convoluted from clojure.
12:11	tdavis	interesting! i am passing a macro a argument of type java.lang.Class but inside the macro the type is clojure.lang.PersistentList
12:15	justin_smith	,(type ''foo)
12:15	clojurebot	clojure.lang.PersistentList
12:15	justin_smith	could it be an extraneous quoting / not enough evaluation issue?
12:16	tdavis	the macro isn't receiving the value just the raw list which i guess makes sense since it's being expanded prior to the calling function being evaluated
12:20	justin_smith	well, the idea with macros is you want them to get the raw form, and need to explicitly do any level of evaluation needed to get the compile time value they need
12:32	clgv	Hello, is there an option to set the timeout for an aleph tcp client connection attempt?
12:41	clgv	ok :bootstrap-transform and setting CONNECT_TIMEOUT_MILLIS is the solution
14:39	boxed	is there a way to make a macro expand into two forms? in my case I want to output both a defn and another macro from a macro
14:43	justin_smith	boxed: `(do ...)
14:44	boxed	ah crap, that was obvious in hind sight, thanks :P
14:44	boxed	but I guess this only works for outputting two things that are side effect-y right?
14:45	boxed	(for my case fine, but I’m thinking about the general case)
14:45	snowell	For multiple return values you can just return a vector
14:45	justin_smith	boxed: otherise, output a collection containing both results
14:46	justin_smith	right
14:46	boxed	well, that doesn’t work in reagent when I want to output say two [:td]s at some point
14:46	justin_smith	boxed: in that case I use into
14:47	snowell	You'd return a [:div] with the two [:td]s in it :)
14:47	justin_smith	(into [:div] (thing-returning-tow-tds))
14:47	boxed	snowell: you can’t have a a div randomly inside a tr
14:47	snowell	Er…what he said
14:47	snowell	Not with that attitude
14:47	justin_smith	haha
14:47	boxed	hah, yea, “works” is a bad attitude
14:48	boxed	seriously though, I’ll take this as “nope"
14:48	snowell	I'd take what justin_smith said
14:48	justin_smith	boxed: I have had good luck using into (or occasionally just conj) to combine stuff in reagent
14:48	justin_smith	though my literal suggestion above is not correct for that case
14:49	snowell	,(into [:div] [[:td :first] [:td :second]])
14:49	clojurebot	[:div [:td :first] [:td :second]]
14:49	boxed	justin: problem with that is that the code ends up really ugly because the internal behavior of the component leaks out.. in that you have to (into) it
14:50	boxed	snowell: that produces an invalid DOM
14:50	justin_smith	boxed: that's true, and I wish there were a better solution, maybe using om :P
14:51	boxed	justin_smith: yep, at least I’m doing the right thing currently :P pity, I would want clojure macros to be just a tiiiny bit more powerful :P
14:51	justin_smith	boxed: essentially for your case you would need the ability to modify the containing form, and that is just --- eww
14:52	skeuomorf	How do people do DTLS in Clojure land?
14:53	skeuomorf	Please don't tell me bouncy castle :(
14:53	boxed	justin_smith: nah, just the ability for a macro to output several forms. Like C macros can :P
14:55	justin_smith	boxed: that's a modification of the parent form
14:55	justin_smith	c macros don't even have a concept of "form", and can clearly modify parent forms at will
14:55	justin_smith	reified concept of form that is, of course
14:56	boxed	justin_smith: I don’t see what you’re saying. Changing the contents of the parent form is all that macros do. A macro that can’t modify the parent form isn’t a macro, it’s just a literal
14:57	justin_smith	no, there is a difference between your form (args to a macro) and the parent form (the thing containing the macro), one aspect of the parent form, which you would be altering, is the argument count
14:58	boxed	justin_smith: another aspect is the contents.. I really don’t see the big difference
14:58	justin_smith	it's all the difference
14:58	boxed	yea, in my case between nice code and eeeeww :P
14:59	boxed	between useful and not so much
14:59	justin_smith	boxed: it would mean a much messier compiler
15:00	boxed	justin_smith: don’t buy that. Instead of “append x” you could do “append x, append y”
15:00	boxed	“much messier” seems like an exaggeration
15:02	justin_smith	boxed: I would not be surprised if it doubled the line count - because it makes a bunch of shitty things possible that are not possible in the current design.
15:02	boxed	“shitty”? didn’t you just above say it would be much nicer?
15:03	boxed	simplicity of the compiler should not be confused by simplicity of the user code
15:05	boxed	I guess the big problem is that reagent templating is done in clojure native forms, which just can’t express things cleanly for these cases
15:06	boxed	oh yea, and another problem is that HTML is shite of course, but that almost goes withouth saying :P
15:29	daniel__1	if i write code for someone with no contact and hand it over, do i have any rights over said code?
15:30	daniel__1	contract*
15:31	hiredman	http://copyright.gov/help/faq/faq-general.html#mywork
15:38	daniel__1	thanks hiredman
15:48	Cr8	in future though, don't do that -- copyright isn't magic, they can't redistribute or make derivative works of the code, but you also can't force them to delete it/not run it
15:49	boxed	is there some tool that makes developing macros somewhat non-horrible?
16:00	TMA	daniel__1: even in the common law you do have a contract; however as it is not a written one it is hard to tell what are its terms
16:03	daniel__1	im actually not concerned with giving up rights to what i produce, im concerned with contracts i dont fully understand taking rights from things i havent yet but might produce
16:03	daniel__1	i think im talking about simple transfer of copyright
16:10	sobel	actually unless you give them permission to run your code, you can assert copy rights to make them stop using it
16:10	sobel	it's tricky to prove your copyright if you don't register it properly but that's how the law reads
16:10	Frozenlo`	sobel: Don't they get the copyright if they hired you to write the code?
16:11	sobel	it depends on how the employment is arranged
16:11	daniel__1	and how complicated does this contract have to be
16:11	sobel	if the person is hired to do some work, the work product (code) belongs to the employer
16:12	sobel	e.g. code written as a coder on the clock or on salary
16:12	sobel	it's different if someone contracts a solution you might dig out of your toolbox of existing solutions, which may be your copyrighted material
16:12	daniel__1	i actually meant to start this discussion in another channel, heh
16:12	daniel__1	just realised it was clojure
16:13	daniel__1	and getting helpful responses anyway
16:13	sobel	relevant here though
16:13	daniel__1	basically, i got given a contract which scares me a bit because its long and i dont understand it
16:14	sobel	use a real atty if it matters
16:14	sobel	and beware of giant contracts
16:14	daniel__1	yeah, im not sure it does matter that much
16:14	TMA	for example, there is a special work-for-hire provision in our copyright law that takes precedence over any terms agreed between the parties; however if you are a corporation instead of a naural person, these need not apply
16:15	daniel__1	anyone ever worked for two competing business simultaneously?
16:15	daniel__1	and how do you handle that
16:16	sobel	usually the employer has wanted my exclusive service
16:16	TMA	daniel__1: tricky. you might need the first employer's permission to work for the second
16:17	daniel__1	yep, i've been open with both
16:17	skoude	I make a get request to a web service that returns json document, and I use clj-http.client get function for that.. The problem is that how can I read it to vector in clojure? I I try to use parse-string function in chesire, I get error: PersistenMap cannot be cast to java.lang.String..
16:17	daniel__1	but its still tricky, i don't want to get into conflicts with any contractual obligations
16:17	hiredman	software engineers are basically the worst people to ask about law and ip
16:17	daniel__1	heh hiredman, im sure thats true
16:18	ane	will and evaluate all its forms or stop at the first falsey?
16:18	daniel__1	but maybe it is a case of over-thinking
16:18	TMA	daniel__1: there is a reason for the lawyers being paid handsomely :)
16:18	ane	e.g. (and false (expensive-computation)) will it short-circuit
16:18	justin_smith	skoude: likely clj-http.client is giving you a hash map describing the entire result of the request (including headers), and the :body key will have the actual contents that you can parse or whatever
16:18	snowell	ane: It will stop at the first falsey
16:18	snowell	,(doc and)
16:18	daniel__1	TMA: i know, law is incredibly boring
16:18	clojurebot	"([] [x] [x & next]); Evaluates exprs one at a time, from left to right. If a form returns logical false (nil or false), and returns that value and doesn't evaluate any of the other expressions, otherwise it returns the value of the last expr. (and) returns true."
16:18	daniel__1	i don't envy anyone who has to learn it all
16:19	TMA	ane: it will stop
16:19	skoude	justin_smith: thanks.. I will check that..
16:19	justin_smith	,(and false (prinln "expensive$$$$")
16:19	clojurebot	#<RuntimeException java.lang.RuntimeException: EOF while reading>
16:19	justin_smith	,(and false (prinln "expensive$$$$"))
16:19	clojurebot	#error {\n :cause "Unable to resolve symbol: prinln in this context"\n :via\n [{:type clojure.lang.Compiler$CompilerException\n :message "java.lang.RuntimeException: Unable to resolve symbol: prinln in this context, compiling:(NO_SOURCE_PATH:0:0)"\n :at [clojure.lang.Compiler analyze "Compiler.java" 6704]}\n {:type java.lang.RuntimeException\n :message "Unable to resolve symbol: prinln in t...
16:19	irctc	Hiya. I'd like to be able to execute a function multiple times in parallel and return the results in a list. Like this: (pmap (fn [_] (myfunc)) (range 10)). Is there a standard function that can do this without the use of range and an underscore parameter?
16:19	justin_smith	ergh
16:19	ane	snowell: ok thanks
16:20	justin_smith	irctc: dotimes
16:20	justin_smith	well, you would need to create the futures in the dotimes body, so never mind, there isn't a fully pre-baked solution
16:21	justin_smith	~pmap
16:21	clojurebot	pmap is not what you want
16:21	justin_smith	(also)
16:21	ane	is there any way of making this a bit simpler (if (and (= @data []) (realized? my-future)) @data @data) i.e. i want it to return @data immediately otherwise wait for my-future to finish (which modifies data)
16:21	ane	(if data is [])
16:21	irctc	pmap seemed to have worked but not sure if there is something more straightforward.
16:21	justin_smith	ane: (do @my-future @data)
16:21	justin_smith	that returns @data, but only after my-future is done
16:23	irctc	Does dotimes run in parallel?
16:23	justin_smith	no, that's why I decided it wasn't a replacement
16:25	irctc	So I guess the easiest way is the way I already have it then. Can I simplify (fn [_] (myfunc)) ? I tried (constantly #(myfunc)) but it only calls myfunc once and repeats the result.
16:25	hiredman	ane: that is all a big race condition
16:26	hiredman	also (if x y y) is y
16:26	ane	yes, i just want to execute the future if (= @data []) is t
16:27	ane	otherwise use the currently committed value
16:27	justin_smith	more like (do x y) - x has a side effect here
16:27	hiredman	futures are executed when they are created
16:27	hlolli	Im using lein droid for the first time, and I connect to my android device repl trough port 9999, but changing something in emacs and evaluating does not change my running app on my device. Is this expected behaviour, do you need to do lein droid doall to see every change?
16:27	ane	hiredman: yeah, i've defined it earlier, but i want the function to block until it's finished if it's empty
16:28	hiredman	ane: futures have a great built in way to do that called deref
16:28	justin_smith	so, like I said above, (do @my-future @data)
16:29	ane	would that block even if @data has something in it?
16:30	justin_smith	(or (not-empty @data) (do @my-future @data))
16:30	hiredman	ane: so other things are writing to data?
16:30	ane	no, just the future
16:30	justin_smith	but yeah, still messy
16:30	hiredman	so why would it have something in it unless the future has a value to produce?
16:31	justin_smith	wait, are you sure you couldn't just deref the future and get its result and skip the atom?
16:31	hiredman	you almost certainly want one of the j.u.c queues and not an atom
16:33	ane	well i'm periodically fetching some data and storing it inside a ref. but i want the actual fetching only to happen every n calls to the function
16:35	ane	sigh. i've designed this all ass-backwards
16:35	hiredman	you want to queue up calls
16:38	ane	what would be the best method for doing that? agents?
16:39	hiredman	http://docs.oracle.com/javase/7/docs/api/java/util/concurrent/SynchronousQueue.html or core.async channels
16:40	ane	what about just using add-watch on the counter ref? when it's at every N steps run something in the background
16:41	justin_smith	ane: when did you switch from atom to ref?
16:41	justin_smith	or are you using one of these terms "generically" - because they are two different htings
16:41	hiredman	create a queue, spin up a thread/future/process of some kind that consumes N messages from the queue and then executes the bulk request, and then each message in the queue has another queue or promise that the response can be multiplexed to
16:41	hiredman	ane: no
16:42	hiredman	core.async may even have some machinery that would do this already
16:43	ane	justin_smith: oh i don't think i mentioned atoms, but maybe
16:44	justin_smith	ane: sorry, poor reading comprehension on my part
16:44	justin_smith	you didn't mention atoms
16:46	ane	hiredman: sounds a bit more complicated, but infinitely smarter
16:47	hiredman	no way
16:47	hiredman	the STM is way more complicated and you are way more likely to screw up using it
16:47	ane	hiredman: i just can't figure out what the queue contents actually are at this point
16:47	hiredman	I do not recommend using refs
16:48	Jabberz	do folks use visualVM for clojure app memory profiling, or something else?
16:48	hiredman	ane: the queue contents are the arguments to the function you are batching up (and if you care about getting results back a promise for the results)
16:49	hiredman	then you have a thread that loops around consuming from the queue and once it has consumed N items, it takes those items and executes a batch, then takes the results from executing that batch and debatches them out to the promises (if you need the results)
16:50	ane	ah, now i see. well i have no arguments to pass to the function, and i just need the result to be stored elsewhere, not to be returned, like a database or an in-memory ref
16:51	hiredman	Jabberz: I've used visualvm, there are nicer profiles for the jvm with all kinds of features but you'll have to shell out money for licenses
16:53	hiredman	ane: in that case you might actually consider an agent or an executor
16:54	hiredman	if your value can be the value in an agent, you can store a "last-updated" in the value and if a refresh request is sent, ignore it if last-updated is less than whatever time frame
16:55	hiredman	but in that case you really might just want to consider unconditionally refreshing every time period, and never have explicit refresh requests
16:56	hiredman	you have an atom containing some value, and a scheduled executor refreshes the value of the atom every time period and clients just deref the atom
16:56	ane	yeah, that's actually what i was going to implement, using a java timer or some such
16:57	ane	thought it'd be simpler to initially prototype using just a global variable and simple cache
16:59	hiredman	a looping future and an atom are very straight forward
17:00	hiredman	but in your initial discussion you mentioned waiting for the future to be realized, which you wouldn't do
17:00	ane	indeed
17:25	hlolli	Still having problem with lein droid and cider. No matter how I change the profiles.clj I always get this error ONLY with droid: WARNING: The following required nREPL ops are not supported:
17:25	hlolli	classpath format-code format-edn refresh
17:25	hlolli	Please, install (or update) cider-nrepl 0.9.1 and restart CIDER
17:42	WorldsEndless	How do I use :rename in my ns declaration? e.g:
17:42	WorldsEndless
17:42	WorldsEndless	(ns mine.styles
17:42	WorldsEndless	(:require [garden.color :as c :refer [{:rename '{hex->rgb hr}}]])) ;; doesn't work
17:42	WorldsEndless	I've tried several variation on it
17:42	justin_smith	don't use ' inside the ns form
17:42	justin_smith	and I don't think :rename should go inside :refer...
17:43	WorldsEndless	I can't seem to find any examples, other than the main docs that say :rename can go SOMEWHERE...
17:45	justin_smith	,(require '[clojure.string :as s :refer [split] :rename {split schmoop})
17:45	clojurebot	#<RuntimeException java.lang.RuntimeException: Unmatched delimiter: )>
17:45	justin_smith	,(require '[clojure.string :as s :refer [split] :rename {split schmoop}])
17:45	clojurebot	nil
17:45	justin_smith	,(schoop "hello world" #" ")
17:45	clojurebot	#error {\n :cause "Unable to resolve symbol: schoop in this context"\n :via\n [{:type clojure.lang.Compiler$CompilerException\n :message "java.lang.RuntimeException: Unable to resolve symbol: schoop in this context, compiling:(NO_SOURCE_PATH:0:0)"\n :at [clojure.lang.Compiler analyze "Compiler.java" 6704]}\n {:type java.lang.RuntimeException\n :message "Unable to resolve symbol: schoop in t...
17:45	justin_smith	,(schmoop "hello world" #" ")
17:45	clojurebot	["hello" "world"]
17:45	WorldsEndless	Say, that clojurebot is pretty cool!
17:45	justin_smith	WorldsEndless: ^ see above, but without the leading ' before the vector in the ns form
17:46	justin_smith	WorldsEndless: yes, it's a nice feature
17:47	justin_smith	that's a slightly unintuitive mix when you have refer and rename together, to be sure
17:48	WorldsEndless	So, It compiles but doesn't work for me
17:48	WorldsEndless	(ns turbo-tenure.styles
17:48	WorldsEndless	(:require [garden.color :rename {hex->rgb hr}]))
17:48	justin_smith	well, you aren't using refer there
17:48	WorldsEndless	Yeah, took it out for clarity
17:48	justin_smith	OK
17:48	justin_smith	so hex->rgb works, but hr does not?
17:48	WorldsEndless	I'm just trying to rename the ugly function, but hr does not work
17:49	WorldsEndless	"unable to resolve symbol"
17:49	WorldsEndless	I guess if I have to I can use "require" outside of the ns declaration, but I was hoping I wouldn't need to do that
17:49	justin_smith	WorldsEndless: note that it should be :refer [hex->rgb] :rename {:hex->rgb hr}
17:49	justin_smith	:require runs the same code, so you don't need to do that
17:50	WorldsEndless	Ah! Beautiful
17:50	WorldsEndless	Getting the right combo of refer and rename was what I was missing
17:50	justin_smith	WorldsEndless: that's what I meant about it being unintuitive
17:50	justin_smith	you ask to refer to the un-renamed version, and you get the renamed
17:50	WorldsEndless	Thanks, justin_smith (thought you were referring to my code with that)
17:51	sdegutis	What's the best way to handle text fields in Reagent?
17:53	WorldsEndless	sdegutis: what are you trying to do?
17:53	sdegutis	Just create normal forms that can be submitted via AJAX.
17:55	WorldsEndless	I'm pretty new to reagent myself, but I would think you'd just handle them in the normal DOM way (i.e. give them an id, refer to them)
17:55	WorldsEndless	^ sdegutis
17:56	justin_smith	sdegutis: in reagent, I tie the state of the form elements to some part of an ratom, and read the ratom on submit to build the ajax request
17:56	sdegutis	I was under the impression that any text you type into it gets squashed as soon as you type if you try to store it in an atom or anything?
17:56	justin_smith	squashed?
17:57	sdegutis	Like, the field is tied to ratom, ratom is empty, field is empty, you click the field, type "f", and since the change isn't propagated back to the ratom, it asks the ratom what to display, which is nothing, and the field says ""
17:57	justin_smith	sdegutis: more specifically, an on-change that modifies the ratom
17:57	sdegutis	Mainly because during onchange event (or whatever), it --- ooh, so you specifically change the ratom during onchange.
17:57	justin_smith	sdegutis: I'm not talking about the ratom that renders the component
17:58	sdegutis	Okay that makes sense. But then how do you handle the cursor always going to the end of the field?
17:58	justin_smith	something is making redraws happen because you are watching data for rendering that you modify while typing
17:58	justin_smith	don't do that, and that behavior stops
17:59	justin_smith	or at least, watch it in a different component, not the same one accepting the input
17:59	sdegutis	So another component should be responsible for input validation than the input itself?
17:59	sdegutis	Ah maybe a higher level component, I guess, one that sees both the input and the error field which it should show upon error...
17:59	justin_smith	sdegutis: insanely simplified version of the problem: you tell joe to follow bob, you tell bob to follow joe, nobody does anything interesting and they walk in circles
17:59	justin_smith	so don't do that
18:00	sdegutis	right
18:00	sdegutis	Thanks, I think I understand enough to solve this now.
18:46	skeuomorf	Is there a way to write multiline docstrings for functions inside a protocol? e.g. (defprotocol MyProtocol "A protocol which represents an entity." (my-function [this] "multiline docstring here!!"))
18:48	skeuomorf	argh, had an unescaped `\` in the docstring
18:48	skeuomorf	which is weird, that I have to escape characters inside the docstring
18:52	justin_smith	skeuomorf: \ inside strings needs escaping, because \c for most characters c is not valid
18:53	skeuomorf	ah
18:54	justin_smith	being the escape string itself, it needs escaping (mind you this is all invalid inside the crazy world of regex)
18:54	justin_smith	,#"\a"
18:54	clojurebot	#"\a"
18:55	skeuomorf	Yeah, ofc
18:56	justin_smith	,"\a"
18:56	clojurebot	#<RuntimeException java.lang.RuntimeException: Unsupported escape character: \a>
20:24	skeuomorf	let's say I have a record R which has two "properties", x and y, x is an atom holding a map and y is an int. Let's say we have two instance (def r1 (->R (atom {}) 2)) and (def r2 (->R (atom {:my-key r1}) 3)). Now, what I want to do is change the value of y which is inside r1 which is inside x which is inside r2, what would be the cleanest way to do that?
20:27	skeuomorf	for the sake argument, assuming "properties" inside records weren't private, what I would want to change is (y (:my-key @(x r2))
20:28	skeuomorf	s/sake/sake\ of/
20:28	wmealing	well, i've started using specter for that kind of manipulation.
20:28	wmealing	i'm by no means cool though
20:28	wmealing	so i'm probablly doing things all kinds of wrong
20:29	skeuomorf	I'd prefer to use it without external libs though, I could define that y field as mutable but that seems dirty
20:32	skeuomorf	wmealing: A quick glimpse, I think spectre doesn't work with records? If I were using a regular map, I would've just made a new version with the new value out of the old one, but records' members are private
21:01	skeuomorf	Screw it, did it with getter/setter :)
21:07	wmealing	skeuomorf: sorry man had to bail , i had a meeting
21:10	skeuomorf	wmealing: No worries :)
21:51	justin_smith	skeuomorf is gone, but he should know you can do everything you can do with maps to record
21:51	justin_smith	s
21:51	htmldrum	Anyone got some material on setting up a Ring application on AWS? I'm used to preparing hosts via cloudformation or a provisioning tool like Puppet/Chef but am looking for resources on where to start as a newbie to Clojure/Java web services.
21:52	justin_smith	htmldrum: it's a lot easier to use elasticbeanstalk
21:52	justin_smith	you can use lein ring to make an uberwar, hand the uberwar to elasticbeanstalk, and that's it
21:53	htmldrum	justin_smith: Thank you :)
23:16	TimMc	justin_smith: Except for call empty or (sometimes) dissoc on them, because then you get a map again. :-P
23:16	justin_smith	TimMc: you can do those things though!
23:17	TimMc	True!
23:17	justin_smith	you just get a different data type back