#clojure – 2014-12-26

2014-12-26

00:46	ryancole	as a newbie to clojure, what editor should i be using on windows? is light table the way to go, or should i try something like emacs?
00:46	ryancole	like in the long run, which would benefit me the most
00:47	justin_smith	ryancole: as a newcomer, I would start by using (require 'my.ns :reload) after saving a new version of the namespace file
00:47	justin_smith	save the editor integration for later, when you realize it isn't magic
00:48	ryancole	i think that was over my head. are you saying to just use repl?
00:48	justin_smith	I like emacs as a long term user, but cider gets broken a lot with new releases, so it can be frustrating. I have been using inferior lisp lately instead.
00:48	justin_smith	ryancole: yes, you can reload code in the repl with require, after saving it. The editor integration just maps that to a keypress (and has shortcuts for things like docs of course)
00:49	justin_smith	ryancole: also, the most featureful editor integration for clojure is intellij idea, with the cursive plugin
00:50	justin_smith	ryancole: afaik the only sane way to do step debugging of clojure code right now
00:50	justin_smith	(but I still use emacs because I have used emacs for over a decade and IDEs bug me)
00:52	ryancole	ok, perhaps clojure's repl is powerful enough to fully support editing code in files and such, without the need for an extra text editor?
00:52	ryancole	im familiar with repl for like python where it wasnt commonly used as also the "editor"
00:52	justin_smith	not quite. Do the editing in whatever editor you like best (at first), and the repl can reload after you update the code.
00:52	ryancole	more so used for like one-off testing, or running files, etc
00:52	ryancole	ah ok i see
00:53	namra	ryancole: you might also look at this http://thinkrelevance.com/blog/2013/06/04/clojure-workflow-reloaded
00:53	justin_smith	clojure's repl is interesting in that you can leave it running as you update code, and it can reload all your new definitions etc. without needing a restart
00:53	justin_smith	though there are a few constructs that don't play as nicely with that, they are only a few
00:59	ryancole	cool, im going to go hop in bed and read that workflow blog post. thanks! :)
00:59	justin_smith	namra: ryancole: the reloaded workflow is great, but not really the best way to start using clojure
00:59	justin_smith	imho
01:00	justin_smith	eventually, you'll love it, but better to just do the repl basics first I think
01:00	namra	true
01:00	namra	but it give a nice overview what is possible with the repl, and that one is not really required to use a specific editor that has plugins to interact with a repl.
01:01	namra	of course using such editor with a plugin comes also in handy ^^
01:01	justin_smith	that's an excellent point, yes
01:08	namra	ryancole: have you worked with anything like emacs or vim before?
01:09	namra	such editors are nice when you like to tinker and customize stuff, and don't want a large IDE to get into your way
01:10	namra	and currently it looks like that there are both for vim and emacs good plugins available to write programms in clojure
01:10	ryancole	namra, vim - not emacs
01:10	justin_smith	fireplace.vim is good
01:10	namra	yep
01:11	justin_smith	but I still think starting without the editor integration helps
01:11	namra	justin_smith: i agree with you
01:12	namra	ryancole: then i'd go with vim or vim-like, so you don't need to dive into emacs, if time is scarce. but there's still evil-mode ^^, to make a transition to emacs a little bit easier.
01:13	ryancole	haha, vi for emacs
01:13	ryancole	nice
01:13	namra	a nice looking and simple ide that comes with integrated leiningen and repl: https://nightcode.info/
01:14	justin_smith	ryancole: I use it because I like the features of emacs (eg. especially org-mode and gpg integration), and I like the extension language being a real language I can tolerating coding in, but I hate the default keybindings, they are sadistic
01:14	namra	:D
01:15	ryancole	so ive heard :P
01:15	namra	never tried emacs, but the elisp now looks very appealing. easier than the cryptic vim-syntax ^^
01:16	ryancole	im just aiming for the most minimal, basic route into a simple edit code -> run code learning process
01:17	ryancole	and as i get familiar with the tools, add in more feature packed editors
01:18	namra	then what justin_smith said seems a good way, take an editor your familiar with, edit you code within it and use the repl to reload the files and test your stuff within the repl
01:24	ryancole	sweet, sounds good to me :)
01:24	ryancole	ok guys gotta hop off. ill be reading up on stuff and swing back by later, im sure.
01:24	ryancole	thanks
02:34	santaClaws_	hey
02:36	santaClaws_	can I do those haskell (f.g) x = f (g x) stuff in clojure?
02:38	andyf	(comp f g) is Clojure's (f . g)
02:47	santaClaws_	ok cool thing. I have just started, The chapter on maps nad list is uite long . at iloveponies.github.io
02:47	santaClaws_	*and
02:53	santaClaws_	I wanted to know about functional programming , I chose clojure, although my codes have an awful lot of parenthesis.
03:03	rksm	Hello, any fipp users here? Is there an easy way to keep comments when pretty printing with fipp.clojure/pprint?
03:15	rksm	Or for that matter, is there a recommended other way to pretty print clj code?
03:27	korpse	How do people use joplin or ragtime in production or from an uberjar?
04:17	piranha	I'm having exact trouble like here: http://stackoverflow.com/questions/23489106/cljx-starter-project-browser-repl-issue - any ideas how to solve?
04:17	piranha	I've connected to my browser and can't require anything
04:18	augustl	does mori (cljs data structures in JS) have any serialization built in?
04:19	piranha	augustl: you convert it to JS structures and then JSON.stringify, if that's your question
04:21	octe	what better way is there to get the shortest collection then this: (reduce (fn [x y] (if (> (count x) (count y)) y x)) coll)
04:22	hyPiRion	octe: (apply min-key count colls)
04:22	si14	is there anything similar to Prismatic's Graph, but for "decision graphs" like this one https://github.com/for-GET/http-decision-diagram ?
04:23	octe	thanks
04:23	si14	there is Liberator, but I'm interested in more general "engine"
04:24	si14	of course it's possible to use just a big bunch of nested if-s, but it quickly becomes uncomfortable
04:27	augustl	piranha: I see, was hoping there was a way to avoid the conversion to JS structures :)
04:28	piranha	augustl: well, I guess with transit-js you could write handlers to do that :)
04:55	octe	i'm writing a function to find the shortest path between two nodes in a graph, it seems to work but is quite slow and i'm not sure how to do it in a faster way without having some kind of mutable state
04:55	octe	http://pastebin.com/X7HxwpyU
04:58	si14	octe: you may be interested in Dijkstra algorithm. Google gives a lot of relevant posts on "dijkstra clojure" request
05:01	si14	octe: generally speaking, you have quite a lot of overhead in your algorithm. e.g., this (filter #(not (lazy-contains? (flatten path) %1)) (get-neighbours current)) piece will have quadratic complexity because you are flattening and scanning for each of neighbours
05:02	octe	yeah, i know
05:02	octe	i'm just not sure how to do it in a better way :)
05:03	octe	i'm reading up on dijkstras algoorithm
05:16	si14	octe: it's a bit nontrivial to translate it to Clojure properly from typical "mutable" description, but it's a worthy exercise :)
05:17	octe	yeah
05:17	octe	it's an interesting task :)
05:22	mearnsh	justin_smith: "nothing in the code you pasted uses atom" - that's why i'm stumped...
05:25	mearnsh	(and yeah I know my use of atom? is confounding but it makes sense here)
05:27	andyf	are you aware of the data.priority-map library for maintaining maps with items sorted by their values? Very useful for Dijkstra's algorithm
05:57	dysfun	is there a macro for doing the inverse of {:keys [foo bar]}, i.e. i have vars foo and bar and i want a shorthand for doing {:foo foo :bar bar}
05:58	dysfun	it seems like a common case
05:58	SagiCZ1	wait what
05:59	SagiCZ1	you cant use values to get keys, can you?.. they are not uniqe
05:59	dysfun	you could, potentially expecting multiple results
05:59	dysfun	but it would be slow and daft
06:00	SagiCZ1	i guess..
06:00	dysfun	if you want this functionality, there's a function that inverts a map (with those limitations), let me look up the name
06:01	sm0ke	is there some representation for int in clojure like for bigdec and bigint?
06:01	SagiCZ1	cool i didnt know that.. well what you ask for is not a macro but a destructuring functionality i think
06:01	sm0ke	,(class 1M)
06:01	clojurebot	#<AccessControlException java.security.AccessControlException: access denied ("java.lang.RuntimePermission" "accessDeclaredMembers")>
06:01	sm0ke	hurmm
06:01	SagiCZ1	,(type 4)
06:01	clojurebot	#<AccessControlException java.security.AccessControlException: access denied ("java.lang.RuntimePermission" "accessDeclaredMembers")>
06:02	dysfun	SagiCZ1: well in this case, that's a destructuring bind taken care of by the reader, yes. this is just shorthand to allow me to be lazy. I can see how it would be a trivial macro. but we're assuming i'm going to pass in a fixed set of items anyway and since the names are calculable trivially, i'm not concerned with the ramifications of potentially duplicating things etc.
06:06	sm0ke	edn should ideally differentate between a int and a long
06:06	sm0ke	is my point
06:07	SagiCZ1	sm0ke: why do you need to?
06:08	dysfun	SagiCZ1: https://www.refheap.com/95417
06:09	SagiCZ1	oh.. i see.. i didnt realize that the value and key is the same in the pair
06:13	dysfun	if they weren't, it wouldn't be the inverse of the destructuring bind :)
06:15	Bronsa	dysfun: fyi there's no such thing as "destructuring bind taken care of by the reader"
06:15	Bronsa	dysfun: the destructuring functionality is just macrology
06:24	dysfun	hrm, howso?
06:26	Bronsa	$source destructure
06:26	lazybot	destructure is http://is.gd/R9QO9F
06:27	Bronsa	dysfun: destructure is just a regular function, it's used inside a bunch of macros like let and fn
06:31	dysfun	oh right, cool
06:33	SagiCZ1	can i avoid calling rand twice here and get the same result?
06:33	SagiCZ1	,(repeatedly 5 #(vector (rand) (rand)))
06:33	clojurebot	#<AccessControlException java.security.AccessControlException: access denied ("java.lang.RuntimePermission" "accessDeclaredMembers")>
06:33	SagiCZ1	who broke clojurebot?
07:49	Frozenlock	dysfun: is this what you were looking for? https://www.refheap.com/11818
07:49	mearnsh	justin_smith: uh sorry, i'm a fool, ignore
08:00	dysfun	Frozenlock: no, i already refheap'd a quickly thrown together one: https://www.refheap.com/95417
08:02	dysfun	actually, sorry, i misread your example. yes, that also works
08:02	Frozenlock	Ah sorry. Your's more general. I guess the one I pasted was filtering nil values for some reason.
08:04	dysfun	shrug it was the first thing i came up with
08:04	dysfun	i figure there's not a great deal that can go wrong
08:04	Frozenlock	inb4 the planet explodes!!!!
08:06	dysfun	hrm, that's odd
08:06	dysfun	,(keyword 'nil)
08:06	clojurebot	#<AccessControlException java.security.AccessControlException: access denied ("java.lang.RuntimePermission" "accessDeclaredMembers")>
08:06	jonathanj	i don't understand how to deploy lein-ring applications to production using an uberjar, ring options have to be in a :ring key in the project so how do i override/set these in production?
08:07	dysfun	jonathanj: it's possible you've outgrown lein-ring, it's really just a small wrapper that'll provide a main()
08:08	dysfun	it uses jetty under the hood. you can write your own main function and provide :main in the project.clj
08:08	dysfun	ring-server is very easy to use, just a single function call
08:08	Frozenlock	jonathanj: as dysfun said, you might want to use jetty in your -main. ----> (jetty/run-jetty #'app {:port some-port :join? false})
08:09	dysfun	(as is jetty. well, if you're not using it as a container, that is...)
08:10	jonathanj	dysfun, Frozenlock: thank you :)
08:33	godd2	would you say that [1 2 3] is merely syntactic sugar for (vector 1 2 3) ?
08:40	AimHere	Yes
08:40	AimHere	Though I'd dispute the phrase 'merely syntactic sugar'
08:40	AimHere	Unless you're at the level of wiring up your NAND gates yourself, all computer programming is just syntactic sugar
08:42	dysfun	heh
08:42	dysfun	nice way of looking at it
08:43	dysfun	does anyone know why (keyword 'nil) returns nil? surely at that point it's the symbol nil?
08:44	Bronsa	,(keyword nil)
08:44	clojurebot	#<AccessControlException java.security.AccessControlException: access denied ("java.lang.RuntimePermission" "accessDeclaredMembers")>
08:44	Bronsa	&(keyword nil)
08:44	lazybot	⇒ nil
08:44	Bronsa	&(keyword 2)
08:44	lazybot	⇒ nil
08:44	Bronsa	&(keyword (Object.))
08:44	lazybot	⇒ nil
08:44	Bronsa	dysfun: keyword returns nil if you hand it a nonsensical arg
08:44	AimHere	(keyword '2)
08:44	godd2	&(keyword 'nil)
08:44	lazybot	⇒ nil
08:45	AimHere	,(keyword '2)
08:45	clojurebot	#<AccessControlException java.security.AccessControlException: access denied ("java.lang.RuntimePermission" "accessDeclaredMembers")>
08:45	Bronsa	dysfun: also 'nil is the same as nil
08:45	dysfun	why is a symbol nonsensical?
08:45	Bronsa	dysfun: nil is not a symbol
08:45	Bronsa	&(symbol? nil)
08:45	lazybot	⇒ false
08:45	Bronsa	&(symbol? 'nil)
08:45	lazybot	⇒ false
08:45	dysfun	so nil can't be quoted?
08:45	Bronsa	&(= nil 'nil)
08:45	lazybot	⇒ true
08:45	Bronsa	dysfun: it can be quoted, it's just not a symbol
08:45	Bronsa	dysfun: like true and false
08:45	Bronsa	quoting nil, true and false returns nil true and false
08:45	Bronsa	they are self-evaluating
08:46	Bronsa	just like quoting a keyword returns that keyword
08:46	Bronsa	,':foo
08:46	clojurebot	#<AccessControlException java.security.AccessControlException: access denied ("java.lang.RuntimePermission" "accessDeclaredMembers")>
08:46	Bronsa	&':foo
08:46	lazybot	⇒ :foo
08:46	dysfun	so in order to store the symbol nil, i would have to cast to symbol first?
08:46	Bronsa	yeah.. you can only obtain it via ##(symbol "nil")
08:46	lazybot	⇒ nil
08:46	dysfun	hrm. i'm not sure how i feel about that
08:47	Bronsa	about what?
08:47	dysfun	nil being self-evaluating
08:48	Bronsa	dysfun: it is documented that nil is not a symbol btw
08:48	dysfun	i'm sure it is
08:48	Bronsa	"Strings, numbers, characters, true, false, nil and keywords evaluate to themselves."
08:48	luxbock	##(nil? (symbol "nil"))
08:48	lazybot	⇒ false
08:48	Bronsa	and also, "nil is not a Symbol"
08:49	dysfun	i'm trying to figure out in my head if that's more or less confusing than the alternative
08:49	Bronsa	dysfun: imgagine how confusing it would be if every time something returned "nil" you had to figure out if it was the symbol nil or the "value" nil
08:50	AimHere	I thought nil can be a value of any data type
08:50	Bronsa	dysfun: not even talking about the fact that (symbol "nil") evaluates to a truthy value
08:50	dysfun	well not really. most programs don't use symbols outside of macros
08:51	dysfun	i think if you've quoted nil, it's quite clear you meant the symbol
08:52	dysfun	but it's not a common case, so i don't think it's a big deal
08:52	Bronsa	dysfun: sure but think about (defn foo [some-map] (get some-map some-key)), and you get back "nil" at the repl
08:52	Bronsa	dysfun: now you have no way to know if that's a symbol or the nil "value", looking at it
08:53	dysfun	well, my repl has pretty-printing that works. and your code will know, since strings are truthy
08:55	dysfun	i guess it comes down to whether you think having the symbol 'nil around is a good thing
08:56	dysfun	and i think in the general case, probably not
09:24	SagiCZ1	say you have an application with gui and there is a way to start some long running tasks.. there should always be an option to interrupt that task and stop it.. say it runs in a thread in future, how would i go about interrupting it?
09:28	jonathanj	i'm trying to define a name (used in several places) that is passed in from the command-line
09:28	jonathanj	(a database uri in this case)
09:28	jonathanj	usually i'd just pass the value around but in this case it seems like using a ^:dynamic var might be easier?
09:29	jonathanj	i've defined it as (def ^:dynamic foo) and in my main function i do (defonce foo ...)
09:29	Bronsa	SagiCZ1: future-cancel
09:29	jonathanj	this gives me a warning though: Warning: database-uri not declared dynamic and thus is not dynamically rebindable, but its name suggests otherwise. Please either indicate ^:dynamic database-uri or change the name.
09:30	dysfun	jonathanj: you want (binding [name val])
09:30	SagiCZ1	(doc future-cancel)
09:30	clojurebot	#<AccessControlException java.security.AccessControlException: access denied ("java.lang.RuntimePermission" "accessDeclaredMembers")>
09:32	jonathanj	dysfun: database-uri is used from several functions (called from various places probably from other threads if i understand how jetty works) so how do i used binding in this case?
09:32	jonathanj	(binding [...] (run-jetty ...) ?
09:32	si14	(sorry, that /me was erroneous)
09:33	SagiCZ1	si14: do you find it unreadable?
09:34	si14	SagiCZ1: I wonder if it can be done better. One of the low handing fruits is if-not-let macro, of course
09:34	dysfun	jonathan: should be fine
09:35	SagiCZ1	si14: this written in java would be three times as long
09:36	si14	SagiCZ1: you are right, of course :) I believe it can be improved though
09:36	SagiCZ1	si14: yeah i would love to hear some improvements myself..
09:38	SagiCZ1	Bronsa: thank you for future-cancel
10:08	kl	Hi
10:08	kl	Looking into core.async
10:08	jonathanj	how can i conditionally thread some things? something like (-> X foo bar (if some-cond? (-> quux baz)) quaz)?
10:08	kl	When you use a go macro in clojure/core.async - is it a thread of its own?
10:08	SagiCZ1	go macro does not create a thread
10:09	kl	SagiCZ1: what is it? I'm looking to compare that to an actual golang Goroutine
10:09	SagiCZ1	it is just a block of code that gets executed via callback.. the callback mechanism is hidden.. but no new threads are spawned.. cant really compare it to golang
10:10	kl	SagiCZ1: so every go macro executes, on the main thread?
10:11	SagiCZ1	yse
10:11	SagiCZ1	yes
10:11	SagiCZ1	u can have thread if you use thread blocks
10:11	SagiCZ1	(thread ...)
10:11	SagiCZ1	and then use >!! and <!!
10:11	dysfun	huh? aren't go blocks thread-local as opposed to specifically on the main thread?
10:12	kl	something doesn't sound right about this
10:12	SagiCZ1	i might be wrong
10:12	SagiCZ1	the doc say: Asynchronously executes the body, returning immediately to the calling thread.
10:12	SagiCZ1	and: ...by 'parking' the calling thread rather than tying up an OS thread
10:13	SagiCZ1	me too actually, dont take my word on it..
10:14	SagiCZ1	i thought that go blocks and >! <! dont use new threads
10:16	dysfun	okay, it uses a thread pool
10:20	kl	dysfun: so it basically uses a thread (with a maximum number of threads i.e. pool)
10:20	kl	This is what I thought
10:26	octe	i have a map where each key is a parent and the value is the child and i want to from one key create a list of the relations
10:26	octe	bad explanation i think
10:26	octe	but in a mutable/imperative way i'd do something like while ((current = map.get(current)) != null) { resultList.add(current) }
10:27	SagiCZ1	that would always leave you with one element in the list
10:29	octe	not really?
10:29	SagiCZ1	current is still the same thing?
10:29	octe	it would change for each iteration
10:29	SagiCZ1	yeah i dont see that in the example
10:29	octe	= map.get(current)
10:30	octe	http://pastebin.com/N5FCKS0C clojure implementation
10:30	octe	showing what i mean
10:32	octe	but obviously not implemented in a very good way..
10:32	octe	but it works
10:32	SagiCZ1	yeah
10:32	SagiCZ1	you can use nil? btw
10:32	SagiCZ1	instead of not (= nil .. )
10:32	octe	true
10:33	SagiCZ1	i think you could build this list using reduce
10:34	SagiCZ1	so you have a map like this {:parent "child" :child "grandchild" ..} ?
10:34	octe	yes
10:34	octe	ending where the key maps to nil
10:35	SagiCZ1	and you want a path from root to the last children?
10:35	octe	from one of the keys to the root, i guess
10:35	SagiCZ1	i see
10:35	octe	'(:parent :child :grandchild)
10:36	SagiCZ1	the maps in clojure are not really meant to used this way i think.. but you can have a look at tree-seq and clojure.walk which should solve this issue
10:37	kl	are there any must-reads after Joy of Clojure?
10:37	octe	what would be a better way to represent it?
10:38	SagiCZ1	clojure.zip is for working with nodes, children, branches etc
10:38	SagiCZ1	http://clojure.github.io/clojure/clojure.zip-api.html
10:52	octe	SagiCZ1, http://pastebin.com/fVJ6RvCS that seems to work with reduce
10:53	octe	if you were curious :)
10:54	nuwanda_	https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YgvJqWiyMRY Brandon Bloom talking about representing data in trees with clojure
11:00	justin_smith	octe: sounds like you may want the adjacency list representation for graphs
11:00	justin_smith	http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Adjacency_list
11:01	justin_smith	the nice thing about an adjacency list, is it can represent a fully general graph (including potentially cycles) without using a mutable or cyclic datastructure
11:02	bbloom	kl: a goroutine is a proper green thread with it's own stack
11:03	bbloom	kl: go blocks in core.async have their own per-block state, but it's a finite state machine, not a full stack
11:03	justin_smith	SagiCZ1: and they use their own pool of threads on the jvm version
11:03	bbloom	dysfun: go block code may run on the original thread depending on readiness of channels and other implementation details
11:03	bbloom	there is a thread pool pre-allocated for go blocks
11:03	bbloom	which is similar to how golang multiplexes go routines on to threads
11:04	bbloom	on cljs, there are no threads
11:04	bbloom	so go blocks execute via setTimeout (or similar) when there is idle time
11:04	bbloom	on the jvm, there is a thread pool for go block execution
11:04	bbloom	but where the go block code runs is never a promise
11:04	bbloom	i should say "is undefined"
11:04	bbloom	yeah, but like i said: sometimes go block code can run on the original thread
11:05	bbloom	go block bodies should never block the thread w/o using channel operations
11:07	octe	justin_smith, that sounds fitting
11:08	justin_smith	bbloom: I think you were (are?) lagging again
11:08	justin_smith	maybe not
11:09	bbloom	justin_smith: argh. thanks
11:09	bbloom	i have no way of debugging it
11:10	justin_smith	erc had a "lag" section of its status bar
11:10	justin_smith	I don't know if other clients have this...
11:10	bbloom	i have a /lagcheck command
11:10	bbloom	but i have to execute it manually
11:10	justin_smith	yeah, seems like it would be a nice thing to have periodically run and displayed in a status bar automatically
11:12	octe	i think i've created an implementation of dijkstras algorithm
11:12	octe	http://pastebin.com/QcQU3n30 how does it look?
11:14	octe	it still kind of slow for longer paths
11:14	justin_smith	octe: there are also graph libs, that implement various path finding algorithms (and books full of various graph algorithms you could implement...)
11:15	octe	yup, i wanted to try myself though :)
11:15	justin_smith	http://www.textbooks.com/BooksDescription.php?BKN=951029&SBC=ME8&kpid=9780262033848N&kpid=9780262033848N&kenshu=02dbe049-1491-fa29-ea40-0000115ff57c&mcid=XKS-7565-39-186-GoogleShopping-PRIDREPLACE-291&gclid=CK_tzqyN5MICFVSSfgodjXgA7g lots of great graph algorithms in this book
11:16	justin_smith	it's a commonly used textbook, so not super hard to find used
11:18	fm75	justin_smith: studied on it long time ago, and re-bought it recently for my library :)
11:19	justin_smith	fm75: it's a good book, I have learned a lot from it
11:20	fm75	justin_smith: I didn't like too much the fact that arrays are 1-based in the pseudocode - sometimes it was painful
11:21	justin_smith	yeah, it's not perfect
11:34	Hamled	Is it non-idiomatic or otherwise a bad idea to do something like (let [sentinel (gensym) foo (get coll key sentinel)] (if (= foo sentinel) ...))
11:34	justin_smith	Hamled: (contains? coll key)
11:34	Hamled	does that work for indexed sequences like vectors
11:34	justin_smith	same way get does
11:35	Hamled	okay thanks
11:35	justin_smith	by checking if the index is there
11:35	justin_smith	&(contains? [:a :b :c] 1)
11:35	lazybot	⇒ true
11:36	dnolen_	Hamled: it's more common to use a namespaced keyword or (Object.)
11:36	bbloom	Hamled: it's not super idiomatic, but it's not a bad idea either. in addition to contains?, which justin_smith mentioned, there's also ##(doc find)
11:36	lazybot	⇒ "([map key]); Returns the map entry for key, or nil if key not present."
11:36	justin_smith	oh yeah, I keep forgetting about find
11:37	Hamled	ah yeah I had been thinking about find and I think my experience with other languages made me figure it wouldn't work with vectors
11:37	Hamled	thanks :)
11:37	justin_smith	&(find [:a :b :c] 1)
11:37	lazybot	⇒ [1 :b]
11:37	justin_smith	I would not have guessed
11:37	justin_smith	but that is nifty
11:38	luxbock	had no idea about `find` but I could've used it many times before, nice
11:39	luxbock	I should try to find a way to use it with what I'm working now so I don't forget about it
11:40	justin_smith	also, find should be on the clojure cheatsheet
11:40	justin_smith	ahh, it's in grimoire, of course
11:40	Hamled	oh I'll have to bookmark that
11:43	SagiCZ1	thanks to all who reacted to something i wrote, i was out for a second.
11:43	SagiCZ1	on the topic of trees.. i am trying to write an algorithm that divides data into a non-balanced binary tree and i need to be able to easily traverse the leaves of this tree.. what would be the best data representation? i am not sure if a simple map can cut it
11:44	SagiCZ1	watching Brandon's video atm
11:45	justin_smith	SagiCZ1: for a simple non-balanced tree I would use (deftype tree [left right]) and a protocol for inserting / removing
11:45	justin_smith	err [value left right] of course
11:45	SagiCZ1	that would be a first time when i would really need to implement a protocol in clojure.. maybe its about time i learn about that
11:46	justin_smith	SagiCZ1: I think IAssociative would be the right one to implement (maybe?)
11:47	luxbock	SagiCZ1: I'm working on a project that uses zippers to represent game trees, and when I started out I was just learning about protocols, so I made all my nodes records and then created some protocols to use them with, but now I just finished re-writing all of that to just use regular maps
11:47	octe	e
11:47	octe	heh
11:47	SagiCZ1	luxbock: cool.. so how does that work?
11:48	octe	turns out most of the time was being spent on getting the children in my function, which was actually a database query
11:48	justin_smith	woah, zippers?
11:48	justin_smith	octe: heh, that would do it
11:49	luxbock	SagiCZ1: I have three different kinds of nodes, so I had a TreeNode protocol with branch?, children and make-node defined
11:49	luxbock	but I switched to just using :type key inside a map instead
11:49	octe	yup, a path with 17 nodes went from 1s to 130ms when i memoized the db-query function
11:49	octe	:P
11:50	SagiCZ1	luxbock: so how does the protocol work now? it gets dispatched acording to the :type?
11:50	luxbock	now branch?, children and make-node are just functions, and yeah they do stuff based on the :type key
11:51	SagiCZ1	luxbock: i really like how you simplified the problem.. i dont think you needed a protocol there necessarily... in my problem the creation of tree is just a necessary structure for the algo to work so i am reluctant to build a library around it
11:52	luxbock	SagiCZ1: yeah, I just used them because I was learning about them at the time, and in a way I'm glad I did because now I understand them better
11:52	luxbock	but I think this simpler approach is better in the end. It wasn't use the nodes that I rewrote. I had over-engineered a bunch of other stuff as well while learning about new things :)
11:54	SagiCZ1	luxbock: its really hard at first when you dont know what is available... to correctly design
11:54	luxbock	yeah indeed
11:58	luxbock	I'm just now racking my brain trying to figure out a function to translate the existing tree structures I have to expand them by inserting new branches in the middle of the tree
11:58	luxbock	zippers are fun
11:58	justin_smith	I've never found a good use for them. Maybe my brain is wired wrong for zipper usage.
11:58	SagiCZ1	i always feel like just thinking and almost never typing in clojure.. then i look at my work from the past 10 hours and its just couple lines of code.. i feel stupid
12:00	luxbock	I like to sketch by planning top-down
12:01	OscarZ-	theres "bean" function to turn java beans to maps, but is there something to do it the other way ? given a map and java class, it would return instance of the class filled with properties from the map ?
12:02	OscarZ-	oh.. just found this: https://github.com/clojure/java.data
12:03	OscarZ-	it was in the comments for "bean", didnt notice it first
12:16	OscarZ-	is it possible to require a namespace and with same command switch to that namespace?
12:21	ddima	you don't need to require, as by switching to a new ns all symbols will be resolved to that ns
12:21	SagiCZ1	ddima: and will the file get loaded
12:23	OscarZ-	im working in a repl and id like to load my namespace which itself does stuff like (:require [clojure.java.data :refer all])
12:24	ddima	SagiCZ1: that I'm not sure of, something which I'd need to try out
12:24	OscarZ-	i'd just want to be able to refer to functions from clojure.java.data in my repl without qualifying them
12:27	OscarZ-	hmm.. it works when i require my namespace (myrepl) and then do (ns myrepl)
12:30	ddima	yeah, it doesnt load it, just checked. I dont think there is something like this per default, just wrap it yourself a la (do (require foo) (in-ns foo))
12:30	ddima	(you can use in-ns if you dont need any of the ns-macro magic)
12:30	OscarZ-	ok, its not too much work :)
12:30	SagiCZ1	in my editor i always do load and then switch manually
12:30	ddima	you could of course override in-ns or something ;)
12:31	justin_smith	(doto 'foo require in-ns)
12:31	OscarZ-	i still dont fully understand how the namespaces work.. in my repl, im first at namespace user, in my file myrepl.clj im defining (ns myrepl)) and some functions
12:31	ddima	or the more concise version from justin ;)
12:32	OscarZ-	in one of the function in myrepl namespace i put (println ns), im surprised that it prints out "user" when i call it from user namespace
12:32	justin_smith	OscarZ-: ns is the namespace you are calling from, not the one where the thing was defined
12:32	OscarZ-	how come it finds the stuff from myrepl as im referring to them in my function?
12:33	justin_smith	that's compile time
12:33	OscarZ-	ok
12:33	justin_smith	at compile time, it is in that ns, and it sees all the mappings defined in that ns
12:33	justin_smith	at runtime, in the repl, when you call the compiled code, ns will refer to the namespace you are in when you call the function
12:34	OscarZ-	i see, ok
12:34	justin_smith	on the other hand, you can use ns in a macro, and cause it to be captured at compile time
12:34	justin_smith	if you really need such a thing
12:36	tomjack	is there a story you can tell where ns is just a normal dynamic var, which correctly explains the semantics of ns if not the facts?
12:37	gfredericks	um
12:37	justin_smith	tomjack: that's the story. It's a dynamic var. It's looked up at runtime, like any other uncaptured var.
12:37	gfredericks	well the story should probably talk about compile-time and runtime though
12:37	ddima	cool story :D
12:37	gfredericks	in chapter 2
12:38	tomjack	my vague memory is that both clj and cljs compilers have magic inside for ns
12:38	gfredericks	not to mention repls
12:38	gfredericks	well who else is going to set it?
12:38	justin_smith	tomjack: magic, beyond the fact that it is a dynamic var that is used by def/defn to decide where something gets interned?
12:39	tomjack	I don't remember what the magic was at all -- but if the magic doesn't change the story at all, then great :)
12:39	gfredericks	tomjack: I think the normal confusion point is that (let [n ns] (defn f [] n)) does something different from (defn f [] ns*)
12:40	gfredericks	even further confused by the fact that I think those are the same (at a glance) at any normal repl
12:40	justin_smith	gfredericks: which is why I was careful to say "like any other uncaptured var" :)
12:41	OscarZ-	if i have a namespace and define functions "foo" and "bar" with defn, and bar is calling foo, how is the foo reference realized in function bar? is foo compiled as the var that name "foo" pointed at compile-time ?
12:41	gfredericks	justin_smith: more confusing in this case though because most uses of ns are at compile-time
12:42	gfredericks	true of other compiler vars I guess, but ns is more tempting to use for other dynamic purposes
12:42	justin_smith	OscarZ-: yeah, everything is fully resolved at compile time
12:43	OscarZ-	ok.. and if i put (def foo something-else) in the end, it doesnt have any effect anymore on function bar as it was already compiled?
12:43	justin_smith	OscarZ-: that's where capture comes in - are you resolving the var, or have you stored the value it pointed to at a prior time
12:44	tomjack	I guess the only magic in clojure is resolving 'ns to the var set up in RT
12:44	justin_smith	by default, vars are looked up on each call
12:44	tomjack	and I see no trace of magic in cljs
12:44	justin_smith	but you can circumvent that with let capture
12:45	justin_smith	OscarZ-: this is an optimization trick actually - you can improve performance in a tight loop by capturing vars, so they don't get looked up repeatedly
12:46	OscarZ-	what you mean by "capture" exactly ?
12:46	justin_smith	OscarZ-: resolve it once, and store that value
12:46	justin_smith	like in gfredericks example above
12:47	justin_smith	(let [ns ns] (defn f [] ns))
12:47	justin_smith	that captures ns value at compile time
12:48	OscarZ-	ok
12:48	OscarZ-	so ns is a bit like function call
12:48	justin_smith	OscarZ-: usage of any var is a bit like a function call
12:48	justin_smith	ns is not special in its behavior (it just gets used in special ways)
12:49	Bronsa	18:47:25 <justin_smith> that captures ns value at compile time
12:49	OscarZ-	but if i have (defn foo [] (println ("ho ho ho!)) (defn bar [] foo)
12:49	Bronsa	at the risk of being overly pedantic, that's not true :P
12:49	justin_smith	Bronsa: oh, please explain
12:49	Bronsa	justin_smith: I mean, it's true if you meant "compile time" as in "while loading the namespace"
12:49	gfredericks	it compiles to code that looks it up in init?
12:49	OscarZ-	is that foo function forever locked to be the one that is called from bar ? even if i do (def foo [] (print "ha ha ha")) afterwards
12:50	justin_smith	OscarZ-: it's easy enough to test
12:50	OscarZ-	true :)
12:51	justin_smith	OscarZ-: https://www.refheap.com/95426
12:52	justin_smith	(I changed it slightly - in a way that makes it more clear I hope)
12:52	justin_smith	Bronsa: OK, yeah, I keep using that "compile time" term a little too loosely I think, thanks
12:53	OscarZ-	justin_smith, damn it did change :D i thought it wouldnt
12:53	justin_smith	OscarZ-: vars are mutable
12:53	justin_smith	and var lookup is not finalized at compilation
12:53	justin_smith	OscarZ-: thus what I said about capturing vars for performance reasons, etc. etc.
12:54	OscarZ-	oh.. i see..
12:54	justin_smith	OscarZ-: this is useful, because it means we can redefine our code in the repl or by reloading our namespaces and things stay consistent / updated
12:54	OscarZ-	so what gets compiled in, is just the name "foo"..
12:55	gfredericks	are there any examples of leiningen projects that are setup to run tests on different versions of java?
12:56	justin_smith	OscarZ-: well, not just the name "foo" but the fully resolved symbol iirc. or is it the var? Bronsa would know.
12:56	gfredericks	this feels awkward to me because I know how to set up the java-cmd in a leiningen profile, but the value thereof seems machine-sensitive, so putting in in the project seems bad
12:57	Bronsa	OscarZ-: justin_smith it resolves the var at compile time & stores that. at runtime it just derefs it
12:57	justin_smith	Bronsa: aha, so if someone cleared the var and recreated a var with the same name something might break?
12:58	justin_smith	ie. ns-unmap
12:58	OscarZ-	ah right.. the var stays but it can be mutated to point at some new function
12:58	gfredericks	justin_smith: probably depends on what they were assuming that would do
12:58	OscarZ-	you guys explained about vars earlier
12:59	mbac	yay holiday break
12:59	Bronsa	justin_smith: yep
12:59	Bronsa	justin_smith: http://sprunge.us/ATBb?clj
13:00	mbac	time to start and make impressive progress on personal coding projects then starve them from lack of love when the holidays are over and i'm back to working fulltime
13:00	mbac	the cycle never really ends : /
13:00	justin_smith	just tried it, updated my refheap... interesting https://www.refheap.com/95426
13:01	justin_smith	Bronsa: so here, it is still referring to the old, now unmapped, var
13:01	OscarZ-	justin_smith, does that mean that the actual var gets baked in?
13:02	justin_smith	OscarZ-: yeah, I think so. It resolves the var, but derefs the value on each call (since it could have changed)
13:02	OscarZ-	so there is no lookup ?
13:02	Bronsa	justin_smith: right, (def x y) when x is already defined just replaces the var root. if it's not mapped, you get a new var
13:02	OscarZ-	right ok :)
13:02	justin_smith	OscarZ-: no lookup, just deref
13:02	OscarZ-	i think i finally get it
13:03	OscarZ-	i also tried to redefine foo in user namespace, then call myrepl/bar, it doesnt change even though ns is user during the bar call
13:03	OscarZ-	as bar is referring to the var myrepl/foo
13:03	justin_smith	OscarZ-: right, because it already looked up the var
13:04	OscarZ-	yes, ok..
13:09	OscarZ-	what are the reasons for having keywords like :a :b, in some places you can use strings and keywords interchangeably, but i guess there are good reasons to have keywords as their own things?
13:09	SagiCZ1	keywords are faster
13:09	justin_smith	keywords do O(1) comparison, yeah
13:10	justin_smith	and they act as the "get" function when applied to a map or set
13:10	OscarZ-	are they turned into integers or something under the hood?
13:10	justin_smith	they are interned, so when you compare them you are effectively comparing two integers
13:10	OscarZ-	ok
13:11	justin_smith	all that said, people are often over-enthusiastic about replacing strings with keywords
13:12	justin_smith	if you take a json map from some API, transform it, then return json again, it's silly to turn the keys into keywords, that can only make things more complex
13:13	OscarZ-	what kind of trouble can you get into?
13:13	justin_smith	not trouble
13:13	justin_smith	it's just silly
13:13	OscarZ-	:)
13:13	bbloom	no, you can get in to lots of trouble
13:13	justin_smith	oh?
13:13	bbloom	for example, invalid keywords constructed at runtime
13:14	bbloom	eg keywords shouldn't start with digits, or contain spaces
13:14	bbloom	or contain a slash
13:14	justin_smith	aha, so if you tried to serialize to edn, you'd get a broken mess
13:14	bbloom	automatic keywordization is just a bad idea
13:15	bbloom	seriously, everybody stop doing it
13:15	tolstoy	What if you control both sides of the message?
13:15	bbloom	tolstoy: the day will come when you only have yourself to blame
13:15	justin_smith	tolstoy: then what do you gain by keywordizing?
13:15	tolstoy	Heh.
13:15	tolstoy	If only!
13:16	bbloom	for example, you want a map with URLs as keys
13:16	tolstoy	Makes the code more readable.
13:16	bbloom	{"http://omg.com" "127.0.0.1"}
13:16	bbloom	whoops: ##(keyword "http://omg.com")
13:16	lazybot	⇒ :http://omg.com
13:16	bbloom	that's no good.
13:17	Bronsa	,:http://omg.com
13:17	clojurebot	#<AccessControlException java.security.AccessControlException: access denied ("java.lang.RuntimePermission" "accessDeclaredMembers")>
13:17	tolstoy	That's why I mentioned controlling both sides, like from a one-page app to an underlying host service.
13:17	Bronsa	&:http://omg.com
13:17	lazybot	⇒ :http://omg.com
13:17	Bronsa	:P
13:17	bbloom	now you need to go retrofit all your old code that assumed global keywordization to be parameterized by a schema, so that you can prevent keywordization in one special case
13:17	bbloom	,(name :http://omg.com) ; Bronsa
13:17	clojurebot	#<AccessControlException java.security.AccessControlException: access denied ("java.lang.RuntimePermission" "accessDeclaredMembers")>
13:17	OscarZ-	I ran into EDN data format somewhere... what are the biggest benefits for using that instead of JSON ?
13:17	bbloom	&(name :http://omg.com) ; Bronsa
13:17	lazybot	⇒ "/omg.com"
13:17	Bronsa	bbloom: I know I know, I was just joking :)
13:17	bbloom	Bronsa: ok but for other ppl who don't know you know every single edge case ;-)
13:18	tolstoy	That said, I did have a nice hour wondering what the hell was going on before I discovered that ClojureScript allows keywords starting with numbers, and Clojure doesn't.
13:18	Bronsa	also hiredman should stop christmas partying and fix clojurebot
13:19	Bronsa	tolstoy: sadly, it actually does ##:9000
13:19	Bronsa	lazybot: ?
13:19	Bronsa	&:9000
13:19	lazybot	⇒ :9000
13:20	justin_smith	Bronsa: with ##(do :9000) notation, you need parens
13:20	lazybot	⇒ :9000
13:20	[blake\|	Why is that sad?
13:20	Bronsa	[blake\|: because it's allowed but the docs forbid it, and support is also inconsistent
13:20	Bronsa	&:a/9
13:20	lazybot	java.lang.RuntimeException: Invalid token: :a/9
13:20	Bronsa	&::9
13:20	lazybot	⇒ :clojure.core/9
13:21	Manaphy91	Anyone can explain me why I obtain an empty string with this http://pastebin.com/Jueh8Fcr code?
13:21	justin_smith	Manaphy91: for is lazy
13:21	justin_smith	put a (dorun) around it
13:21	tolstoy	I was using UUIDs as keys, which is where bbloom's prediction came true.
13:22	bbloom	tolstoy: that's another good one
13:22	Bronsa	what's wrong with using uuids as keys?
13:22	justin_smith	Bronsa: auto-keywordizing UUID
13:22	[blake\|	Bronsa: I was gonna say it's not an issue in Smalltalk, but then I checked and it's also inconsistent. =P
13:22	Bronsa	ah ok
13:23	justin_smith	which would lead to issues, I bet
13:23	tolstoy	I was using the string (not the #uuid thing). Some lead with zeros.
13:24	tolstoy	It would have been okay if that had broken everywhere (clj vs cljs) but it didn't, so, lots of argh. ;)
13:25	Manaphy91	@justin_smith with `dorun` is the same thing...
13:25	bbloom	clojurebot: keywordization \|is\| just say no
13:25	justin_smith	&(with-out-str (dorun (for [e [1 2 3]] (println e)))
13:25	lazybot	java.lang.RuntimeException: EOF while reading, starting at line 1
13:25	clojurebot	Ack. Ack.
13:25	justin_smith	&(with-out-str (dorun (for [e [1 2 3]] (println e))))
13:25	lazybot	java.lang.SecurityException: You tripped the alarm! push-thread-bindings is bad!
13:25	justin_smith	Manaphy91: it shouldn't be
13:25	justin_smith	(dorun (for ...))
13:25	justin_smith	the problem is that for does nothing if you don't force the value
13:25	justin_smith	even better, replace (for ...) with (doseq ...)
13:26	Manaphy91	@justin_smith perfect!! Thaks a lot!!
13:27	zilti	I'm working with a transient map, and it seems I can only conj! 8 MapEntry instances to it, afterwards it ignores them. How can I work around that?
13:28	justin_smith	zilti: you need to use the return value of conj!
13:28	justin_smith	it is not guaranteed to mutate the argument, it is merely allowed to
13:28	justin_smith	and with more than 8 mapentries, it replaces rather than mutating
13:28	zilti	hmm
13:29	justin_smith	(doc conj!)
13:29	clojurebot	#<AccessControlException java.security.AccessControlException: access denied ("java.lang.RuntimePermission" "accessDeclaredMembers")>
13:29	justin_smith	&(doc conj!)
13:29	lazybot	⇒ "([] [coll] [coll x]); Adds x to the transient collection, and return coll. The 'addition' may happen at different 'places' depending on the concrete type."
13:29	zilti	This is going to be somewhat of a headache inside a transducer... I found this out because I'm calling "step" multiple times
13:29	justin_smith	zilti: restructure your code to use the result of conj!, the same way you would if you were using conj in a loop
13:31	zilti	justin_smith: Well, this fixed it :) Thanks!
13:31	justin_smith	np
13:31	Bronsa	there's obviously no guarantee that the replacing will happen every 8 args
13:31	justin_smith	right, that was just a "for example" of course
13:31	zilti	It's nonetheless a weird behaviour, and I don't understand why it gets exposed to the "users"
13:31	Bronsa	it's usually after 32 IIRC
13:32	Bronsa	8 is just because of the arraymap -> hashmap promotion
13:32	justin_smith	zilti: it's the way conj! is meant to behave. The weird part is that ignoring the return value ever works.
13:32	Bronsa	zilti: transients are just a performance construct. it's well specified that you have to use the return value or bad things will happen
13:32	zilti	justin_smith: Yes, that's what I mean - that it actually works sometimes
13:33	justin_smith	Bronsa: I was surprised not to see a more explicit reference / warning in the doc string for conj! actually
13:33	zilti	Still, I currently have an atom to store the return value of conj! ... Meh. Really have to refactor this piece now
13:34	Bronsa	justin_smith: it would be better to have it in the docstring of `transient` i think. but yeah, agreed that having it only mentioned in clojure.org might cause confusion
13:35	justin_smith	maybe I'll make a doc string PR
13:37	Manaphy91	&(time (with-out-str (dorun (for [[k v] mark] (println k "->" v)))))
13:37	lazybot	java.lang.SecurityException: You tripped the alarm! push-thread-bindings is bad!
13:37	justin_smith	Manaphy91: that would have failed because mark is unbound, anyway
14:30	profil	I am writing a small validation function for form params from ring. But I find my function very ugly, how could I improve it? make it more idiomatic? https://www.refheap.com/95427
14:31	profil	I thought about using monads, but I dont want to pull in such a big dependency just for this small function
14:54	bzf	Any tips for reading 4 bytes from a FileInputStream as an integer?
15:05	justin_smith	bzf: you could read it into a byte-array, then make a ByteBuffer from that, and read an int from the ByteBuffer
15:08	bzf	justin_smith: Figured out I could just instatiate a DataInputStream from the FileInputStream :)
15:09	justin_smith	bzf: I am not as familiar with that (and am suspicious of the marshalling stuff), but that looks like it would work.
15:12	justin_smith	though DataInputStream is an interface
15:13	justin_smith	so that sounds a bit more complicated than a ByteBuffer / getInt
15:14	justin_smith	&java-version
15:14	lazybot	java.lang.RuntimeException: Unable to resolve symbol: java-version in this context
15:15	justin_smith	&(.getInt (java.nio.ByteBuffer/wrap (byte-array [1 2 3 4])))
15:15	lazybot	⇒ 16909060
15:15	justin_smith	^^ I think that's simpler than anything that would give you a DataInputStream would be
15:15	justin_smith	unless you have a class implementing it handy already
15:17	justin_smith	bzf: oh wait I was looking at the wrong "DataInputStream" - the one in java.io looks exactly right, yeah
15:18	justin_smith	bzf: but if you find yourself dealing with things like endianness, ByteBuffer makes that simple to fix
15:19	bzf	justin_smith: Alright, thanks :)
15:23	SagiCZ1	is vector a sequence?
15:23	justin_smith	,(sequential? [])
15:23	clojurebot	#<AccessControlException java.security.AccessControlException: access denied ("java.lang.RuntimePermission" "accessDeclaredMembers")>
15:23	justin_smith	&(sequential? [])
15:23	lazybot	⇒ true
15:24	SagiCZ1	shouldnt this return more than one node? whats wrong with it..
15:24	SagiCZ1	&(count (tree-seq :x :x [{:x [{:x {:potato 6}} {:x {:o 3}}]}]))
15:24	lazybot	⇒ 1
15:25	justin_smith	&(:x [])
15:25	lazybot	⇒ nil
15:25	justin_smith	that's why
15:25	justin_smith	maybe you want sequential? instead of one of those :x
15:25	justin_smith	&(doc tree-seq)
15:25	lazybot	⇒ "([branch? children root]); Returns a lazy sequence of the nodes in a tree, via a depth-first walk. branch? must be a fn of one arg that returns true if passed a node that can have children (but may not). children must be a fn of one arg that returns a sequence of th... https://www.refheap.com/95432
15:26	SagiCZ1	i dont understand that example you gave
15:26	SagiCZ1	where do i do that?
15:26	justin_smith	[] has no :x key
15:26	SagiCZ1	there is no empty vector
15:27	justin_smith	[{:x ...}] has no :x key
15:27	justin_smith	the emptiness isn't importatn, the vectorness is
15:27	SagiCZ1	&(count (tree-seq :x :x {:x [{:x {:potato 6}} {:x {:o 3}}]}))
15:27	lazybot	⇒ 5
15:27	SagiCZ1	i think this is what i want
15:27	justin_smith	that does look more like what you would want, yes
15:28	SagiCZ1	thanks :)
15:28	justin_smith	np
15:33	SagiCZ1	so i have this tree.. i want to find a particular node and add children to it.. how can i do that?
15:33	SagiCZ1	in imperative code i would have a function that returns a reference to the node, and mutate it, which would update it in the tree as well
15:33	SagiCZ1	in simple map, i would use assoc
15:33	justin_smith	assoc-in
15:33	justin_smith	or update-in
15:33	SagiCZ1	i would need to know the full path to the node though
15:34	justin_smith	,(assoc-in {} [:a :b :c] 42)
15:34	clojurebot	#<AccessControlException java.security.AccessControlException: access denied ("java.lang.RuntimePermission" "accessDeclaredMembers")>
15:34	justin_smith	&(assoc-in {} [:a :b :c] 42)
15:34	lazybot	⇒ {:a {:b {:c 42}}}
15:34	justin_smith	indeed, you would need to know that
15:34	SagiCZ1	hmm tree-seq doesnt give me the path..
15:34	justin_smith	in order to mutate the node, you would also need to find that path, though you may not have stored it in a single place
15:35	justin_smith	yeah, tree-seq isn't so good for making a new tree
15:35	justin_smith	perhaps you want clojure.walk/postwalk
15:35	SagiCZ1	i could add a uuid to each node and find it later by that.. thats seems like an overkill though
15:35	SagiCZ1	or maybe tree of atoms?
15:36	justin_smith	if you want to walk a tree, and update certain branches, use clojure.walk/post-walk
15:36	SagiCZ1	ok
15:36	SagiCZ1	i will have a look at that
15:42	munderwo	Hey all. So I have this data structure https://www.refheap.com/95433 … and I want to collapse it so its one map with each value being the combined list of values. How would one go about doing that? is there a higher order function that does this? Im using a for loop to generate it, which might be the wrong way to go about it….
15:45	justin_smith	munderwo: I hope you realize you have a bunch of illegal keywords in there
15:45	munderwo	oh? what makes a keyword illegal?
15:46	justin_smith	multiple / for example in this case
15:47	SagiCZ1	or starting with a number
15:47	munderwo	I’d guessed that the multiple / might do it. but starting with a number?
15:48	justin_smith	munderwo: anyway (apply merge-with into ...)
15:48	justin_smith	that will merge all the maps, using into to combine the vectors
15:49	tomjack	neither of those uses look suited to keywords
15:49	justin_smith	though you may also want to do some merging inside those vectors?
15:49	justin_smith	no, actually not, the merge-with into suffices for that data at least
15:49	SagiCZ1	i dont see how clojure.walk helps me.. it doesnt even let me specify how to walk the datastructure like tree-seq
15:50	justin_smith	SagiCZ1: it already knows how to walk all the clojure data structures
15:50	justin_smith	and you can conditionally output an altered child at each branch
15:50	munderwo	magic! thanks justin_smith !
15:50	SagiCZ1	i have a tree where each node is map with :name and :children .. it doesnt walk it right
15:51	justin_smith	what does "doesn't walk it right" mean? it should hit every single nested value in the tree, the trick is only acting on the apropriate branches (and returning the original otherwise)
15:52	justin_smith	&(require '[clojure.walk :as walk])
15:52	lazybot	⇒ nil
15:52	Raynes	Everybody ends up with a tree where each node is a map of :name and :children.
15:52	Raynes	Eventually.
15:52	SagiCZ1	&(walk/walk #(println %) identity {:x [{:x [1 2]} 3]})
15:52	lazybot	⇒ [:x [{:x [1 2]} 3]] {}
15:52	dysfun	is there a reasonable library for generating DDL?
15:52	Raynes	I use our DBA for that
15:53	dysfun	ah, well my dba is too lazy
15:53	SagiCZ1	i feel like my problem really cant be solved in a functional language.. so weird
15:53	dysfun	i only need postgres support, but since this is open source i'd like to support other engines too
15:53	justin_smith	&(walk/post-walk (fn [x] (if (contains? x :children) (assoc % :naughty true) x)) {:children {:a 0} :naughty false})
15:53	lazybot	java.lang.RuntimeException: No such var: walk/post-walk
15:54	justin_smith	&(walk/postwalk (fn [x] (if (contains? x :children) (assoc % :naughty true) x)) {:children {:a 0} :naughty false})
15:54	lazybot	java.lang.RuntimeException: Unable to resolve symbol: % in this context
15:55	justin_smith	&(walk/postwalk (fn [x] (if (and (map? x) (contains? x :children)) (assoc x :naughty true) x)) {:children {:a 0 :b {:children nil}} :naughty false})
15:55	lazybot	⇒ {:children {:b {:naughty true, :children nil}, :a 0}, :naughty true}
15:56	justin_smith	^^ SagiCZ1 that's how to do it
15:56	SagiCZ1	let me process that with my slow brain
15:56	justin_smith	SagiCZ1: you could run it in your own repl, adding a (println x) if that helps
15:57	justin_smith	x will end up being every possible branch of the nested data structure, and your function decides what is returned in its place
15:57	SagiCZ1	i see that you are associng based on whether its a map and has children.. but what if i want to access only on a node that has some minimal value out of all the leave nodes.. i would have to walk with some state there
15:58	SagiCZ1	*assoc , leaf
15:59	justin_smith	in that case you could use tree-seq to find the minimal values, and post-walk to act on said minimal values in context
15:59	SagiCZ1	so how would i find the minimal value with the postwalk?
15:59	SagiCZ1	treeseq tells me its 7 so i go look for 7?
16:00	justin_smith	you test whether it is a leaf, and if so whether it is in your set of minimal values, yes
16:00	justin_smith	you use the tree-seq to generate the set of minimal values
16:00	SagiCZ1	okay
16:01	SagiCZ1	and why the post walk goes twice into some nodes? like this:
16:01	SagiCZ1	[:children nil]
16:01	SagiCZ1	{:children nil}
16:01	justin_smith	the first is an entry
16:01	justin_smith	the second is the entire map
16:02	justin_smith	if you had {:a 0 :b 1} you would see [:a 0] [:b 1] {:a 0 :b 1}
16:02	SagiCZ1	oh i see.. its because its post.... walk
16:02	SagiCZ1	so first it travels deep.. and then it backs up
16:02	justin_smith	right, there is also prewalk
16:02	justin_smith	but in practice postwalk is often what you want
16:02	SagiCZ1	we learned this at the university, but it confuses me now
16:03	justin_smith	also, your walk/walk example (which does both pre and post walk) replaces the whole data structure with nil
16:03	justin_smith	as a result of the println :)
16:03	SagiCZ1	ok i dont think i need both post and pre
16:04	justin_smith	SagiCZ1: well, the point of walk is it takes two functions, the first is applied in pre, the second in post
16:04	justin_smith	so your datastructure is replaced by the return value of println
16:04	justin_smith	which is nil
16:04	SagiCZ1	so it changes the tree as it walks through it?
16:04	justin_smith	and this happens before the rest of it can be processed
16:05	justin_smith	that's the point of these walk functions, yes :)
16:05	justin_smith	well, it makes a modified copy
16:05	justin_smith	that's what you wanted, right?
16:05	SagiCZ1	yes
16:05	SagiCZ1	it feels like killing a butterfly with a tank, but yes, this i can use
16:05	nuwanda_	couldn't you use pre to compute the minimal values and post to act on them?
16:05	SagiCZ1	seems very powerful
16:05	justin_smith	nuwanda_: that's an excellent point
16:06	SagiCZ1	but i would have to accumulate the minimal value somewhere
16:06	justin_smith	nuwanda_: thought of course you would likely need a mutable accumulator to store it (tree-seq avoids the mutation aspect)
16:06	nuwanda_	in the tree itself maybe, then remove them in post
16:07	justin_smith	nuwanda_: I think updating an atom would be simpler, but also I think finding your min keys via tree-seq is simplest
16:07	justin_smith	though it means two steps instead of one
16:07	SagiCZ1	i dont know.. finding the min keys before feels dirty for some reason
16:08	SagiCZ1	because then they become a node identifier
16:08	SagiCZ1	which in imperative language would be just a simple pointer to the particular node
16:08	SagiCZ1	what if there are too nodes with the same minimal value.. i need to split only one of them
16:08	SagiCZ1	*two
16:08	justin_smith	you could use a mutable deftype and mutate pointers if you really want that kind of thing
16:10	SagiCZ1	justin_smith: that wouldnt feel clojury
16:11	hellofunk	i should probably study the various tree APIs before i ask this, but is it possible for each child to get a sequence of all its parents back to root?
16:13	justin_smith	hellofunk: you would need some stateful accumulator closed over by the function arg (likely something shard by the two function args to walk/walk, the pre would append to it, the post would pop elements from the end)
16:13	justin_smith	*shared
16:13	hellofunk	i feel you
16:14	hellofunk	i guess it's not a common need
16:23	craigglennie	I have an existing list of values that I want to add to a channel one at a time - what’s the best way to do this? Recursion? Seems like it would be common enough for there to be a shortcut
16:23	craigglennie	or maybe with “map” ?
16:27	SagiCZ1	i would use doseq
16:27	SagiCZ1	(doseq [e list-of-e] (put-to-channel chan e))
16:29	craigglennie	SagiCZ1: Cool, thanks. The docs for doseq says “Repeatedly executes body (presumably for side-effects)” - is putting a value in a channel considered a side effect?
16:29	SagiCZ1	it is
16:30	SagiCZ1	is it core.async channel?
16:33	craigglennie	SagiCZ1: yes, core.async
16:34	SagiCZ1	yes i think that would be a side effect.. putting something without sideeffect into doseq makes no sense, since it doesnt collect any results
16:34	SagiCZ1	&(doseq [e (range 10)] (+ e 2)])
16:34	lazybot	java.lang.RuntimeException: Unmatched delimiter: ]
16:35	SagiCZ1	&(doseq [e (range 10)] (+ e 2))
16:35	lazybot	⇒ nil
16:35	hellofunk	craigglennie: you could use map as you suggested but since you are not concerned with the results of the process, then no point constructing a sequence with map
16:35	SagiCZ1	note that if you use map, it creates lazy sequence that does not get realized unless you take some elements or call (dorun .. )
16:35	hellofunk	that is true
16:36	craigglennie	ok, doseq makes more than map then
16:36	SagiCZ1	it fits better to your use
16:36	craigglennie	both because I don’t care about the result, and because map is lazy
16:39	SagiCZ1	if i am not mistaken (dorun (map .... )) does the same as (doseq ... ) only with different syntax
16:41	hellofunk	of course that only applies if you are working with a single sequence. they become more different as soon as you add a second set of bindings to doseq or more than 2 args to map
16:42	justin_smith	doseq and (dorun (for ...)) on the other hand...
16:51	hex6	No method in multimethod 'process-input' for dispatch value: null, Does it have to have some default dispatch?
17:00	justin_smith	hex6: where is process-input defined?
17:01	justin_smith	you can do (defmethod :process-input :default ...)
17:01	justin_smith	err make that (defmethod process-input :default ...)
17:05	hex6	justin_smith: found my problem, I had failed to supply one of the arguments in the correct form, so it was as it said; it tried to dispatch null
17:05	hex6	thanks though
17:05	justin_smith	oh, I had thought based on your question that you wanted dispatching on null to work
17:06	justin_smith	and adding :default would do that
17:08	hex6	yeah, I should probably add that though
17:09	craigglennie	core.async channels are unordered? I can’t find any docs that say one way or the other
17:11	SagiCZ1	craigglennie: do you mean the order in which they process input/output?
17:11	SagiCZ1	i would think it should be FIFO
17:11	craigglennie	SagiCZ1: I would have thought FIFO too, but it doesn’t seem to be
17:17	SagiCZ1	craigglennie: try some more tests.. if you have one consumer and one producer, the order should be kept
17:17	SagiCZ1	(imho)
17:21	craigglennie	SagiCZ1: This is what I did in the REPL, it pretty reliably returns out-of-order: https://www.refheap.com/95436
17:21	justin_smith	craigglennie: the default channel is effectively fifo, but has no buffer - which means that it will block if it is unread, but the order that waiting puts go onto it would be indeterminate
17:21	justin_smith	it only holds one value at a time
17:21	justin_smith	oh, and your (go) blocks run in indeterminate order
17:22	justin_smith	they all return immediately to the doseq
17:22	justin_smith	and the order that they run is unspecified
17:24	justin_smith	if you did (def c (chan 10)) and (go (doseq [i [1 2 3 4 5 6]] (>! c i))) you would get the results back in order
17:24	justin_smith	but as it is, you have two factors (no buffering, go blocks not running in order) that scramble order
17:25	tomjack	no need for buffering?
17:26	justin_smith	tomjack: the default chan is not buffered, it blocks until read, and can only hold one value at a time
17:26	tomjack	yes, but the producer won't proceed until each value goes in (and comes out)
17:27	justin_smith	tomjack: but the producers are launched in parallel in a loop, and the order that each of them gets its go isn't deterministic
17:27	tomjack	oh, yes, I mean in your example with doseq inside go
17:27	tomjack	it can just be (def c (chan))
17:28	justin_smith	right, either of my changes would likely suffice on its own
17:28	justin_smith	(if ordering was desired)
17:29	tomjack	craigglennie: also, see onto-chan
17:29	craigglennie	tomjack: Oh, thanks, that looks useful
17:29	tomjack	and I guess into as well: (<!! (a/into [] (doto (chan) (a/onto-chan [1 2 3 4 5 6]))))
17:35	bzf	If I do (bit-clear 6516 64), just to see if I'm too tired to be continuing, the number can't be greater than 64?
17:36	SagiCZ1	how would i take-while one more?
17:36	SagiCZ1	(take-while odd? [3 3 3 9 7 8 4 6 3]) ---> (3 3 3 9 7 8)
17:37	bzf	SagiCZ1: Doesn't happen to me :)
17:37	hellofunk	SagiCZ1: well i suppose you could inc the count of the take-while and then take that from the original
17:38	justin_smith	bzf: ##(= (bit-clear Long/MAX_VALUE 65) Long/MAX_VALUE)
17:38	lazybot	⇒ false
17:38	justin_smith	oh, wait...
17:39	hellofunk	&(take (inc (count (take-while odd? [3 3 3 9 7 8 4]))) [3 3 3 9 7 8 4])
17:39	lazybot	⇒ (3 3 3 9 7 8)
17:39	justin_smith	(= (bit-clear Long/MAX_VALUE 65) (bit-clear Long/MAX_VALUE 1))
17:39	justin_smith	&(= (bit-clear Long/MAX_VALUE 65) (bit-clear Long/MAX_VALUE 1))
17:39	lazybot	⇒ true
17:39	justin_smith	bzf: ^^ it wraps after 64
17:40	justin_smith	bzf: likely the jvm impl only looks at the lowest 6 bits of the arg
17:41	bzf	justin_smith: Oh, so it doesn't compare against the full integer?
17:41	justin_smith	no integers are involved there
17:41	justin_smith	it's two longs
17:41	bzf	%s/integer/number/ :)
17:41	justin_smith	but it only uses the lowest 6 bits of the second long (or so it seems)
17:46	bzf	Shouldn't (bit-and x (bit-not y)) be the same as (bit-clear x y)?
17:49	[blake\|	Not directly Clojure related (except I'm doing it in a Clojure program) but I want to save part of a web page for reviewing either. Thought about HTML, but there's no formatting info. Thought about a JPG but that seems excessive. Any ideas?
17:49	[blake\|	For reviewing later. Not either.
17:52	craigglennie	[blake\|: What kind of review do you want to do?
17:52	craigglennie	[blake\|: If you’re extracting content you should probably save the HTML, if you just want to visually inspect it then capturing a JPG seems like a good approach
17:53	[blake\|	It's a single page form, users put in inputs on left, output show up on right. Just want to look at (and maybe print) the form.
17:53	[blake\|	craigglennie: Yeah...It rankles but it might be the simplest and not too piggy.
17:54	craigglennie	[blake\|: Since you’re using clojure, taxi has a get-screenshot function
17:54	SagiCZ1	how could i rewrite this using clojure's looping constructs? https://www.refheap.com/95438
17:54	Raynes	For the 5 people on the planet using laser, notice of deprecation: https://github.com/Raynes/laser#deprecated-laser
17:56	[blake\|	craigglennie: Interesting. Thanks!
17:56	[blake\|	(inc craigglennie)
17:56	lazybot	⇒ 1
17:57	[blake\|	Not sure how this works with a client browser, tho'.
17:58	hellofunk	SagiCZ1: you are just generating a seq of :a's is that right?
17:59	SagiCZ1	hellofunk: no dont simplify it that much
17:59	SagiCZ1	lets say i am updating acc in some way
17:59	SagiCZ1	not necesarily conj
17:59	hellofunk	well, in any case, reduce is probably your friend in most cases where an accumulator is produced from a sequence
18:00	SagiCZ1	maybe reduce, but i need to stop after n iterations
18:00	hellofunk	i guess you'd need to provide a more meaningful example of what you want to achieve because yours is as simple as (repeat 5 :a)
18:01	hellofunk	with reduce, if you only want to deal with n iterations, then just take n from your initial coll
18:02	SagiCZ1	this should work https://www.refheap.com/95439
18:04	hellofunk	SagiCZ1: take a look at iterate
18:04	craigglennie	So I tried to add too much (I guess) stuff to my channel, and got an assertion error: “No more than 1024 pending puts are allowed on a single channel. Consider using a windowed buffer.”
18:04	hellofunk	&(doc iterate)
18:04	lazybot	⇒ "([f x]); Returns a lazy sequence of x, (f x), (f (f x)) etc. f must be free of side-effects"
18:04	craigglennie	Is that referring to sliding-buffer? I don’t want to lose any of my items
18:04	craigglennie	Or should I just create a channel with a huge buffer? That feels like a bit of a hack
18:05	hellofunk	craigglennie: yes. you can use either depending on how important it is that all items on teh channel are eventually processed.
18:05	hellofunk	craigglennie: it's not a hack, that's how it works. up to you to decide what is more important.
18:06	craigglennie	hellofunk: How would you handle the case of an infinite / unknown number of items that need to be processed, and the requirement that none be dropped?
18:07	craigglennie	Can I have a buffered channel that, when empty, would call a function to get some more data?
18:07	hellofunk	craigglennie: well if your items continue to come in, you just need to make sure the buffer is large enough to hold as many as you think you will have before your taking logic does its deed. you can have 1 million items on the channel but have a buffer of 10K if your taking is fast enough to ensure you'll never get more than 10K piled up
18:08	craigglennie	hellofunk: Pity, I was hoping I wouldn’t have to think about that kind of thing
18:08	craigglennie	hellofunk: I’d like something like a generator in Python. It could keep track of the number of items in the channel and add more when it was empty or running low
18:09	craigglennie	It seems like lazy-seq maybe would do that?
18:09	hellofunk	craigglennie: a channel and a sequence are two very different things.
18:11	craigglennie	I guess I can just create a channel with a huge buffer. I do have some idea of how much could be in the channel
18:12	hellofunk	craigglennie: don't know your specifics but you could throttle your put!s or combined values into a single put! instead of many put!s if that applies to you.
18:16	craigglennie	hellofunk: Yes, that could work
18:17	craigglennie	I’m not sure core.async is the right framework for what I’m trying to do: I want to have a queue/channel of URLs, and a fixed number of consumers that process the URL (scraping using taxi, in this case)
18:18	SagiCZ1	i dont see why you couldnt use core.async
18:18	craigglennie	In Python I’d use a queue and a number of threads or processors reading from the queue
18:18	craigglennie	SagiCZ1: Is it the best choice, or just a choice?
18:19	craigglennie	It seems like it should work...
18:19	SagiCZ1	you could use something like pmap maybe.. or maually manage the futures.. but this should work and look nicer
18:19	craigglennie	s/processors/processes
18:19	justin_smith	craigglennie: there's no reason you can't use a queue and threads reading from the queue in Clojure, but people like core.async as an abstraction over queue usage
18:20	justin_smith	SagiCZ1: with a scraper, each scraped page is going to result in more links to follow, so pmap wouldn't suffice
18:20	craigglennie	justin_smith: Ok, that was my understanding, too. I’m familiar with threads and queues, but I’m trying to learn clojure, so I should probably use core.async
18:21	SagiCZ1	justin_smith: i see.. scratch that then
18:21	SagiCZ1	craigglennie: if you don't have any experience with clojure, maybe this is a little too hard to start with..
18:22	SagiCZ1	i am learning clojure for months, and core.async didnt see easy to me when i tried to use it couple days ago
18:22	justin_smith	craigglennie: core.async is just one way to use queues in Clojure, there is also clojure.lang.PersistentQueue and the various queues offered by java.util.concurrent
18:22	TEttinger	4clojure to the rescue!
18:22	SagiCZ1	TEttinger: are there any core.async exercises?
18:22	TEttinger	I don't think so, but if you're just starting out, it's probably a good place to start
18:24	SagiCZ1	i second that
18:25	ben_vulpes	i'm having a bit of a wacky problem with cider/emacs. when i run my irclj-bot at a terminal repl, when it catches messages it prints them right to the console. what in cider would be trapping these messages?
18:26	justin_smith	ben_vulpes: out is a dynamic binding that is not always propagated to new threads
18:26	justin_smith	ben_vulpes: look for a buffer with a name like nrepl server
18:27	justin_smith	that will be the failover when the output to the cider buffer is not propagated
18:27	ben_vulpes	config.el shows special buffers hidden...fixing...
18:29	ben_vulpes	awesome, justin_smith. what do I want to bind out to, and what's the best way to get that wired in regularly?
18:29	justin_smith	ben_vulpes: create threads using future and it is handled automatically
18:29	justin_smith	or you can pass in out to the function the thread runs, and bind it dynamically there
18:29	justin_smith	(binding [out captured-out-value] ...)
18:31	justin_smith	OOPS I parted by mistake
18:31	Bronsa	justin_smith: we all laughed at you while you weren't looking
18:31	justin_smith	porkys is spamming
18:32	justin_smith	(I was trying to part from the pm channel and parted here instead, mid conversation)
18:34	ben_vulpes	justin_smith: i think that i'm still confused as to why the out binding would be passed correctly when using the irclj library from my terminal, but not getting passed correctly when invoked from cider.
18:34	justin_smith	ben_vulpes: it's not passed properly, so it gets the root binding, which is your terminal
18:35	Dynasty	does clojure allow variable shadowing?
18:35	justin_smith	in emacs, it's not passed properly, so it gets the root binding, which is that weird nrepl server buffer that most people don't even know exist
18:35	ben_vulpes	hm, so this https://github.com/Raynes/irclj/blob/master/src/irclj/core.clj#L143 thread call might be the culprit then?
18:35	justin_smith	ben_vulpes: basically, shitty design in cider
18:35	ben_vulpes	boo.
18:36	justin_smith	ben_vulpes: I bet if you replaced that thread call with a call to future, that would propagate out properly
18:36	justin_smith	or you could store a binding to the out stream in the cider repl, and use it explicitly when printing
18:37	justin_smith	Dynasty: vars cannot be shadowed, but bindings can (via function arguments, or let)
18:37	Dynasty	okay thanks
18:37	justin_smith	and vars can be defined to have thread-local bindings (leading to odd behavior like I am discussing with ben_vulpes here)
18:37	ben_vulpes	downright kooky.
18:38	ben_vulpes	justin_smith: now for the million dollar question - what is the right value for out?
18:38	ben_vulpes	on a fresh cider repl i get #<PrintWriter java.io.PrintWriter@47ee14d4>
18:39	justin_smith	ben_vulpes: the value it has when you are in the repl buffer, obviously
18:39	ben_vulpes	because that's what's not getting passed into the thread
18:39	justin_smith	so you need to capture it, and bind it somewhere that your thread can find it when printing
18:39	justin_smith	right
18:40	ben_vulpes	well that's bloody irksome.
18:40	justin_smith	if cider attached the process to the repl buffer, out would fall back to that buffer, and things would be much more sensible
18:40	justin_smith	but they attach the process to a weird hidden buffer that they don't expect anyone to ever look at, which is weird
18:43	ben_vulpes	man i am now strongly tempted to just watch the repl-server buffer instead of getting printing properly in my emacs buffer
18:43	ben_vulpes	:(
19:12	supersym	https://wiki.theory.org/YourLanguageSucks#Clojure_sucks_because
19:12	supersym	aw.. only 1 reason with clojure, lol
19:12	supersym	dumb one too "Lisp syntax provides no way of seeing what's a function etc. - No visual distinction"
19:13	justin_smith	man, I could come up with 20 good reasons clojure sucks, and that wouldn't even make the fucking list
19:13	justin_smith	and I am a huge fan of clojure
19:14	supersym	right ^^
19:15	TEttinger	,(str (map inc [1 2 3]))
19:15	clojurebot	#<AccessControlException java.security.AccessControlException: access denied ("java.lang.RuntimePermission" "accessDeclaredMembers")>
19:15	TEttinger	lol
19:16	justin_smith	TEttinger: great example of something that sucks though ##(str (map inc [1 2 3]))
19:16	lazybot	⇒ "clojure.lang.LazySeq@7c42"
19:16	TEttinger	that should not be an accesscontrolexception, hiredman!
19:16	TEttinger	I just fixed a bug related to that
19:17	TEttinger	...while furthur codegolfing my cthulhutext generator
19:17	TEttinger	,(let[a #(apply str(flatten %))r repeatedly p partition N rand-nth n #(a(N(concat(repeat %"")(mapcat p[1 2 3]%&))))v #(n 0"aioeu""iaai")w(fn[](let[b(n 6"!.""""...")s[(n 0"STKNYPKLG""GlThShNyFt""ZvrCth")(r(N[1 2])#(do[(v)(n 9(map str"'-"(r 2 v)))(n 0(concat"lpstnkgx"[(N["h""gl""gr""nd"])(v)])"rlthggghtsltrkkhshng")]))]][b(if(seq b)[" "s][(n 3",")" "(.(a s)toLowerCase)])]))](re-find #"[A-Z].+"(a[(r 500 w)"."])))
19:17	clojurebot	#<AccessControlException java.security.AccessControlException: access denied ("java.lang.RuntimePermission" "accessDeclaredMembers")>
19:17	TEttinger	&(let[a #(apply str(flatten %))r repeatedly p partition N rand-nth n #(a(N(concat(repeat %"")(mapcat p[1 2 3]%&))))v #(n 0"aioeu""iaai")w(fn[](let[b(n 6"!.""""...")s[(n 0"STKNYPKLG""GlThShNyFt""ZvrCth")(r(N[1 2])#(do[(v)(n 9(map str"'-"(r 2 v)))(n 0(concat"lpstnkgx"[(N["h""gl""gr""nd"])(v)])"rlthggghtsltrkkhshng")]))]][b(if(seq b)[" "s][(n 3",")" "(.(a s)toLowerCase)])]))](re-find #"[A-Z].+"(a[(r 500 w)"."])))
19:17	lazybot	⇒ "Shiap. Thainosh thiash nex fte-ugg... Glutialt, glothets, situg. Lugr nyuggang! Nyikith satsegg yaix zvraltol shets... Cthaikh, pol... Nokh tes paits sigith shughe'elt ke'iax! Saishats, thelt... Ketogl yaingaish... Yiaghig sorkiat nyorlu-ugl puk kiarlot shatsi-ugh! ... https://www.refheap.com/95445
19:17	TEttinger	ah, error somewhere in there
19:18	justin_smith	? looked OK to me
19:19	TEttinger	there's just a logic bug, it allowed gr as an ending consonant
19:19	justin_smith	"Sax!" - scariest otherworldly creature ever
19:19	TEttinger	&(let[a #(apply str(flatten %))r repeatedly p partition N rand-nth n #(a(N(concat(repeat %"")(mapcat p[1 2 3]%&))))v #(n 0"aioeu""iaai")w(fn[](let[b(n 7"!.""""...")s[(n 0"STKNYPKLG""GlThShNyFt""ZvrCth")(r(N[1 2])#(do[(v)(n 9(map str"'-"(r 2 v)))(n 0(concat"lpstnkgx"[[(N["h""gl""gr""nd"])(v)]])"rlthggghtsltrkkhshng")]))]][b(if(seq b)[" "s][(n 3",")" "(.(a s)toLowerCase)])]))](re-find #"[A-Z].+"(a[(r 500 w)"."])))
19:19	lazybot	⇒ "Yai-ongush, cthaiglaeg, les liag shuts. Piarl! Le'ugh ge'iashiark giatuth piggia-aig, yosiakh. Zvro-aighaho nyath ka-irl, kogh gaigg cthep ftail zvret... Thai'erkikh... Ta'il cthag, kaik. Yep, tox paggogg tanerl... Pagh, ftotsaha, kerk! Shukh gul gai-aino-is, kiathi... https://www.refheap.com/95447
19:20	TEttinger	well, I'm pretty pleased, it packs more features in shorter code now
19:20	[blake\|	Can anyone explain why Hastur just showed up in my cubicle?
19:21	Mikke	bryanzera: i mean, move the <script> reference to angular.js
19:21	TEttinger	rich is trying to figure out state and identity so he swapped his brain through time with a Yith
19:21	justin_smith	[blake\|: serves you right for making siri read IRC out loud to you
19:22	[blake\|	justin_smith: There are drawbacks. (Related: Anyone know where I can get a very, very tiny pair of gloves and hat?)
19:24	Mikke	vonnegut, http://plnkr.co/edit/Q6lBcquZc2329FjTFHEI?p=preview <-- seems to work okay can you show what's different in yours?
19:25	justin_smith	Mikke: maybe you meant that for a different channel?
19:26	Mikke	joules: what's your point?
19:27	justin_smith	Mikke: joules, vonnegut, and bryanzera are not in this channel, this is #clojure
19:29	Mikke	(RaeCarruth) OnlyOne: can I have some nudes with my pringles? * SammoSideKick sword in the hand.
19:31	Mikke	ride*
19:31	Mikke	aw thx RaeCarruth
19:34	Mikke	We started a massive fight in gawminers
19:37	Mikke	ahahah
19:50	windobu	technomancy?
19:50	clojurebot	technomancy is <jweiss> oh man this sucks, why didn't anyone warn me about protocols
19:50	windobu	oh
19:55	windobu	welcomne.
20:02	justin_smith	windobu: hello
20:03	justin_smith	are you looking for technomancy? I think he moved recently and may be less active in IRC for a bit
20:18	tom39291	(-> "foo" (fn [x] x)) fails, but I expect it to return "foo"
20:19	justin_smith	tom39291: ##(macroexpand '(-> "foo" (fn [x] x)))
20:19	lazybot	java.lang.IllegalArgumentException: Parameter declaration foo should be a vector
20:19	justin_smith	tom39291: anyway, it becomes (fn "foo" [x] x)
20:19	justin_smith	which causes the above error
20:19	justin_smith	tom39291: ##(macroexpand-1 '(-> "foo" (fn [x] x)))
20:19	lazybot	⇒ (fn "foo" [x] x)
20:19	justin_smith	there we go, nice
20:20	justin_smith	tom39291: ##(macroexpand-1 '(-> "foo" ((fn [x] x))))
20:20	lazybot	⇒ ((fn [x] x) "foo")
20:21	justin_smith	tom39291: ##(-> "foo" ((fn [x] x)))
20:21	lazybot	⇒ "foo"
20:21	tom39291	justin_smith: Thanks. Will have a think why that is correct.
20:22	justin_smith	tom39291: this may be another hint: ##((-> [x] (fn x) "foo")
20:22	justin_smith	did I nest my parens bad? I think I did
20:22	justin_smith	&((-> [x] (fn x)) "foo")
20:22	lazybot	⇒ "foo"
20:23	justin_smith	fn isn'
20:23	justin_smith	t "special", it's first arg is a vector
20:23	TEttinger	or a symbol
20:23	justin_smith	true
20:26	justin_smith	anyway, never use code like (-> [x] (fn x)) that's terrible and evil and only serves to demonstrate what -> does
20:42	ambrosebs	,(-> -> ())
20:42	clojurebot	#<AccessControlException java.security.AccessControlException: access denied ("java.lang.RuntimePermission" "accessDeclaredMembers")>
20:42	justin_smith	ambrosebs: clojurebot is acting up ##(-> -> ())
20:42	ambrosebs	&(-> ->)
20:42	lazybot	java.lang.IllegalArgumentException: Can't call nil
20:42	lazybot	java.lang.RuntimeException: Can't take value of a macro: #'clojure.core/->
20:43	ambrosebs	##(-> -> ((fn [->] 1)))
20:43	lazybot	java.lang.RuntimeException: Can't take value of a macro: #'clojure.core/->
20:43	ambrosebs	well that was fun
20:44	ambrosebs	porkys just spammed me
20:44	justin_smith	yeah, he got me too, the mods have forsaken us for the holidays
20:46	ambrosebs	cool
20:46	ambrosebs	##(-> ((fn [->])) ->)
20:46	lazybot	clojure.lang.ArityException: Wrong number of args (0) passed to: sandbox11388/eval17526/fn--17527
20:47	justin_smith	oh, wow
20:47	justin_smith	that's getting close to something truly terrible
20:47	ambrosebs	##((-> (fn [->]) ->))
20:47	lazybot	clojure.lang.ArityException: Wrong number of args (0) passed to: sandbox11388/eval17537/fn--17538
20:47	ambrosebs	##((->> (fn [->]) ->))
20:47	lazybot	clojure.lang.ArityException: Wrong number of args (0) passed to: sandbox11388/eval17548/fn--17549
20:48	ambrosebs	##((->> -> (fn [->]) ))
20:48	lazybot	clojure.lang.ArityException: Wrong number of args (0) passed to: sandbox11388/eval17559/fn--17560
20:48	ambrosebs	:)
20:50	ambrosebs	##(->> ->> (fn [->>] ->>))
20:50	lazybot	⇒ #<sandbox11388$eval17570$fn__17571 sandbox11388$eval17570$fn__17571@6d102211>
20:50	ambrosebs	##(->> (->> ->> (fn [->>] ->>)) '->>)
20:50	lazybot	⇒ ->>
20:50	justin_smith	reminds me of salmon season
20:53	ambrosebs	##(-> [x 1] (let x))
20:53	lazybot	⇒ 1
20:55	ambrosebs	##(-> 1 `(let 1))
20:55	lazybot	clojure.lang.ArityException: Wrong number of args (2) passed to: core/seq
20:55	ambrosebs	##(macroexpand `(let 1))
20:55	lazybot	java.lang.IllegalArgumentException: clojure.core/let requires a vector for its binding in sandbox11388:
20:56	justin_smith	&(macroexpand-1 `(let 1))
20:56	lazybot	java.lang.IllegalArgumentException: clojure.core/let requires a vector for its binding in sandbox11388:
20:56	justin_smith	hmm
20:56	ambrosebs	&(macroexpand-1 ``(let 1))
20:56	lazybot	⇒ (clojure.core/seq (clojure.core/concat (clojure.core/list (quote clojure.core/let)) (clojure.core/list 1)))
20:57	ambrosebs	&(macroexpand-1 '`(let 1))
20:57	justin_smith	I think the leading space threw it off
20:57	ambrosebs	&(macroexpand-1 '`(let 1))
20:57	lazybot	⇒ (clojure.core/seq (clojure.core/concat (clojure.core/list (quote clojure.core/let)) (clojure.core/list 1)))
20:58	ambrosebs	&(= ``(let 1) '`(let 1))
20:58	lazybot	⇒ true
21:00	ambrosebs	&((fn clojure.core/fn [a] (if a (clojure.core/fn nil) 2)) 1)
21:00	lazybot	java.lang.IllegalArgumentException: Parameter declaration should be a vector
21:00	hbccbh	(doc doc)
21:00	clojurebot	#<AccessControlException java.security.AccessControlException: access denied ("java.lang.RuntimePermission" "accessDeclaredMembers")>
21:02	ambrosebs	&((fn fn [a] (if a (fn nil) 2)) 1)
21:02	lazybot	java.lang.IllegalArgumentException: Parameter declaration should be a vector
21:21	nub	Hi! I'm trying to display a chart with incanter, but it just spits this out in my repl instead of dislpaying a chart: #<ChartFrame org.jfree.chart.ChartFrame[frame2,0,23,500x400,layout=java.awt.BorderLayout,title=Incanter Plot,resizable,normal,defaultCloseOperation=DISPOSE_ON_CLOSE,rootPane=javax.swing.JRootPane[,0,22,500x378,layout=javax.swing.JRootPane$RootLayout,alignmentX=0.0,alignmentY=0.0,border=,flags=16777673,maximumSize=,minim
21:21	nub	Does anyone know what might be going on?
21:24	nub	Actually it works if I run lein-repl from the terminal. But with my Emacs nREPL it doesn't display the chart.
21:25	justin_smith	nub: emacs in an X window or emacs in a terminal?
21:26	nub	emacs gui on OSX
21:28	nub	justin_smith: actually it did display, but it popped up behind my emacs window
21:28	nub	justin_smith: do you know if there's a way to make the graphs appear in the foreground?
21:29	justin_smith	nub: no I don't, I am sure that is OS specific
21:29	nub	justin_smith: oh ok, thanks!
21:29	justin_smith	there may be a jframe method for popping to the foreground that you could invoke on the chartframe?
21:29	justin_smith	I assume the chartframe is a subclass of a jframe
21:32	justin_smith	nub: looks like java.awt.Window has .toFront
21:32	justin_smith	if you have a handle to the top level window object (or if that ChartFrame inherits from Window)
21:33	justin_smith	http://www.jfree.org/jfreechart/api/javadoc/org/jfree/chart/ChartFrame.html yeah, ChartFrame inherits from java.awt.Window, so it has the .toFront method
21:33	justin_smith	so that should just work
21:34	nub	justin_smith: oh cool, thanks!
22:47	windobu	4chan is down :/
23:51	Dynasty	is there a function to conduct a pre-walk on a tree with an accumulator?
23:53	Dynasty	nvm I can probably make it work with zippers