2012-03-14
| 00:00 | spoon16 | playing around with 4clojure this evening |
| 00:01 | spoon16 | why does recur expect two args here? |
| 00:01 | spoon16 | ,((fn [[f & r] x] (if r (recur r) f)) [1 2 3 4 5]) |
| 00:01 | clojurebot | #<CompilerException java.lang.IllegalArgumentException: Mismatched argument count to recur, expected: 2 args, got: 1, compiling:(NO_SOURCE_PATH:0)> |
| 00:01 | dnolen | spoon16: your fn takes 2 args |
| 00:01 | cgag | looks like the function takes a vector and a scalar |
| 00:01 | spoon16 | doesn't it take just one arg that gets destructured? |
| 00:02 | _ato | arg1: [f & r] |
| 00:02 | _ato | arg2: x |
| 00:02 | spoon16 | does the destructuring not apply when using recur? |
| 00:02 | spoon16 | ohh |
| 00:02 | spoon16 | x shouldn't be there, was using it like let |
| 00:02 | spoon16 | thanks |
| 00:10 | justicefries | so, more of an inexperienced LISP question here than anything. is it kosher to have a SLIME server running on a production server? |
| 00:10 | justicefries | or in production code, rather. |
| 00:10 | justicefries | I have a feeling it would tempt me to be very dirty. |
| 00:13 | _ato | justicefries: myself I would only do that as a last resort if I couldn't debug the issue in a development environment |
| 00:14 | justicefries | _ato, that makes sense. |
| 03:38 | gtuckerkellogg | i have a hashmap, and want to disj every entry with a particular value. Any suggestions? |
| 03:46 | raek | gtuckerkellogg: perhaps into and map-cat? |
| 03:46 | stirfoo | (into {} (map #(if (foo? (% 1)) nil %) m)) |
| 03:46 | raek | or just into map and filter |
| 03:46 | stirfoo | what he said |
| 03:47 | raek | ,(into {} (filter (fn [[k v]] (even? v)) {:a 1, :b 2})) |
| 03:48 | clojurebot | {:b 2} |
| 03:48 | gtuckerkellogg | ahh |
| 03:50 | amalloy | ,(into {} (filter (comp even? val) {:a 1 :b 2})) ;; perhaps slightly classier |
| 03:50 | clojurebot | {:b 2} |
| 03:54 | stirfoo | mine is shorter! (one of the few times you'll hear a man say that) |
| 03:55 | gtuckerkellogg | haha |
| 04:00 | raek | huh, I had no idea that conj accepts nil entries! ;-) |
| 04:24 | tomoj | nil entries? |
| 04:25 | raek | &(conj {} [:a 1] nil [:b 2] nil) |
| 04:25 | lazybot | ⇒ {:b 2, :a 1} |
| 04:26 | raek | I wasn't aware that (conj some-map nil) = some-map |
| 04:49 | amalloy | raek: please don't depend on that though, it only works because of a disgusting coincidence |
| 04:50 | amalloy | specifically, because conj is willing to take a seq of map-entries, or a vector, or a map. the last clause (map) is the catch-all, so nil is treated as an empty map |
| 05:56 | Licenser | morning |
| 06:05 | Lajla | Licenser, what is your opinion on the parting push? |
| 06:12 | Licenser | parting push? |
| 06:16 | Lajla | Licenser, well, it's like a response to gasless FE pionered by parting |
| 06:16 | Lajla | where you actually go one gate FE into another nexus before you make anythingh else |
| 06:16 | Lajla | And then you mass sentries while you power to 8gate and just push with something that looks like a 6gate, hits slightly later but is not all in due to the third |
| 06:17 | Lajla | And the 8 gates can also be used defensively, to protect what otherwise could be considered a risky third |
| 06:17 | Licenser | in that case I am al for it. |
| 06:17 | Lajla | Licenser, hmm, motivate. |
| 06:17 | Licenser | go Lajla go go go! |
| 06:19 | Fossi | yay for more sc2 talk in here :> |
| 06:19 | Lajla | Fossi, don't tell me you play that godawful game? |
| 06:20 | Lajla | Anyway, I've been experimenting with a variation where I get 5 gates, 2 forges and a robo |
| 06:20 | Lajla | And use them purely defensively or with warp prism tomfoolry |
| 06:20 | Fossi | i'm too busy these days :/ |
| 06:20 | Fossi | gotta play swtor ;) |
| 06:20 | Lajla | Fossi, well, as it looks, gasless FE might become obsolete since Parting discovered that getting a third that quickly is actually completely safe against it. |
| 06:21 | gtrak`` | i still haven't beaten revenge of the titans :-( |
| 06:39 | gtrak`` | anyone have a copy of the 'are we there yet' slides? link is down |
| 06:39 | gtrak`` | HickeyJVMSummit2009.pdf |
| 07:10 | mindbender1 | |
| 07:17 | _ato | gtrak``: Internet Archive's got it: http://wayback.archive.org/web/*/wiki.jvmlangsummit.com/images/a/ab/HickeyJVMSummit2009.pdf |
| 07:17 | gtrak`` | oh thanks |
| 09:42 | dan_b | ooh, I like this Hickey HDD talk already |
| 09:44 | bsteuber | dan_b: HDD? |
| 09:44 | dan_b | hammock driven developement |
| 09:44 | bradwright | Hammock Driven Development |
| 09:44 | dan_b | I know it's an old talk, but I'm a new user |
| 09:45 | bsteuber | ah that one ^^ |
| 09:45 | dreen | what talk is this? |
| 09:45 | dan_b | http://blip.tv/clojure/hammock-driven-development-4475586 |
| 09:45 | dreen | kieferific |
| 09:48 | maacl | Does anyone know of an example of ClojureScript REPL setup that supports emacs like edit, history etc? |
| 09:51 | bsteuber | maacl: just start the repl command as an inferior lisp |
| 09:52 | uvtc | What does it mean to have "used <something> in anger"? (as in in the lein tut where it mentions using Ant or Maven in anger) |
| 09:53 | RickInGA | uvtc: to actually have used it to solve a real problem instead of just exploring it, trying examples |
| 09:53 | bsteuber | maacl: https://gist.github.com/2036624 this is how I do it |
| 09:53 | RickInGA | though in the lein tutorial, it may be punning, getting angry at ant or maven :) |
| 09:54 | maacl | bsteuber: Thanks a lot - is it OK if I skip the paredit part :-) |
| 09:54 | uvtc | RickInGA, Hm. Thanks. |
| 09:55 | bsteuber | sure ^^ |
| 09:55 | bsteuber | maacl: probably you write lein instead of lein1, just note that it doesn't seem to work with lein2yet |
| 09:56 | RickInGA | bsteuber how would I invoke that? M-x clojurescript-repl ? |
| 09:56 | bsteuber | maacl: also you meed to be in the project directory when you start the command |
| 09:56 | maacl | bsteuber: Got that, thanks. Do you have any experience with how this interacts cljs-template? |
| 09:56 | bsteuber | RickInGA: I use (global-set-key [f6] 'clojurescript-repl) |
| 09:57 | bsteuber | maacl: no haven't tried cljs-template yet |
| 09:57 | RickInGA | bsteuber I am fairly new to emacs, what does global-set-key do, and how do I set it up? |
| 09:57 | uvtc | RickInGA, re. anger, perhaps using it work where you need to solve a problem with it and you're stuck with it. |
| 09:57 | bsteuber | but I do use lein2 with the rest of the project |
| 09:58 | maacl | bsteuber: Ok, I will give that a shot tonight, think it should work fine. |
| 09:58 | bsteuber | RickInGA: you just put both both commands in your .emacs, then F6 will always trigger the cljs repl |
| 09:59 | RickInGA | bsteuber I will try that, thanks a bunch! |
| 09:59 | bsteuber | having said that, I don't really use the cljs repl much ^^ |
| 09:59 | bsteuber | I always hate to write full qualified names everywhere |
| 10:00 | bsteuber | so I usually just put my experiments in the main fn and hit refresh on the browser for exploring |
| 10:00 | bsteuber | but maybe I am doing something wrong ^^ |
| 10:03 | RickInGA | bsteuber thanks a ton for the help. I think I still have a configuration issue though. |
| 10:03 | RickInGA | the repl launches, but when I try (+ 1 2) it hangs |
| 10:05 | bsteuber | RickInGA: even when you refresh the browser window? |
| 10:06 | bsteuber | RickInGA: did you follow https://github.com/emezeske/lein-cljsbuild/blob/0.1.2/doc/REPL.md ? |
| 10:06 | RickInGA | bsteuber: I don't know where to point the browser. If i go to localhost:9000 I get a message that says no xpc param provided to child iframe |
| 10:06 | bsteuber | no you go to the page where the js is loaded |
| 10:06 | bsteuber | which might be a noir view or just static html |
| 10:08 | RickInGA | bsteuber: THANKS |
| 10:08 | bsteuber | it works? |
| 10:09 | RickInGA | bsteuber I spent 8 hours on this yesterday! and sure it all makes sense in hindisght! thanks a bunch. |
| 10:09 | RickInGA | yep, working! |
| 10:10 | bsteuber | great |
| 10:10 | RickInGA | bsteuber you going to clojurewest? |
| 10:10 | bsteuber | I only spend some time using lein2 ^^ |
| 10:11 | bsteuber | no it's a bit far from Germany ^^ |
| 10:11 | RickInGA | I am using 1.7 with the new cljs templates |
| 10:11 | bsteuber | but maybe EuroClojure :) |
| 10:12 | RickInGA | bsteuber Wann ich zum Deutchland gehen, ich wolle Sie ein beir kaufen |
| 10:12 | RickInGA | and forgive me, my german is terrible! |
| 10:14 | RickInGA | hehe |
| 10:14 | mdeboard | rofl |
| 10:14 | gfredericks | RickInGA: it's terrible english too |
| 10:14 | RickInGA | hey, I live in Georgia, I am not expected to speak English well! |
| 10:14 | bsteuber | lol |
| 10:15 | bsteuber | don't worry, I'll have to buy a thousand beers when I ever go to a conj :) |
| 10:15 | mefesto | how do you pass the ring request to your view function using compojure routes? (GET "/my/url" {:as req} (my-view req)) ? |
| 10:44 | TimMc | gfredericks: You mean doseq? |
| 10:45 | TimMc | or (comp doall map) |
| 10:45 | gfredericks | TimMc: no |
| 10:45 | gfredericks | similar functionality |
| 10:45 | gfredericks | doseq:myfun::for:map |
| 10:45 | TimMc | ... |
| 10:45 | bsteuber | gfredericks: yes I called that domap in some code |
| 10:45 | bsteuber | like CL's mapc |
| 10:46 | gfredericks | TimMc: the purpose is a syntactically succincter form of (doseq [x xs] (foo x)) |
| 10:46 | TimMc | I see. |
| 10:46 | gfredericks | so I can say (domap foo xs) |
| 10:46 | gfredericks | point-free |
| 10:46 | gfredericks | it'd use dorun internally instead of doall, presuming you only want side effects |
| 10:50 | pjstadig | gfredericks: there's mapv in 1.4 |
| 10:50 | gfredericks | ,*clojure-version* |
| 10:50 | clojurebot | {:interim true, :major 1, :minor 4, :incremental 0, :qualifier "master"} |
| 10:50 | gfredericks | ,(doc mapv) |
| 10:50 | clojurebot | "([f coll] [f c1 c2] [f c1 c2 c3] [f c1 c2 c3 & ...]); Returns a vector consisting of the result of applying f to the set of first items of each coll, followed by applying f to the set of second items in each coll, until any one of the colls is exhausted. Any remaining items in other colls are ignored. Function f should accept number-of-colls arguments." |
| 10:51 | gfredericks | hm. how is this different from map? |
| 10:51 | TimMc | (into [] (map ...)) |
| 10:52 | gfredericks | oh |
| 10:52 | TimMc | AFAICS |
| 10:52 | gfredericks | ah so it forces it |
| 10:53 | gfredericks | that would be good for my former colleague who has sprinkled (doall (map ...)) all over his code |
| 10:53 | pjstadig | right, it's non-lazy |
| 10:53 | pjstadig | ,(doc filterv) |
| 10:53 | clojurebot | "([pred coll]); Returns a vector of the items in coll for which (pred item) returns true. pred must be free of side-effects." |
| 10:53 | pjstadig | ^ non-lazy filter |
| 10:54 | gfredericks | the "free of side-effects" requirement is curious there |
| 10:54 | gfredericks | I think I've had that discussion before though |
| 10:54 | gfredericks | it just seems starker in a non-lazy function |
| 10:58 | TimMc | Is filter eager by one? |
| 11:10 | gfredericks | how do I search for the word under the point? |
| 11:11 | drewr | C-s C-w C-s C-s C-s ... |
| 11:12 | gfredericks | drewr: thx |
| 11:13 | jsabeaudry | thanks, didn't know that one, nothing like a bit of emacs-fu to start the day |
| 11:14 | clgv | ,(source mapv) |
| 11:14 | clojurebot | Source not found |
| 11:14 | clgv | &*clojure-version* |
| 11:14 | lazybot | ⇒ {:major 1, :minor 3, :incremental 0, :qualifier nil} |
| 11:28 | TimMc | clgv: Neither bot does source, I think. |
| 11:28 | clgv | $source mapv |
| 11:28 | lazybot | Source not found. |
| 11:28 | octagon | haha i'm the 420th person in the room! |
| 11:28 | clgv | $source map |
| 11:28 | lazybot | map is http://is.gd/rSYDfR |
| 11:28 | octagon | and auspitious number |
| 11:28 | octagon | s/and/an/ |
| 11:30 | lnostdal | the heck is up with recent aleph .. it forwards and stores or even caches, internally, thread bindings .. in-between requests or something |
| 11:35 | ieure | Can't let qualified name: jimmies.s3/foo |
| 11:35 | ieure | :( |
| 11:35 | ieure | e.g. (defmacro with-foo [& body] `(let [foo "foo"] ~@body)) |
| 11:35 | ieure | I _want_ to capture that symbol. |
| 11:36 | gfredericks | ieure: use ~'foo |
| 11:36 | gfredericks | and feel shameful about it |
| 11:36 | ieure | Man what a pain. |
| 11:36 | ieure | There is no shame in symbol capture. |
| 11:36 | ieure | When you want it. |
| 11:37 | gfredericks | ieure: how would you prefer it to work though? |
| 11:37 | gfredericks | backquote gotta have some way to know what to expand and what not to |
| 11:39 | ieure | gfredericks, I don't recall this being a problem with < 1.3.0. |
| 11:40 | gfredericks | I think it was the same then. And I don't know why you'd call it a "problem" |
| 11:40 | ieure | gfredericks, So… The way is used to, I suppose. Where I can capture any damn symbol I please. |
| 11:40 | gfredericks | but how does backquote know which one's you're capturing? |
| 11:40 | ieure | Why does it care? |
| 11:40 | ieure | CL doesn't. |
| 11:40 | clgv | ieure: you get that same error in 1.2(.1) |
| 11:40 | ieure | You want to avoid capture, use a gensym. |
| 11:40 | gfredericks | does CL qualify symbols for you? |
| 11:49 | joly | ,(println "Quick Test") |
| 11:50 | clojurebot | Quick Test |
| 11:50 | Bronsa | very responsive clojurebot |
| 11:51 | gfredericks | I didn't see anyone else jumping up to type "Quick Test" |
| 11:51 | gfredericks | bots do the jobs nobody else wants to do |
| 11:54 | fliebel | Quick Test |
| 11:54 | fliebel | Recently on pepijndevos.nl: http://pepijndevos.nl/2012/03/13/thoughts-about-generating-stripboard-layouts.html |
| 11:56 | mdeboard | What's the command to exit the repl again please |
| 11:56 | mdeboard | I have forgotted |
| 11:57 | metajack | C-d :) |
| 11:57 | mdeboard | Well fine |
| 11:57 | mdeboard | :P |
| 11:57 | metajack | (System/exit 0) :) |
| 12:01 | TimMc | fliebel: botsnack |
| 12:01 | fliebel | homnomnom, thanks, that was delicious |
| 12:03 | fliebel | I feel like I should throw some sort of sandbox exception now... |
| 12:03 | fliebel | &(system/exit 0) |
| 12:03 | lazybot | java.lang.RuntimeException: No such namespace: system |
| 12:03 | fliebel | &(System/exit 0) |
| 12:03 | lazybot | java.security.AccessControlException: access denied (java.lang.RuntimePermission exitVM.0) |
| 12:08 | TimMc | fliebel: I think the most analogous thing would be if I gave you an unsafe but intriguing IRC command, such as /disco |
| 12:08 | mheld | hey y'all |
| 12:08 | TimMc | mheld: hey there |
| 12:09 | fliebel | mheld: botsnack :) |
| 12:09 | mheld | TimMc! |
| 12:09 | TimMc | mheld: What are you doing in this window, you're supposed to be over in screen window 2. |
| 12:09 | TimMc | Totally wrong IRC network and everything. |
| 12:09 | mheld | haha |
| 12:10 | mheld | I happen to be in 5 rooms right now :-P |
| 12:10 | mheld | only one of which is in ccs |
| 12:11 | solussd | anyone have any experience using conjure on an actual website? I'm intrigued by a rails-like framework in clojure, but not sure if I should bet the farm on it (instead of just using rails) for a project at work |
| 12:11 | mheld | solussd: I'm working on some rails-ish extensions of noir |
| 12:12 | mheld | solussd: (I'm a huge rails-lover) |
| 12:12 | mheld | solussd: so I don't know if that'll sway your opinion in any way |
| 12:19 | gf3 | guh |
| 12:19 | gf3 | clojurescript testing |
| 12:19 | gf3 | how does it work? |
| 12:20 | gf3 | #magnets |
| 12:21 | muhoo | heh |
| 12:22 | TimMc | mheld: What kind of extensions? |
| 12:22 | TimMc | Mass assignment? :-P |
| 12:23 | muhoo | for some reason, the idea of combining rails and noir makes me a little queasy. |
| 12:23 | TimMc | "drinking on the train" |
| 12:23 | muhoo | rather, i like noir, and rails makes me a little queasy. |
| 12:23 | mheld | TimMc: lein noir g scaffold user, lein noir g controller pages index about |
| 12:24 | mheld | TimMc: (defresource user) |
| 12:24 | muhoo | the whole idea of generated scaffold code in mvc stuff always felt like a hack to me. |
| 12:24 | TimMc | I've never been comfortable with scaffolding. |
| 12:24 | mheld | you don't really use scaffolding in production |
| 12:24 | TimMc | It strikes me as a lack of macros. |
| 12:24 | muhoo | like "this stuff is so verbose and spews files all over the place, let's write some helper code that does it for us" |
| 12:25 | napping | you prefer macros and their kin? |
| 12:25 | dan_b | if you have to generate code, your source language is insuifficiently expressive |
| 12:25 | dan_b | I say that as someone working ona rails app on the screen next tothis one |
| 12:25 | napping | This may be the wrong channel, but security issues and such in rails always remind me of its antithesis: http://impredicative.com/ur/ |
| 12:25 | muhoo | dan_b: thank you. i didn't feel comfortable stating it so strongly, but that is consistent with what i've experienced so far with rails, yii, etc. |
| 12:25 | TimMc | napping: Is that Ur/web? |
| 12:26 | napping | yes |
| 12:27 | dan_b | for the avoidance of doubt, I'm talking here about generated code which teh user is then expected to edit |
| 12:27 | dan_b | yacc compiles to C, clojurescript compiles to js, I'm fine with that |
| 12:27 | mheld | ... you know that a user will have to create sourcecode at one point |
| 12:28 | mheld | so if you were creating a user model, you would still have to tell the framework how to render that model |
| 12:28 | mheld | scaffolding just automates the initialization |
| 12:28 | dan_b | but it's a one-short operation |
| 12:28 | mheld | hmm? |
| 12:29 | dan_b | if you customise that view, and then you want to use the generators again to add an extra field |
| 12:29 | napping | dan_b: let me misinterpret you too far - only JITed languages can be expressive |
| 12:29 | dan_b | ... you can't, without overwriting your changes |
| 12:29 | mheld | dan_b: so then make it without having it be destructive |
| 12:29 | mheld | I don't get what the problem is |
| 12:29 | muhoo | mheld: then maybe it's not a problem, for you anyway. |
| 12:29 | dan_b | how do you propose making it non-destructive? |
| 12:30 | mheld | dan_b: dunno yet, but it's a solveable problem |
| 12:30 | dan_b | I bet whatever the answer is it involves not having the user edit generated code, or having a strict protocol for which bits are user-editable and which bits are generator-updatable |
| 12:31 | dan_b | which is sorta where we came in |
| 12:31 | mheld | why? |
| 12:31 | clojurebot | why not? |
| 12:31 | mheld | thanks clojurebot |
| 12:31 | mheld | why do things have to fit that way? |
| 12:31 | dan_b | because otherwise the generator has to be able to understand what your changes do in order to fix conflicts it creates |
| 12:31 | dan_b | Turing-completeness etc etc |
| 12:32 | mheld | dan_b: why can't we make it in such a way that it's manageable for the generator to understand what we've created so far |
| 12:32 | technomancy | napping: ur looks awesome |
| 12:32 | napping | It's kinda rough around the edges, but certainly philosophically opposed to many common things |
| 12:33 | technomancy | if I were doing web work full time I'd be mining it for ideas |
| 12:33 | technomancy | hint hint |
| 12:33 | napping | How would that work? |
| 12:33 | technomancy | hmm; no idea, that's the wonder of it. |
| 12:34 | muhoo | that mini-kanren post about routing components on a stripboard is interesting, but |
| 12:34 | frou | I may be off base, but think sounds a bit like the "partial class" that for example Visual Studio generates and keeps up to date as you are developing a GUI |
| 12:34 | muhoo | there are tools already that'll route components on a pcb, and i've used them to route on stripboard just as well |
| 12:34 | frou | you edit the other part of the partial class |
| 12:34 | muhoo | they apparently have some kind of topology algorithm already in them, plus libraries of the parts and their dimensons, etc |
| 12:35 | napping | It seems to be a thoroughly typeful approach, calculating CRUD pages from the type of a databae table and such |
| 12:36 | mheld | point being that these problems aren't unsurmountable and that ignoring them is lazy |
| 12:36 | napping | mheld: a strawman alternative - the generator takes a map of overrides |
| 12:37 | mheld | that could work, too |
| 12:38 | dan_b | frou: in short, you edit one "resource" and the computer manages another |
| 12:41 | frou | you and the computer are both working on the same unit, but the part where the initial and subsequent generated code goes is partitioned off and you don't edit it |
| 12:41 | frou | this VS example may be very pedestrian.. I'm not familiar with ruby or rails |
| 12:42 | dan_b | what I said above about protocols to avoid u & c stepping on each others toes then |
| 12:42 | Wild_Cat | frou: isn't that stuff deprecated in favor of a declarative UI description language? |
| 12:43 | Wild_Cat | (something Java desperately needs as part of its stdlib) |
| 12:43 | mheld | you *could* migrateify that stuff |
| 12:43 | frou | yes, the XAML business. I stopped doing GUI stuff before that took hold |
| 12:53 | gf3 | hey ibdknox, do you know how I can include google closure libraries with lein-cljsbuild? |
| 13:04 | dnolen | ejackson created a nice shiny new tutorial for core.logic - https://github.com/clojure/core.logic/wiki/A-Core.logic-Primer |
| 13:04 | dnolen | oops, meant to paste http://github.com/clojure/core.logic/wiki/A-Core.logic-Primer |
| 13:09 | devn | :( cljs-template wont install on lein 2 for me /cc ibdknox technomancy |
| 13:16 | devn | ah, looks like 0.1.4 isn't on clojars yet |
| 13:17 | dnolen | anyone tried lein-navem? |
| 13:19 | TimMc | "navem"? |
| 13:19 | TimMc | Is that a thing or a typo? |
| 13:21 | antares__ | TimMc: that's a plugin that turns pom.xml into project.clj or something like that |
| 13:21 | devn | "lein-navem is a lein plugin that converts a maven pom.xml into a project.clj" |
| 13:22 | thickey | i've used it, but i wrote it, so i don't count |
| 13:22 | thickey | feedback welcome |
| 13:22 | devn | ha |
| 13:26 | mheld | I'm writing a macro and I want to defer a method call to be based off the arguments -- (defmacro thing [arg] `(do (~arg methodcall))) |
| 13:26 | mheld | is that kosher? |
| 13:27 | halarnold2000 | he meant lein-nevam |
| 13:28 | bitrot | lein-navem was born a poor java child. |
| 13:32 | solussd | mheld: I've been looking at noir now for about an hour- do you believe it is suited for building a hateoas / REST api + frontend? |
| 13:33 | solussd | mheld: certainly looks up to the task... |
| 13:34 | mheld | definitely a REST api |
| 13:34 | mheld | and definitely a small web app |
| 13:35 | mheld | erm, by (defmacro thing [arg] `(do (~arg methodcall))) I meant (defmacro thing [arg] `(do (~arg/methodcall somevalue))) |
| 13:35 | solussd | mheld: how about a large web app? :D |
| 13:35 | dnolen | thickey: yeah it's super useful, especially for contrib authors where we rely on pom.xml. I'm trying to use it with lein2 on core.logic's pom.xml but I'm getting a null pointer exception |
| 13:36 | mheld | solussd: not sure |
| 13:36 | mheld | solussd: I've never built anything large with it |
| 13:37 | dnolen | thickey: https://gist.github.com/2038112 |
| 13:37 | solussd | mheld: building a product demo in it for now- worst case scenario, I doubt I could waste much time with it-- everything is super straightforward |
| 13:39 | thickey | dnolen: I can recreate that here. i'll take a look, perhaps I'm presuming something will will be in the pom that's not there. |
| 13:39 | dnolen | thickey: thx, much! |
| 13:50 | h0x5f3759df | Hi, Is this the functional way of doing bfs in clojure? https://gist.github.com/ce8773ccc838f0a48100 |
| 13:58 | mefesto | is there a function in compojure for redirects? |
| 13:58 | Raynes | mefesto: There is one in noir. |
| 13:58 | Raynes | So probably not. |
| 13:58 | mefesto | ah |
| 13:59 | Raynes | Usually things that are in noir are in addition to what are in compojure and not duplicate functionality. |
| 14:23 | thickey | dnolen: give [lein-nevam "0.1.1"] a try |
| 14:27 | dnolen | thickey: sweet! |
| 14:28 | dnolen | emezeske: btw, lein-cljsbuild *rocks*. have you looked much at the issues when using it with lein2? |
| 14:29 | emezeske | dnolen: thanks! |
| 14:29 | emezeske | dnolen: I basically got it to the point where it would "sort of run" on lein2 |
| 14:30 | emezeske | dnolen: Hopefully next week I can switch to using lein2 for everything, in which case I'll probably fix the bugs |
| 14:30 | dnolen | emezeske: gotcha, most things seem to work but the REPL tasks do not. |
| 14:31 | dnolen | emezeske: I also wonder if the trampoline bit couldn't be hidden behind lein-cljsbuild itself. |
| 14:31 | emezeske | dnolen: Ah, that's a bummer. |
| 14:31 | emezeske | dnolen: Yeah, actually, lein2 adds some kind of aliasing, and I plan to hide the trampoline stuff with it |
| 14:31 | emezeske | That's a long word to type |
| 14:32 | dnolen | emezeske: nice! I'm getting bit eager since I've got my JSConf presentation coming up :) |
| 14:32 | emezeske | dnolen: Oh? Talking about clojurescript there? |
| 14:32 | dnolen | emezeske: being able to manage client side library dependencies this way is pretty slick coming from copy-paste JS workflows. |
| 14:32 | dnolen | emezeske: yes |
| 14:33 | emezeske | dnolen: Nice! |
| 14:33 | jsabeaudry | Is the clojure/java mmap the same as the posix one? Will that call the mmap in the file_operations of my kernel module? |
| 14:33 | emezeske | dnolen: Glad to hear that it's useful. It's cool that it works that way |
| 14:38 | dnolen | emezeske: I might poke around in lein-cljsbuild to see I can help out with lein2 compat, would be nice to show a simple workflow to curious folks. |
| 14:38 | technomancy | in lein 1.6, only the trampoline task can trampoline, but I think now any task that writes to the trampoline file will be trampolined |
| 14:39 | technomancy | just check the leiningen.trampoline-file system property |
| 15:01 | muhoo | after playing around with clojure, having to do actual paid work in php makes me want to cry. |
| 15:01 | emezeske | dnolen: Cool. I doubt the repl problem is anything super hard to fix |
| 15:01 | emezeske | technomancy: Ooh, very cool |
| 15:02 | tmciver | muhoo: ain't that the truth. |
| 15:02 | muhoo | tmciver: https://refheap.com/paste/1064 |
| 15:02 | muhoo | i'm sure there's a 1liner in clj that'd do that. |
| 15:03 | Twey | muhoo: http://lukeplant.me.uk/blog/posts/why-learning-haskell-python-makes-you-a-worse-programmer/ |
| 15:03 | Twey | (applies to Clojure just as well) |
| 15:03 | muhoo | i should play around with pharen some more |
| 15:03 | tmciver | muhoo: yeah, but then you wouldn't have that cool deeply-nested look! |
| 15:05 | muhoo | "don't bother improving yourself, unless you have the freedom to improve your environment accordingly." <-- that is the key right there |
| 15:06 | muhoo | that's actually quite deep, as well as quite depressing. |
| 15:06 | muhoo | it's true about not just programming, but anything. |
| 15:08 | Vinzent | Is it possible somehow to alter static var? |
| 15:09 | muhoo | well to hel with that. i've shut down most of my customers, am taking some months off to learn clojure, and will see if i can make a living with that instead. if not, back to the java/php salt mines for me. |
| 15:20 | llasram | Vinzent: What do you mean by "static var"? |
| 15:20 | llasram | muhoo: Wow. I wish you hopeful luck :-) |
| 15:21 | Vinzent | llasram, a var with :static true in its metadata, see e.g. map, filter and other clojure.core functions |
| 15:23 | llasram | Ah, ok. I believe :static was only meaningful for pre-release versions of 1.3. I'm not entirely confident it had no impact in 1.2, but it does have no impact on the 1.3 compiler |
| 15:25 | Vinzent | llasram, well, when I'm trying to alter it, I'm getting "Evaluation aborted" and then swank connection just closes. |
| 15:27 | llasram | Vinzent: Just double-checked -- all the 1.3 compiler code handling :static metadata is commented-out. So whatever is going wrong, doesn't have anything to do with the Var being :static |
| 15:28 | TimMc | Twey: "The other C++ guys on the team still look at my code like it's got legs" is pretty excellent. |
| 15:32 | Vinzent | llasram, hm, then probably the swank server uses map, so when I alter it things break down. Thanks. |
| 15:32 | llasram | Well, `map' is a pretty fundamental operation :-) |
| 15:32 | llasram | What are you trying to do with it anyway? |
| 15:37 | Vinzent | oh, I'm just playing with contracts |
| 15:37 | zakwilson | Do most people just use clojure.test for testing, or is there something more fancy that's worth a look? |
| 15:38 | Vinzent | zakwilson, midje totally worths a look |
| 15:38 | zakwilson | Wow. It has an infomercial. |
| 15:39 | llasram | haha. Midje lets you do a lot of nice stuff, but I haven't quite figured out some details of workflow around it |
| 15:44 | llasram | In order to run individual tests from Emacs, you need to compile the test namespace file, so that it creates the namespace etc, does any init, etc. But compiling the file runs all the tests. It just feels slightly off to me, but there's probably |
| 15:44 | llasram | some easy solution I just haven't realized yet |
| 15:45 | TimMc | `fogus: Does Marginalia have a mechanism for hooking in and adding/modifying the HTML for a var based on metadata? |
| 15:46 | Vinzent | llasram, hm, what do you mean? With clojure.test you also have to compile ns first, no? |
| 15:47 | llasram | Vinzent: Sure, but deftest just squirrels off the actual test code to run later. Midge `facts' run their test content when evaluated |
| 15:48 | Vinzent | llasram, yes, but what's the problem with that? |
| 15:48 | llasram | You can't compile a midje testing namespace without running all tests it contains :-) |
| 15:48 | zakwilson | ibdknox: if I'm noir-ifying an existing project, what version should I use? The latest alpha, or is that too likely to blow up in my face? |
| 15:49 | Vinzent | yes, but... what's the problem with that? :) |
| 15:50 | llasram | It just doesn't usually seem like what I want. Of the set {run all tests, run tests all in a single namespace, run a single test}, "run tests in a single namespace" is the one I use the least |
| 15:51 | zakwilson | Running the test when evaluated sounds good except when I want to set up some state before running the test. |
| 15:51 | `fogus | TimMc: It does not |
| 15:52 | Vinzent | llasram, but you don't forced to do so. You can also run individual tests from emacs, having your buffer compiled once, or you can use lein midje --lazytest |
| 15:52 | Vinzent | zakwilson, you can do it with midje's background form |
| 15:52 | llasram | zakwilson: Midje actually has really nice support for setup and teardown and advanced variants thereof. |
| 15:52 | llasram | what Vinzent said :-) |
| 15:53 | zakwilson | Ok, I'll try it. |
| 15:53 | llasram | Vinzent: You can run individual tests, but only *after* you run all the tests by compiling the namespace. It's not a huge issue -- it just feels kind of clunky to me personally |
| 15:54 | llasram | Vinzent: And I have not yet tried lazytest, but I keep meaning to |
| 15:55 | technomancy | side-effects at compile-time make me frown-facey =( |
| 15:57 | ieure | Is it possible to let a symbol in a different namespace? |
| 15:57 | technomancy | ieure: let only applies to locals |
| 15:57 | ieure | Example: I'm writing a test for code which uses an agent in its namespace to store state, and I want to alter the state for the test. |
| 15:57 | technomancy | maybe you're thinking of binding? |
| 15:58 | ieure | technomancy, Isn't that only for thread locals? |
| 15:58 | technomancy | it's for thread-local "changes" to dynamic vars, yes |
| 15:58 | technomancy | if it's for testing you might find with-redefs more to your liking |
| 15:59 | Vinzent | llasram, oh, ok, I see. I just never, you know, paid attention to it - imo it's handy to run save, compile and run your tests with a single keystroke. Also, as far as I know, Brian Marick, the author of midje, keeps his tests in the same file with source code, so it makes even more sense in such case. |
| 16:01 | Vinzent | ieure, by the way, I believe in midje you could write something like (provided (deref your-agent) => some-value) :) |
| 16:02 | ieure | Vinzent, Nice, but I don't want to port my tests. |
| 16:03 | TimMc | `fogus: Would you accept a pull request for an experimental mechanism for Marginalia hooks/plugins, should one exist? I have an idea for fancy documentation for Overtone libs. :-) |
| 16:03 | ieure | technomancy, I can't use bind or with-redefs on syms in a different ns, either. |
| 16:03 | llasram | ieure: You totes can use with-redefs on symbols from other namespaces |
| 16:04 | TimMc | `fogus: I haven't written anything, but I'm going to a hackfest-ish thing tonight and will probably propose something of the sort. |
| 16:04 | ieure | llasram, Can you point me to some example then, please? |
| 16:04 | Vinzent | ieure, why can't you, are they private or what? |
| 16:04 | gozala | Hi folks I'm trying to learn about clojure protocols |
| 16:04 | gozala | and types |
| 16:04 | ieure | Vinzent, Nothing is private. |
| 16:05 | gozala | is there something like extend-type default in clojure ? |
| 16:05 | dnolen | damn takeoutweight got Clojure running on iOS via clojure-scheme |
| 16:05 | technomancy | ieure: should be able to actually |
| 16:05 | dnolen | gozala: yes extend-type Object |
| 16:05 | technomancy | ieure: also, start thinking in terms of vars, not symbols |
| 16:05 | gozala | dnolen: thanks! |
| 16:05 | gozala | does that also works on clojurescript |
| 16:06 | gozala | or I need extend-type default there instead ? |
| 16:06 | technomancy | ,(binding [clojure.core/*assert* false] true) |
| 16:06 | clojurebot | true |
| 16:06 | dnolen | gozala: no, but js/Object might work in the future. for now you need extend-type default |
| 16:07 | gozala | dnolen: thanks |
| 16:07 | Vinzent | ieure, then what's the problem? just :use it and write (with-redefs [your-agent temp-value] ...) |
| 16:07 | ieure | Vinzent, I think I was getting tripped up with vestigal code. |
| 16:08 | technomancy | ieure: generally symbols are uninteresting after compile-time |
| 16:10 | llasram | ieure: https://refheap.com/paste/1066 if still relevant |
| 16:10 | ieure | llasram, Thanks, I appreciate it. |
| 16:13 | Vinzent | dnolen, by the way, could you guys please include 'case' in cljs? I've read your answer on stackoverflow, but as I understand on of the goals of cljs is to be as compatible with clojure as possible, right? Including case (as an alias for (condp = ...)) would both improve portabilty of code and reduce confusion of clojure developers moving to cljs. Please correct me if I understand it wrong. |
| 16:19 | TimMc | Vinzent: I think performance characteristics are included in the definitions of some things like 'case'. |
| 16:19 | TimMc | It may be that JS doesn't support that kind of language construct? |
| 16:20 | aperiodic | with leiningen 1.7, is there a way to programatically generate an uberjar from inside the project? |
| 16:21 | Vinzent | TimMc, yes, it's exactly the case. But slower working code is better than not working code at all? |
| 16:22 | technomancy | aperiodic: no, the project process should be basically unaware that it's running from within leiningen |
| 16:23 | gfredericks | Vinzent: it might be considered misleading; but this kind of thing could be solved by a library that defines the missing functions, right? |
| 16:23 | technomancy | you might be able to rig up some kind of higher-order task that kept a socket open and would allow the project to invoke leiningen tasks, but you're getting into pretty serious I N C E P T I O N territory there |
| 16:24 | TimMc | Vinzent: Make a lib called close.enough and put a case macro in it. :-P |
| 16:24 | Vinzent | gfredericks, sure, but the point here is that you can't just take you clojure file and use it with clojurescript. (Maybe my understanding is wrong and it's not a goal for cljs at all?) |
| 16:24 | Vinzent | TimMc, ^^ |
| 16:24 | gfredericks | Vinzent: that is not a goal |
| 16:25 | gfredericks | at least not for whole applications |
| 16:25 | TimMc | Not a *primary* goal for sure. |
| 16:26 | gfredericks | Vinzent: I expect they try to keep things the same as long as it's a natural thing to do, but not to do anything too awkward for that sake |
| 16:26 | aperiodic | technomancy: i just want to generate a fresh uberjar and stick it in hadoop's CP for testing, so i guess the better way to implement that would be to modify the test task |
| 16:26 | Vinzent | oh, ok. I've just seen all this code sharing features in cljsbuild, and it made me think that it's an important one |
| 16:26 | gfredericks | Vinzent: I think it's cool for tools like that to try to stretch what's possible in that direction, but most stuff could be done outside of the core language |
| 16:27 | Vinzent | gfredericks, yeah, this makes sense. |
| 16:27 | `fogus | TimMc: Propose away. We're always looking for ways to make Lein more awesome. :-) |
| 16:27 | gfredericks | I think fake-clojure-for-cljs would be an interesting lib to start :) |
| 16:31 | gfredericks | (System/exit) could try to close the browser window |
| 16:33 | Vinzent | gfredericks, hah, sounds interesting :) |
| 16:35 | TimMc | gfredericks: In Mozilla browsers, you *can* interop with Java. |
| 16:35 | gfredericks | TimMc: stop that's obscene |
| 16:36 | TimMc | Problem? |
| 16:36 | clojurebot | People have a problem and think "Hey! I'll use a regular expression!". Now they have two problems.... |
| 16:37 | TimMc | That too. |
| 16:37 | TimMc | Applets are the way of the future. |
| 16:37 | amalloy | clojurebot: any more trite overused quotes? |
| 16:37 | clojurebot | It's greek to me. |
| 16:37 | TimMc | :-D |
| 16:38 | gfredericks | clojurebot: greek? |
| 16:38 | clojurebot | No entiendo |
| 16:39 | gfredericks | now he's just being clever |
| 17:00 | yoklov | well, this is probably the weirdest piece of code i've ever written |
| 17:00 | yoklov | https://github.com/thomcc/unlambda-clj/blob/master/src/unlambda_clj/core.clj |
| 17:04 | cjfrisz | clojurebot: Are you really cleverbot? |
| 17:04 | clojurebot | Gabh mo leithscéal? |
| 17:07 | dnolen | Vinzent: sounds like rhickey agrees w/ you, so we'll probably see case in CLJS soon. |
| 17:07 | juhu_chapa | -quit |
| 17:07 | Vinzent | dnolen, oh, that's a good news! |
| 17:07 | TimMc | Huh, I wouldn't have expected that. |
| 17:08 | dnolen | TimMc: I think lang compat trumps everything else. |
| 17:10 | TimMc | I mean, I'm happy -- just surprised. :-) |
| 17:13 | amalloy | that doesn't sound like what rich has said before about porting large apps from clj to cljs - ie, i got the impression he doesn't think language compatibility trumps all else |
| 17:15 | amalloy | adding case costs basically nothing, though, so i'm glad he decided to emphasize compatibility |
| 17:15 | clojurebot | Huh? |
| 17:15 | dnolen | amalloy: large apps involve host-y stuff - but the core language bits should just work. |
| 17:18 | dnolen | anyone see any problems w/ CLJS using Google Closure HEAD? |
| 17:21 | gozala | anyone cares to explain what's wrong with |
| 17:21 | gozala | (def foo (if (resolve 'foo) foo :fallback)) |
| 17:24 | Vinzent | gozala, mm, isn't it the same as defonce? |
| 17:24 | dnolen | gozala: side note, resolve is kind of a last resort thing. |
| 17:25 | gozala | Vinzent: I did not knew about defonce |
| 17:25 | gozala | thanks |
| 17:25 | gozala | dnolen: what's idiomatic way to check if something is defined then ? |
| 17:26 | dnolen | gozala: checking if something is defined is not very idiomatic. |
| 17:26 | rahcola | how do you eval code in a buffer to user ns when using emacs+slime? |
| 17:26 | rahcola | or do you guys use some other way of working? |
| 17:27 | dnolen | rahcola: C-c C-k, for compile file |
| 17:27 | rahcola | that is, when the code in the buffer is in some ns foo.bar or something |
| 17:27 | Raynes | dnolen: I've had valid reasons for doing that before. |
| 17:27 | gozala | dnolen: I see |
| 17:27 | dnolen | Raynes: I didn't say there weren't valid reasons, just that it's a sign of doing something unusual |
| 17:27 | gozala | dnolen: so what I'm trying to do is to define my abstraction via protocol |
| 17:28 | tmciver | rahcola: you can C-c C-l to eval the file and then I'd C-c M-p to change the repl's ns to said file's ns. |
| 17:28 | Raynes | Anyways, to actually answer the question, bound? |
| 17:28 | gozala | and since I need to use Object in clojure and default in clojurescript |
| 17:28 | gozala | I need to see if default is defined |
| 17:28 | cjfrisz | tmciver: I love when you guys answer questions I didn't think to ask |
| 17:28 | ohpauleez | Is there a reason Clojure's google-closure-jar doesn't include the theird-party? |
| 17:28 | ohpauleez | third* |
| 17:28 | rahcola | tmciver: will new defs made in the repl get added to the file's ns? |
| 17:28 | gozala | or is there some more idiomatic way to do that ? |
| 17:29 | rahcola | i would like to take a defn from the file, and test it in the repl while not messing with the file's ns |
| 17:29 | tmciver | rahcola: yes, if you def them once you're in that ns; not before (I don't think). |
| 17:29 | dnolen | gozala: there's no good way to resolve the differences between Clojure and CLJS protocols. I would warn that trying to build something at the level of the runtime is bound to break. |
| 17:30 | dnolen | gozala: emezeske and others are thinking about source transformation support in the meantime. CL style compile flags have come up, but I haven't seen any movement. |
| 17:32 | gozala | dnolen: what is the best way to define your own purely clojure based & new data structure then ? |
| 17:32 | dnolen | gozala: define it twice once for Clojure once for CLJS. deftypes will often be polluted with host specific information. |
| 17:32 | gozala | I was assuming if I just start from scratch there should be a way to define it so that it works in both worlds |
| 17:33 | dnolen | gozala: what matters is the code that will *use* the deftype can remain the same. |
| 17:34 | rahcola | tmciver: the C-c M-p was a good tip, thanks. any ease way to "clean" the file's ns, make it have only the defs in the file? |
| 17:35 | gozala | dnolen: well I guess I have to break it first to learn more, thanks! |
| 17:35 | dnolen | gozala: yes, cheers :) |
| 17:35 | TimMc | gozala: Maps. Lots of maps. |
| 17:36 | dnolen | TimMc: heh, and +1 |
| 17:36 | gozala | TimMc: sorry I don't get it |
| 17:36 | dnolen | gozala: if you just program around maps you can avoid all these tricky decisions. |
| 17:36 | TimMc | gozala: Most of the time, structured data can be represented very easily as maps. |
| 17:37 | TimMc | {:type :foo, :amount 6, :class :gold} |
| 17:37 | dnolen | that was my point of about it being an unwise use of time trying to get a deftype to work across CLJ and CLJS |
| 17:37 | gozala | TimMc: dnolen In fact what I'd like to do is try to port my js lib |
| 17:37 | gozala | https://github.com/Gozala/streamer |
| 17:37 | gozala | so I started with defining Deferred protocol |
| 17:38 | gozala | and then I'd like to define type that would implement regular sequence protocols |
| 17:38 | tmciver | rahcola: I'm not sure, but I don't think so. Everything I know about swank-clojure I learned from technomancy in here and from: https://github.com/technomancy/swank-clojure |
| 17:39 | technomancy | pssh; I don't know anything about swank |
| 17:39 | gozala | so yeah I'll be playing with maps but I need to get there first :) |
| 17:39 | tmciver | OK, I take it back. technomancy taught me nothing about swank ;) |
| 17:40 | technomancy | but yeah, I would like to have some way of doing ns-unmap. currently there's nothing exposed from slime. |
| 17:40 | tmciver | technomancy: yes, that would be a cool feature. |
| 17:40 | technomancy | oh wait, I lied |
| 17:40 | technomancy | I just got a pull request for that |
| 17:40 | technomancy | let me push to clojars |
| 17:40 | metajack | How does C-c M-p help you faster than (in-ns 'foo.bar)? Mine doesn't get prefilled or anything, nor does it seem to get it from the file i'm in. |
| 17:40 | technomancy | metajack: it has completion |
| 17:41 | metajack | technomancy: ah, nm. i was already in that namespace, so it has a slightly different behavior then |
| 17:41 | technomancy | also, it should be pre-filled if the current buffer's ns is different from what the repl's currently in |
| 17:41 | technomancy | rahcola, tmciver: C-c C-l should clear the given ns now under 1.5.0-SNAPSHOT |
| 17:42 | ohpauleez | ibdknox: THANK YOU for goog-jar |
| 17:42 | ohpauleez | I was just making one and thought, "Wait, How did Chris get around this?" |
| 17:43 | rahcola | technomancy: have to test that right away, after i'm done with this rabbit hol...feature |
| 17:43 | technomancy | rahcola: let me know; I haven't tried it myself =) |
| 17:44 | rahcola | nasty things happen when your tests use names that are no longer valid, but yet still defined |
| 17:45 | technomancy | we call that "getting slimed" |
| 17:46 | technomancy | probably not a good sign when your development tool has an entire class of mistake named after it but WHATEVER |
| 17:46 | gozala | dnolen: I have another mystery to solve now |
| 17:47 | gozala | if I use extend-type on Object it works |
| 17:47 | gozala | but if I (def foo Object) |
| 17:47 | rahcola | always nice to know what hit you |
| 17:47 | gozala | and then do (extend-type foo … it does not |
| 17:48 | gozala | with exception Unable to resolve classname: default |
| 17:48 | gozala | Am I missing something ? |
| 17:49 | dnolen | gozala: you need a symbol that represents a class |
| 18:01 | rahcola | technomancy: what version of leiningen does swank-clojure 1.5.0-SNAPSHOT require? |
| 18:02 | technomancy | rahcola: it won't work with 1.6.2 or older |
| 18:03 | technomancy | actually that's not right; it should work |
| 18:03 | rahcola | the swank task disappeared when I did lein plugin install 1.5.0-SNAPSHOT |
| 18:03 | rahcola | with the swank-clojure in there :) |
| 18:03 | technomancy | yeah you need to use lein-swank now |
| 18:03 | technomancy | wait cripes |
| 18:04 | technomancy | lein-swank doesn't let you override the swank version used in 1.x |
| 18:04 | technomancy | let me fix that |
| 18:04 | rahcola | and do I also need to upgrade clojure-mode? |
| 18:04 | rahcola | because clojure-jack-in seems to use lein swank |
| 18:06 | technomancy | no, clojure-mode can be left alone |
| 18:10 | rahcola | got "Could not start swank server: That's not a task. Use \"lein help\" to list all tasks. |
| 18:10 | rahcola | from clojure-jack-in |
| 18:10 | technomancy | rahcola: ok, lein-swank 1.4.4-SNAPSHOT will only specify its preferred version of swank-clojure if you haven't already got one |
| 18:11 | technomancy | which lein version? |
| 18:12 | rahcola | 1.7.0 |
| 18:12 | rahcola | but I do not have any :plugins entries |
| 18:12 | technomancy | you should be able to put [lein-swank "1.4.4-SNAPSHOT"] in :plugins |
| 18:13 | rahcola | trying that now |
| 18:13 | technomancy | oh, but you want it user-level |
| 18:13 | technomancy | I guess lein plugin install lein-swank 1.4.4-SNAPSHOT would probably work |
| 18:22 | sjl | anyone know how I can build or clauses dynamically with Korma? This doesn't work: http://cljbin.com/paste/4f6119dee4b04ca9bce903d9 |
| 18:23 | rahcola | technomancy: ok, got lein-swank 1.4.4-SNAPSHOT working using :plugins |
| 18:24 | rahcola | but load file does not seems to clear the ns |
| 18:24 | rahcola | btw, is plugin install still the prefered way for installing dev stuff like swank on leiningen? |
| 18:25 | Twey | TimMc: Haha, indeed :þ |
| 18:25 | Twey | TimMc: That's pretty much how people look at all my code, I think. |
| 18:26 | technomancy | rahcola: "lein plugin install" is the preferred way to install plugins that are intended to address user convenience issues in leiningen 1.x, yes |
| 18:26 | technomancy | some plugins are necessary for builds to succeed (lein-midje, lein-tar, etc) and must go in :plugins in project.clj |
| 18:29 | rahcola | hmm.. seems that we should update our project.clj, got lein-midje in :dev-deps |
| 18:30 | technomancy | well if you want to support versions of leiningen older than 1.7 then you still need dev-deps |
| 18:30 | rahcola | its a hobby project, and I'm itching to go for 2.0 :) |
| 18:32 | technomancy | cool |
| 18:37 | metajack | sjl: query needs to be generated from one of the * functions. like select* |
| 18:38 | sjl | metajack: yeah, I did that |
| 18:38 | sjl | metajack: I can modify it after initial generation fine, e.g. by reducing where clauses onto it to get dynamic ANDed queries |
| 18:39 | metajack | oh you need (exec) at the end too |
| 18:39 | sjl | metajack: yes, I already have that too |
| 18:39 | sjl | metajack: the issue is that I can't seem to do something like (apply or [vector of predicates generated at runtime]) |
| 18:40 | metajack | sjl: https://github.com/ibdknox/Korma/blob/master/src/korma/sql/engine.clj#L314-321 that doesn't look promising for or queries |
| 18:41 | metajack | there is an or predicate though |
| 18:43 | metajack | hmm. the or predicate works the other way I think. like (where {:ticket [or 1 2]}). at least that's how in and > and the others work |
| 18:44 | augustl | if I use clojure to build a project, can I consider that project free software? Real question: is the/a JVM considered free? |
| 18:47 | augustl | also, will clojure run on JVM's such as JamVM, dalvik, etc? (As you can tell, I'm new to jvm :) |
| 18:47 | sjl | metajack: yeah, but I need to a) use like, not in and b) build the field names at runtime, not the values |
| 18:48 | metajack | i can't get any sensible output for the or operators |
| 18:48 | sjl | ibdknox: ping? |
| 18:49 | metajack | sjl: i suspect this is not implemented yet, or it's opaque enough only ibdknox knows. most of this stuff i've figured out from code reading, but this is beyond me at the moment. |
| 18:49 | sjl | metajack: yeah, that's what I'm beginning to fear |
| 18:49 | aperiodic | augustl: haven't tried it myself, but i've heard that clojure is quite slow on dalvik due to its garbage collector |
| 18:50 | augustl | aperiodic: I see |
| 19:22 | slyrus | technomancy: I assume I need lein1 to build lein2? |
| 19:26 | technomancy | slyrus: if you're building from git, yes |
| 19:26 | technomancy | but the preview2 release will self-install itself |
| 19:28 | slyrus | ok, yeah, I just pulled from git. thanks. |
| 19:30 | mefesto | anyone know how to paste to refheap with emacs? i've installed the refheap lib from marmalade. I'm guessing I (setq refheap-user x) (setq refheap-token y) and that's it? |
| 19:31 | mefesto | that was it :) |
| 20:19 | dnolen | broken Node.js support in CLJS finally fixed |
| 20:20 | emezeske | dnolen: woot! |
| 21:24 | amalloy | mefesto: btw, setq is like clojure's let, in that it accepts pairs |
| 21:24 | amalloy | aw, i just missed him |
| 21:30 | johnmn3 | I'm having trouble with circular namespace dependencies |
| 21:31 | johnmn3 | Suppose I have a bunch of gui functions in space.gui |
| 21:31 | johnmn3 | and a bunch of logic that gets fired off if someone presses a button in space.actions |
| 21:32 | qbg | johnmn3: It is easiest to just refactor the code to eliminate the circularity |
| 21:32 | johnmn3 | so like, the Fire button has an action that calls space.actions/asplode |
| 21:33 | johnmn3 | but, in space.actions/aslplode, you want it to affect some change in the gui, in space.gui |
| 21:33 | johnmn3 | like space.gui/place-explosion |
| 21:34 | johnmn3 | now I have each calling each other. |
| 21:34 | qbg | Indirecting through a message bus is one technique |
| 21:34 | johnmn3 | I did have everything in one file, which worked |
| 21:35 | johnmn3 | Now I'm trying to break it up by functional areas and I'm trying to figure out how to organize it. |
| 21:36 | p_l | anyone can recommend me an online resource for learning clojure? I have previous Common Lisp experience, but now I have two projects that have to live in Java (one is a module called from a java app, another *has* to use RMI), and Clojure looks like least-effort approach... |
| 21:36 | amalloy | johnmn3: don't mutate the gui from the action, then. return a data structure representing changes you want the gui to make |
| 21:36 | johnmn3 | qbg: That. I've also, in the past, decided to pass all the state through every function, and let it pick pieces out of keys |
| 21:36 | amalloy | p_l: www.4clojure.com is one option |
| 21:37 | johnmn3 | how would that work? |
| 21:37 | p_l | amalloy: thanks |
| 21:38 | johnmn3 | which function generates the datastructure, space.gui/button or space.action/asplode or space.gui/place-explosion? |
| 21:38 | johnmn3 | and how does it get passed around, I'm confused. |
| 21:39 | amalloy | my suggestion was asplode, probably |
| 21:39 | johnmn3 | Do you mean, like send the state into the space.action function and have it return the modified state to the main namespace? |
| 21:40 | amalloy | button calls asplode, looks at the data structure returned, and makes gui changes if necessary |
| 21:40 | johnmn3 | so that space.action doesn't have to call into our main namespace? |
| 21:40 | johnmn3 | right |
| 21:40 | amalloy | eg, asplode returns {:place-explosion ...} |
| 21:41 | johnmn3 | I just can't send the swing gui into the action function and have it return a modified gui. right, I'd have to use a safe datastructure |
| 21:41 | qbg | Alternatively, if in MVC you have the controller depend on the model and the view (with the model and view not depending on each other), there is no circularity |
| 21:41 | johnmn3 | qbg: that's actually what I'm trying to do |
| 21:42 | johnmn3 | I have three namespaces and the control functions sit between them. However, how can I let buttons in the view call functions in the control namespace? |
| 21:43 | qbg | The controller registers callbacks in the view |
| 21:44 | qbg | The dependency on the controller that the view has is injected by the controller |
| 21:44 | johnmn3 | so I'm using seesaw. |
| 21:44 | johnmn3 | and normally youd do: (button :action (action :handler #(stuff... |
| 21:45 | johnmn3 | how do you do call backs in swing? |
| 21:45 | qbg | .addEventListener |
| 21:45 | johnmn3 | ah |
| 21:46 | johnmn3 | oooh k |
| 21:46 | qbg | You should be able to indirect the action through an atom containing command -> fn mappings |
| 21:46 | qbg | (if you don't want to drop down to straight swing) |
| 21:47 | johnmn3 | just founed seesaw.core/listen |
| 21:47 | johnmn3 | found |
| 21:48 | qbg | I've never used seesaw, so I can't give the best advice on that end |
| 21:48 | johnmn3 | so I think you solved my riddle |
| 21:48 | johnmn3 | 'listen is the ticket, I think |
| 21:51 | gtuckerkellogg | i know it's short already, but is there a better alternative to (partition 2 (interleave l1 l2))? |
| 21:51 | qbg | &(map vector (range 0 10) (range 10 20)) |
| 21:51 | lazybot | ⇒ ([0 10] [1 11] [2 12] [3 13] [4 14] [5 15] [6 16] [7 17] [8 18] [9 19]) |
| 21:51 | qbg | Is that basically what you want? |
| 21:53 | qbg | Looks like it |
| 21:55 | TimMc | gtuckerkellogg: And if this is for a function f that consumes both... (map f l1 l2) |
| 21:59 | gtuckerkellogg | l2 is a list of sets, i want to filter out empty sets before stuffing them into a hash-map |
| 22:00 | gtuckerkellogg | what i have now is (into {} (filter not-empty (partition 2 (interleave l1 l2))) |
| 22:00 | gtuckerkellogg | where not-empty is (fn [[_ v]] (not= v #{})) |
| 22:00 | TimMc | &(doc filter) |
| 22:00 | lazybot | ⇒ "([pred coll]); Returns a lazy sequence of the items in coll for which (pred item) returns true. pred must be free of side-effects." |
| 22:01 | TimMc | Hmm, not multi-arity. |
| 22:01 | sjl | gtuckerkellogg: (comp seq second) instead of not-empty? |
| 22:02 | sjl | gtuckerkellogg: or I'd probably use remove instead of filter and use (comp empty? second) to be more clear |
| 22:02 | TimMc | Ooh, good call. |
| 22:02 | sjl | "remove elements where the second item is empty" |
| 22:02 | TimMc | Suddenly readable. |
| 22:03 | gtuckerkellogg | oh that's nice |
| 22:03 | gtuckerkellogg | or (comp empty? val), I suppose, since it's destined or a hashmap |
| 22:04 | sjl | &(val [:a :b]) |
| 22:04 | lazybot | java.lang.ClassCastException: clojure.lang.PersistentVector cannot be cast to java.util.Map$Entry |
| 22:04 | sjl | gtuckerkellogg: yeah, I don't think you can use val on a pair |
| 22:04 | gtuckerkellogg | :( |
| 22:07 | simard | I'd like to let power users use clojure as a scripting language for my app, but I need to make sure this code will be confined somehow in a part of the JVM where it has no access whatever to library functions or to memory outside what is allocated to it, for obvious reasons. Has anyone here done that before ? |
| 22:07 | mdeboard | simard: Yes, https://github.com/flatland/clojail |
| 22:07 | sjl | simard: sounds like you're looking for https://github.com/flatland/clojail |
| 22:07 | simard | I love this place :D |
| 22:08 | mdeboard | I love WINNING |
| 22:08 | simard | so, let me ask the phony question, is that quite safe ? |
| 22:09 | simard | as long as policy is properly defined, that is |
| 22:09 | amalloy | i wonder what makes that a phony question? you're not actually asking it, or you don't actually want an answer, or only phony people would ask it, or... |
| 22:09 | sjl | &(str "I hope so") |
| 22:09 | lazybot | ⇒ "I hope so" |
| 22:10 | mdeboard | Maybe simard's first language isn't English, and he meant a word that translates roughly to "phony" in English but could also mean "obvious" |
| 22:11 | simard | mdeboard: that sounds correct :) |
| 22:11 | simard | I guess I'll have to look up for that word again. |
| 22:11 | mdeboard | voila |
| 22:12 | RickInGA | simard here is a lecture about it from clojure conj 2011 http://blip.tv/clojure/anthony-grimes-clojail-life-in-the-clojure-prison-5919720 |
| 22:15 | TimMc | $mail samaaron <3 <3 <3 |
| 22:15 | lazybot | Message saved. |
| 22:15 | TimMc | I have a new toy: (demo 30 (pan2 (apply + (sin-osc [(mouse-y:kr 50 500) (mouse-x:kr 50 500)])))) |
| 22:15 | simard | RickInGA: thanks, I'll definitely spend 45 minutes on this, and I'll remember to not think that JScheme could have been a proper choice for this. |
| 22:21 | sjl | is there a ceil function hiding somewhere in 1.3+'s core? |
| 22:22 | TimMc | &(Math/ceil 4.5) |
| 22:22 | lazybot | ⇒ 5.0 |
| 22:22 | sjl | &(Math/ceil (/ 2 3)) |
| 22:22 | lazybot | ⇒ 1.0 |
| 22:22 | sjl | perfect, thanks |
| 22:30 | ibdknox | sjl: you pinged? |
| 22:30 | RickInGA | if I install lein-newnew does lein new stop working? |
| 22:30 | ibdknox | RickInGA: all the functionality of the original new should still be there :) |
| 22:31 | sjl | ibdknox: yeah, I'm trying to do something like this in Korma: (-> some-query (apply or [{:name [like "foo"]} {:username [like "foo"]}])) |
| 22:31 | sjl | ibdknox: basically building an or clause at runtime instead of hardcoding it in |
| 22:32 | ibdknox | sjl: let me verify but that should be fine as long as you call pred-or instead of or |
| 22:32 | sjl | ibdknox: is that possible? |
| 22:33 | sjl | ibdknox: Hmm, I tried it with pred-or but it didn't work either. |
| 22:33 | ibdknox | well, you'd need to quote like |
| 22:34 | ibdknox | what was the error you got? |
| 22:34 | RickInGA | ibdknox lein nor new <proj> is working for me, but lein new <proj> is not. is there a template I need to specify for a 'normal' clojure project? |
| 22:34 | sjl | hmm, I don't remember, let me find it again |
| 22:35 | ibdknox | sjl: this worked for me: (sql-only (select :blah (where (apply fns/pred-or [{:name "cool"} {:cool "woot"}])))) |
| 22:35 | pandeiro | i want to slurp a binary file from a url and save it to disk, do i need java for that? |
| 22:35 | ibdknox | RickInGA: hm, no that should just work :( |
| 22:35 | sjl | ibdknox: well first it can't find the like symbol |
| 22:36 | ibdknox | yeah it doesn't exist |
| 22:36 | ibdknox | though it you put it in the where |
| 22:36 | ibdknox | it should be ok |
| 22:36 | RickInGA | ibdknox I deleted newnew from plugins and then lein new <proj> worked…. |
| 22:36 | RickInGA | ibdknox must be something in my configuration that is causing a confligct |
| 22:37 | ibdknox | RickInGA: hm :/ maybe we can take a look tomorrow, not sure I can necessarily fix it, but maybe |
| 22:37 | ibdknox | sjl: I think you just need to wrap the where around there actually |
| 22:38 | ibdknox | you can still use or |
| 22:38 | ibdknox | though if those maps come from outside of the where clause |
| 22:38 | ibdknox | you'll need to quote the like |
| 22:38 | simard | amalloy: how do you advise I use clojail, in a different process and/or thread from my main application ? I want as much security as I can get from it, and I don't care about restarting it if it gets screwed up. |
| 22:38 | ibdknox | sjl: {:name ['like "woot"]} |
| 22:39 | amalloy | running it in a separate jvm process would be best, and if you figure out how to do that please make it a library and let us know :P |
| 22:39 | RickInGA | ibdknox the good news is, I can reproduce it! I just reinstalled newnew and I am crashing again :) |
| 22:39 | tomoj | I thought this should work: (io/copy (io/input-stream url) (io/output-stream filepath)) |
| 22:39 | tomoj | but it seems to not copy the whole thing? |
| 22:39 | tomoj | e.g. (io/copy (io/input-stream "http://www.google.com/logos/2012/yoshizawa12-hp.jpg") (io/output-stream "/tmp/doodle.jpg")) |
| 22:39 | ibdknox | RickInGA: hah, at least it's consistent ;) |
| 22:39 | tomoj | where io is clojure.java.io |
| 22:39 | simard | amalloy: I guess process intercommunication might be a bit of a problem right .. :) |
| 22:40 | amalloy | seriously though, don't use clojail to monitor artificial hearts or anything. it will break |
| 22:41 | simard | no, it's for a game, but code typed by the user might run on the server, so I don't want to create a backdoor with that. |
| 22:41 | RickInGA | i doublt clojure will break as many hearts and perl has! |
| 22:43 | amalloy | the main issue is that we don't have reliable ways to cordon off memory usage or thread usage |
| 22:43 | tomoj | simard: you might look into running inside lxc |
| 22:43 | tomoj | seems like you could even allow filesystem access etc there |
| 22:44 | pandeiro | tomoj: thanks it's as easy as (spit f (slurp url)), apparently |
| 22:44 | tomoj | pandeiro: really? |
| 22:44 | tomoj | don't think that should work on some binary files |
| 22:45 | pandeiro | tomoj: i haven't tested the files yet but they were written at least |
| 22:45 | sjl | ibdknox: ok, cool, I think I got it working now |
| 22:45 | sjl | ibdknox: I don't suppose there's a way to do this that's not relying on fragile internal stuff? |
| 22:46 | ibdknox | sjl: it doesn't rely on any internal stuff |
| 22:46 | ibdknox | this totally works: |
| 22:46 | ibdknox | sjl: (sql-only (select :blah (where (apply or [{:name [like "cool"]} {:cool "woot"}])))) |
| 22:46 | sjl | ibdknox: (use [korma.internal.sql :only (pred-or)]) |
| 22:46 | ibdknox | you don't have to use that |
| 22:46 | ibdknox | :) |
| 22:47 | simard | tomoj: interesting, but that's Linux only I presume |
| 22:47 | ibdknox | also you should use 0.3.0-beta5 |
| 22:47 | sjl | ibdknox: ah, I used what the README told me to use. |
| 22:48 | ibdknox | yeah, I'll update all of those soon. 0.3.0 is stable |
| 22:48 | ibdknox | just general improvements happening here or there |
| 22:48 | metajack | any idea how to track this compile exception down? the code works fine used from the repl, but fails with doing lein compile: https://gist.github.com/b9f0e8f9b36cef6bfe3e |
| 22:49 | ibdknox | metajack: you're calling (:use ..) on geohash.core |
| 22:49 | metajack | ibdknox: I'd also appreciate a new release. It took me a little while to realize that stuff was pretty different in the non-beta version :) |
| 22:50 | ibdknox | unfortunately I'm of little time as of late |
| 22:50 | metajack | ibdknox: It's pulled in via require actually |
| 22:50 | metajack | why would that cause a NullPointerException on compile though? |
| 22:51 | ibdknox | metajack: what is this: guzzle.utils.index_all_tickets |
| 22:52 | metajack | it's a namespace with :gen-class and a single function -main. it pulls in a few things and does a small job |
| 22:53 | metajack | lein has :aot [guzzle.daemon guzzle.utils.index_all_tickets] |
| 22:54 | metajack | if i take out gen-class the code works fine, but for some reason it doesn't want to compile. i swear i've done exactly this several times before and never had a problem. |
| 22:56 | amalloy | a namespace with underscores in its name sounds extremely dangerous |
| 22:56 | metajack | sorry, it's dashes |
| 22:56 | simard | amalloy: a basic question, when using clojail, does the jvm security policy need to be applied to the whole application, or just to the part that is running clojail ? |
| 22:56 | metajack | i typoed that line |
| 22:57 | metajack | the source file has underscores, but the ns is dashes. this is the correct way i believe |
| 22:58 | amalloy | just the clojail part; clojail takes care of moving into and out of the protected mode |
| 22:59 | simard | amalloy: good, because in my client/server setup, I decided I would use clojail only on the client side, not on the server side, therefore if the JVM crashes or whatever bad happens to the client does not affect the server, as long as I do my job properly in designing the protocol between the client and the server |
| 23:02 | tomoj | simard: right.. |
| 23:02 | tomoj | I was thinking server side |
| 23:02 | tomoj | why use clojail client side? |
| 23:03 | simard | tomoj: I initially asked for the server side, so you were right about that |
| 23:03 | daaku | i'm trying to write a macro that emits numerous deftest forms, and looks like the output i'm getting is a list of lists like ((deftest foo ..) (deftest bar ..)) -- i'm not sure what's the most appropriate way to fix it. more info here: https://gist.github.com/5aab7cd49761b27e1c39 |
| 23:03 | simard | I changed my mind midway .. :) |
| 23:04 | simard | tomoj: because the scripts the user will right will only run while the user is online, according to the new gameplay redesigned 5 minutes ago .. :) |
| 23:04 | simard | right = write |
| 23:05 | aperiodic | well, as long as you're designing a protocol between the client and the server for this scripting, you can just enforce everything in the protocol |
| 23:06 | simard | exactly |
| 23:06 | simard | security is on server side anyway, commands sent by the client to the server are authorized or rejected by the server before being translated to predefined function calls. |
| 23:06 | aperiodic | so what's the point of using clojail, then? |
| 23:08 | simard | the initial idea was to run that code server side, but not anymore. the remaining reason is that, well, I might have said power users but I really meant gamers, so using clojail is a good way to safeguard their code to avoid client crash |
| 23:08 | simard | I want to build a DSL above clojure to help them script the game |
| 23:08 | simard | but I don't want them to run into trouble too often |
| 23:09 | simard | now that absolute security is not really needed, clojail sounds fine for the job. |
| 23:09 | simard | aperiodic: does that make sense ? |
| 23:10 | aperiodic | ah, right, clojail lets you set execution time ceilings |
| 23:11 | metajack | fyi, fixing the refer-clojure issue for geohash made the compile succeed. It seems it's not really a warning at all :) |
| 23:12 | RickInGA | this core.logic primer is fantastic! bit.ly/ymYvrd |
| 23:27 | amalloy | daaku: (cons `do (...)) |
| 23:46 | srid | has anyone written a clojure wrapper for the evernote api? |
| 23:48 | daaku | amalloy: ah! that worked. makes a lot of sense now that i think about it. |
![http://www.google.com/logos/2012/yoshizawa12-hp.jpg")](http://www.google.com/logos/2012/yoshizawa12-hp.jpg")){kind=link}