#clojure – 2011-12-28

2011-12-28

01:06	quizme_	how do you select a subset of attributes from a sequence of hashes? {"id1" {:name "Bob" :age 21 :favorite-icecream "vanilla" } "id2" {:name "Fred" :age 22 :favorite-icecream "chocolate" } …..} I only want a sequence with :name and :age, but not :favorite-icecream.
01:07	quizme_	can you do that with restructuring?
01:07	quizme_	i mean destructuring
01:08	quizme_	i want the result to look like {"id1" {:name "Bob" :age 21} "id2" {:name "Fred" :age 22}}
02:03	quizme_	http://pastie.org/3083295
02:32	clj_newb	how does reload-all and reload differ?
02:34	clj_newb	how does reload-all and reload differ?
03:03	gf3	is there an idiomatic naming scheme for conversion functions? e.g. `namespace-to-filename`
03:31	clj_newb	are the values java.awt.event.KeyEvent/VK_A -> java.awt.event.KeyEvent/VK_Z guaranteed to be consecutive?
03:33	CmdrDats	clj_newb: I wouldn't count on it, no
03:42	kral	morning
03:43	CmdrDats	good morning :)
03:49	sgronblo2	Anyone know of any video presentations for writing web apps in clojure? I've already seen the one on ring on blip.tv.
04:08	clj_newb	is there a way to get a list of all the files in clojure.core? I want to answer questions like: "what function will tell me if X is a substring of Y"
04:08	clj_newb	s/files/functions/
04:12	jakeskik	clj_newb: http://clojuredocs.org/quickref/Clojure%20Core
04:29	clj_newb	jakeskik: thanks
04:31	clj_newb	why does every? have a ?; but some does not have a ? ?
04:34	pyrtsa	some doesn't in general return true or false but the first truey item it finds.
04:35	clj_newb	pyrtsa: makes sense now; thanks!
05:31	clj_newb	when an assertion fails; waht is thrown/generated?
05:32	clj_newb	I'm writing my own assertion-like macro (the default asertion is not expressive enough, even w/ its msg argument); and I want it to generate the same runtime objects as asert does
06:42	CmdrDats	anybody know of a site that one can automatically upload your library code docs and samples to when you do a lein build (similar to clojars, but for documentation)?
06:52	clj_newb	is there a builtin for converting lists/vectors into maps?
06:52	clj_newb	inquiring minds want to know :-)
06:56	CmdrDats	if your vector is in the format [key value key value] , you can just (apply hash-map myvector)
06:57	clj_newb	whoa
06:57	clj_newb	cool
06:58	clj_newb	dumb question: what if it's in the form of [ [k1 v1] [k2 v2] [k3 v3] ... ] ?
07:00	CmdrDats	##(apply merge [[:k1 1] [:k2 2]])
07:00	lazybot	⇒ [:k1 1 [:k2 2]]
07:00	CmdrDats	hmm, no
07:01	clj_newb	i want somethign liek flatten
07:01	clj_newb	but only 1 level
07:01	CmdrDats	##(apply hash-map (flatten [[:k1 1] [:k2 2]]))
07:01	lazybot	⇒ {:k1 1, :k2 2}
07:01	clj_newb	##(flatten [ [ [ 1 2] 3 ] ])
07:01	lazybot	⇒ (1 2 3)
07:01	clj_newb	this is bad, as I do have nested vectors
07:01	CmdrDats	ah
07:03	CmdrDats	##(apply into {} [[:k1 1] [:k2 2]])
07:03	lazybot	clojure.lang.ArityException: Wrong number of args (3) passed to: core$into
07:04	CmdrDats	##(into {} [[:k1 1] [:k2 2]])
07:04	lazybot	⇒ {:k1 1, :k2 2}
07:04	CmdrDats	that works :P
07:04	CmdrDats	##(into {} [[:k1 [:epic :vector]] [:k2 "simple"]])
07:04	lazybot	⇒ {:k1 [:epic :vector], :k2 "simple"}
07:05	CmdrDats	(i always forget about into for some reason)
07:08	clj_newb	##(doc into)
07:08	lazybot	⇒ "([to from]); Returns a new coll consisting of to-coll with all of the items of from-coll conjoined."
07:08	clj_newb	brilliant; thanks!
07:13	CmdrDats	cool :) anytime
07:19	Somelauw	Is there ever any difference between merge and conj? They seem to behave exactly the same.
07:21	cemerick	Somelauw: For maps, no, but I'd classify that as an implementation detail you shouldn't rely upon.
07:22	Somelauw	When should I favor merge over conj?
07:29	cemerick	Somelauw: per the docs of `merge`, it should be used when combining maps.
07:36	Somelauw	So conj shouldn't be used when combining maps? Or should conj only be used when adding a single pair of key value.
07:46	zawzey	Hi, trying to download with clojurescript. but having lots of problems trying to get the sample code to run
07:48	zawzey	https://gist.github.com/1527832
07:49	cemerick	Somelauw: IMO, no, conj should only be used to add an entry to a map; the fact that it merges maps as well is likely vestigial.
07:49	cemerick	http://groups.google.com/group/clojure/browse_frm/thread/e499d7d184aba772
08:19	Somelauw	thanks
09:27	fbru02	Hi all, this must be a stupid question : if I have a closure over a function "foo" let's say (def bar (foo 2)) : is there a way having the var #'bar to get '(foo 2)
09:28	fbru02	?
09:29	CmdrDats	fbru02: I doubt there is a way to do that as (foo 2) would get evaluated when you (def bar …)?
09:30	CmdrDats	you could (def bar `(foo 2)) and then you can get the actual closure function via (eval bar) maybe?
09:32	fbru02	CmdrDats: you a right , i think it gets evaluated right away to a IFn obj
09:34	CmdrDats	fbru02: ye, a bit difficult to reverse engineer from there :P (except maybe with some macro/metadata kung-fu)
09:35	fbru02	CmdrDats: yeah meaybe i put it in the metadata :) thanks ! :)
09:35	CmdrDats	fbru02: cool, glad i could help
10:17	TimMc	fbru02_: You could write a macro to do that.
10:18	fbru02_	TimMc: can't think how now :/
10:19	TimMc	Instead of def, you would use your macro.
10:20	TimMc	I believe serializable-fn does exactly this, check it out.
10:21	fbru02_	TimMc: thanks will look into that :)
10:31	clj_newb	is there a clojure builtin to read all files in the current directory?
10:32	clj_newb	so it would return me a []
10:32	clj_newb	where for files, it stores a string, and for directories, it stores some object that I can recursively read
10:33	clj_newb	http://rosettacode.org/wiki/Walk_a_directory/Recursively#Clojure
10:33	clj_newb	victory
10:39	stuartsierra	clj_newb: file-seq is what you want
10:40	stuartsierra	maybe
10:49	TimMc	clj_newb: slurp
10:53	miggyx	Hi guys, can anyone recommend a book on Clojure? I have some Amazon gift vouchers to use up and I want to make them count :)
10:55	antares_	miggyx: the joy of clojure is my personal favorite but it is not for complete beginners. Clojure Programming from O'Reilly (not in print yet, AFAIK) and Practical Clojure are also good.
10:55	antares_	miggyx: Programming Clojure 1st edition from PragProg is pretty outdated, 2nd edition I haven't read yet
10:55	miggyx	antares_: by complete beginners, do you mean to functional programming in general or specifically clojure?
10:56	antares_	miggyx: a little bit of both :) if you are well versed in multiple different languages, then you probably should go with The Joy of Clojure
10:56	miggyx	antares_: sounds like a plan - thanks :)
11:03	miggyx	antares_: order placed :)
11:05	antares_	miggyx: I hope you enjoy it :)
11:06	miggyx	antares_: me too - always keen to stretch the mind :)
11:14	tscheibl	was sinf WMS, LCNS und MOPS?
11:14	tscheibl	oops sorry... wrong window
11:57	ambrosebs	what does with-loading-context do, and why is it necessary to wrap the body of each `ns` form with it?
12:07	ambrosebs	I see it has something to do with classloaders, but whats the diff between (with-loading-context (require ...)) and (require ....)
12:27	clj_newb	is ther esime java lib I can import; which will give me one of those "choose a file: dialogs" that can navigagte the file system (and return to clojure the filename)
12:28	clj_newb	Is there some java lib I can import which will give me one of those "choose a file: dialogs" that can navigagte the file system (and return to clojure the filename that the user has chosen)? Thanks!
12:29	ldh	clj_newb: I've used seesaw (https://github.com/daveray/seesaw) to do Swing stuff from Clojure
12:33	clj_newb	seesaw provides this?
12:33	clj_newb	i've just been using java interop via proxy
12:34	dabd_	The following code that uses http-agent https://gist.github.com/1528807 is not working. Could it be because of the shutdown-agents being called out of place? Why is the println in the handler function not showing anything in the console? thx
12:35	ldh	clj_newb: IIRC, seesaw provides a more clojure-y way to do the regular Swing stuff
12:45	tmciver	dabd_: It looks like file in your let binding is just a String; you're trying to call a java.io.File method (getCanonicalPath) on that String.
12:46	clj_newb	suppose I need to do real time java
12:46	clj_newb	i.e. have a timer ticking down to be accurate to teh seconds
12:46	clj_newb	what options do I need to pass to the jvm?
12:49	dabd_	tmciver: I also tried with File. but it does not work either
12:52	tmciver	dabd_: I'm not familiar with http.agent but I'm wondering if you have access to 'url' in your handler function.
12:53	tmciver	dabd_: I suspect you may be able to get the uri through the agent that is passed in to your handler function.
14:22	amalloy	anyone have an opinion about writing (concat foo [bar]) vs `(~@foo ~bar) to add something to the end of a sequence?
14:24	duck1123	wouldn't it be less runtime for the latter?
14:24	duck1123	not that it's going to make a whole lot of difference
14:26	Raynes	amalloy: I wouldn't beat you with a 2x4 if you did the former while I would if you did the latter.
14:27	amalloy	duck1123: no, they're the same
14:27	amalloy	&'`(~@foo ~bar)
14:27	lazybot	⇒ (clojure.core/seq (clojure.core/concat foo (clojure.core/list bar)))
14:27	Raynes	Except one of them looks like perljure.
14:28	duck1123	I would probably use the former if faced with that situation
14:36	TimMc	amalloy: Define snoc and no one will complain.
14:39	amalloy	ugh, snoc. that name always sounds insufferably "clever" to me
14:39	TimMc	How about (tacnoc [bar] foo)?
14:40	TimMc	It doesn't have to be called snoc. How about append?
14:40	TimMc	Heck, you could even take multiple seqs, and call it concat.
14:41	TimMc	s/seqs/colls/
15:55	wingie	would you write a game with a functional programming style?
15:55	wingie	or is it better with oop?
15:55	TimMc	Sure, why not?
15:56	wingie	since we have objects like soldier, weapon, grenade, tank etc isn't oop more suitable and fits the mind/game?
15:56	TimMc	wingie: How is this not an object? {:type :character, :subtype :NPE, :health 30, :healthmax 100}
15:57	TimMc	s/NPE/NPC/
15:58	amalloy	wingie: since you have functions like "shoot", "eat", "travel", isn't fp more suitable?
15:58	wingie	amalloy: could have those as methods too
15:58	amalloy	obviously. my point is that you've framed the question in a way that assumes a particular answer, but it's easy to frame it differently
15:58	wingie	TimMc: won't we need inheritance for a game? eg. Corprol extends Soldier
15:59	wingie	Corpral
15:59	TimMc	wingie: Multimethods.
15:59	amalloy	Corporal
15:59	wingie	:)
15:59	wingie	why didn't i choose Lieutenant instead
15:59	amalloy	heh. i'd probably spell that one wrong. those big messes of vowels are confusing. bureau, really?
16:00	wingie	:)
16:00	wingie	english. hah!
16:00	wingie	are you guys using ClojureScript?
16:00	wingie	for writing frontend apps
16:01	amalloy	anyway, you're saying "i will need all these oop techniques to build a game", which is true if and only if you choose to do it in an oop language. it's not clear what you hope to get from asking your question
16:01	TimMc	wingie: So, I think the question you were trying to ask is: Does a game require lots of mutation?
16:01	wingie	amalloy: just wanted to know if it would fit one's mind using a FP lang to code a game
16:01	wingie	since OOP was kinda targeting systems like that
16:02	wingie	or if OOP would be a better choice in some areas, and FP in others
16:02	wingie	TimMc: by mutation you mean state changes?
16:03	amalloy	heh. you definitely need mutation if you're playing zerg, am i right?
16:04	wingie	yeah
16:04	wingie	how did you know im playing Starcraft =)
16:04	wingie	and Zerg
16:07	guns	I am trying to run Marginalia over Noir, and I get this error: "Map literal must contain an even number of forms" The stack trace:
16:07	guns	https://gist.github.com/1529739
16:07	guns	How do I go about debugging this?
16:08	TimMc	guns: Can you generate docs for just one file at a time?
16:08	guns	TimMc: You can pass paths to Marginalia?
16:08	guns	okay I will try
16:08	TimMc	guns: dunno
16:09	gf3	is there an idiomatic naming scheme for conversion functions? e.g. `namespace-to-filename`, etc...
16:09	TimMc	I've used foo->bar occasionally.
16:10	gf3	TimMc: good call, thank you
16:22	mcrittenden	given a 3x3 multi-dimensional vector, I need to figure out if ANY of the values are numbers and return true if so, otherwise false. any hints on the best way to do this?
16:24	TimMc	&(some number? (apply concat (apply concat '[[[a b] [c]] [[d]]])))
16:24	lazybot	⇒ nil
16:24	TimMc	&(some number? (apply concat (apply concat '[[[a b] [9]] [[d]]])))
16:24	lazybot	⇒ true
16:25	TimMc	mcrittenden: Wait, is it 3-dimensional, or n-dimensional but always 3 on a side?
16:25	wingie	can't it be said that functional programming and oop is different abstraction layers .. fp is low level (micro) and oop is an higher abstraction (macro). oop is using fp in the same way objects in this world is bound by the law of nature. so its just a matter of what level you wanna work on? And a stateful object (human) is not a function that runs and exits .. but runs and never exits (til its
16:25	wingie	destroyed) why it never leaves its state and thus is stateful. Thoughts?
16:26	mcrittenden	TimMc it will always be [[val val val][val val val][val val val]]
16:26	TimMc	mcrittenden: Yeah, then the code above will work.
16:26	amalloy	(first (for [xs matrix, x xs, :when (number? x)] x))
16:26	amalloy	finds you the first number, as a bonus
16:27	mcrittenden	is one preferred over the other? amalloy TimMc
16:28	amalloy	i think most people prefer TimMc to amalloy. as for the code, write whatever you like
16:28	TimMc	haha
16:28	mcrittenden	haha
16:28	mcrittenden	thanks a ton guys
16:28	Raynes	I don't always talk to programmers, but when I do, I prefer amalloy.
16:28	TimMc	mcrittenden: I like amalloy's solution better, for the record -- but maybe with better binding names.
16:28	Raynes	Keep hacking my friends.
16:28	amalloy	tbh though i hate the apply concat, personally. i'd write either that for, or possibly (some #(some number? %) matrix)
16:30	mdeboard	TimMc: lol
16:30	mdeboard	Keep drinking my beer.
16:33	TimMc	wingie: oop and fp are at the same level -- they're just different ways of modeling process and state.
16:33	TimMc	wingie: and they're not incompatible, either
16:41	wingie	TimMc: if everything is pure functions without side effects, how can a "person" be stateful?
16:42	hroarke	wingie: Imagine a top-level game loop function like (defn update-world [timestamp world input] ...) that returns a new world.
16:42	hroarke	update-world can be pure, and you're still updating state.
16:43	TimMc	wingie: Why do you think there's any relationship between computers and the real world?
16:44	wingie	TimMc: since FP reminds me about math so Im trying to figure it all out
16:45	Raynes	(defn make-blue [person color] (assoc-in person [:hair :color] "blue"))
16:46	licenser	Raynes: that is wrong: (defn make-blue [person] (update-in person [:blood-alcohol] inc)) ^^
16:46	wingie	could someone write that in javascript =)
16:47	licenser	it is in javascript :P with cljs
16:48	wingie	do we have a compiler bot? =)
16:48	Raynes	&(+ 3 3)
16:48	lazybot	⇒ 6
16:48	Raynes	We have two, actually.
16:48	Raynes	,(+ 3 3)
16:49	clojurebot	6
16:49	licenser	Rthat was your cue,
16:49	licenser	mono he means something like ,(cljs '(+ 3 3)) -> 3+3
16:49	TimMc	wingie: There's no bot here to compile CLJS , no.
16:50	Raynes	I assumed he wasn't talking about cljs.
16:50	licenser	I wonder why is the cljs compiler so unbelievable slow?
16:51	TimMc	wingie: And I'm working on a try-cljs with some other folks, but it is kind of broken-ish.
16:51	Raynes	Yeah, it uses hiccup! It can't possibly work with hiccup.
16:51	wingie	TimMc: yeah .. didn't get the impression it was solid
16:51	Raynes	~guards
16:51	clojurebot	SEIZE HIM!
16:51	TimMc	wingie: I should really put up a warning on that page.
16:53	hroarke	So, core.logic is pretty close to magic.
16:53	hroarke	But, a little under-documented...
16:54	hroarke	Is there any way to stream out relations and their facts, so I can save them persistently?
16:54	amalloy	licenser: it has to compile all of clojure.core twice in order to decide (+ 1 1) is 1+1, which i assume causes most of the dealy
16:55	TimMc	(+ 1 2) is instantaneous on my craptop.
16:55	clojurebot	3
16:55	TimMc	Thanks, clojurebot.
16:56	licenser	amalloy: oi why twice/
16:57	amalloy	once to get the compiler itself going (since it's written in clojure), and then again to compile the cljs you gave it
16:57	amalloy	(i realize it doesn't have to do the first step if you have a persistent compiler up)
16:57	amalloy	(or even the second, probably)
16:58	emezeske	yeah, the only way to go with cljs is a persistent compiler
16:58	emezeske	I have one that watches my cljs dir for changes, and it rebuilds everything in a fraction of a second
16:59	licenser	^^ I see
16:59	licenser	emezeske: cljs-watch?
16:59	emezeske	licenser: nah, I rolled my own for some reason
17:00	licenser	^^
17:00	licenser	is it better? :P
17:01	emezeske	yeah, I think maybe
17:01	licenser	is it on github (or alternatives)? ^^
17:01	emezeske	not yet.. I guess if you want to see it I could throw it up there real quick without any packaging
17:01	clojurebot	Huh?
17:02	licenser	emezeske: well if it is better then cljs-watch I'd love to see it since I am using clojurescript on one of my projects ^^ that is if you won't mind - I guess others might like that too
17:03	TimMc	I'm curious how deep you had to go into the layers of the compiler to do that.
17:03	emezeske	licenser: gimme a few, I'll put a rough copy on github. I'm not sure if it's better than cljs-watch, but maybe you can tell me!
17:04	licenser	emezeske: take all the time you need I really appreciate it :)
17:05	emezeske	licenser: I actually have a bunch of cljs I want to put up eventually. I have a framework for sharing code between clj and cljs
17:05	licenser	neat
17:05	licenser	so I don't use clojure on the server side so I won't end up using that right away ^^
17:06	emezeske	ah, yeah, interesting
17:07	licenser	so cljs+json works great as a client only thing
17:07	emezeske	yeah I was doing that for a while, was nice
17:07	emezeske	I do use clj on the server side though, so I switched to just shuffling clojure expressions back and forth :)
17:09	licenser	emezeske: nods that is nice too ^^
17:15	darrint	I'm having trouble figuring out the state of the art for handling errors. I did (assert (= 200 statusCode)) which bails but doesn't show me what the code actually was. Any guidance?
17:15	darrint	I'd like to pack more info into my exception if I fail.
17:16	TimMc	&(doc assert)
17:16	lazybot	⇒ "Macro ([x] [x message]); Evaluates expr and throws an exception if it does not evaluate to logical true."
17:16	TimMc	You could have a message that includes the info.
17:18	darrint	oh kay. I'm an an idiot. Thanks TimMc.
17:21	amalloy	TimMc: you should go into neurosurgery. irate patients: "I'm an idiot now. Thanks, TimMc.
17:25	emezeske	licenser: super-ultra-rough version up at https://github.com/emezeske/cljs-autobuild
17:26	emezeske	licenser: I'm sure it's broken; I ripped it out of my private repo
17:26	licenser	emezeske: thanks :) I'll have a look at it :)
17:27	TimMc	emezeske: I see clojure.contrib in there...
17:27	TimMc	Is that the 1.3-compat version?
17:28	emezeske	I'm not actually sure how that works in my project. I think I don't explicitly depend on it, and some other dep I pull in does...
17:29	emezeske	The project.clj is probably very wrong, I just sort of tacked it in there
17:34	licenser	emezeske: it crashes with 'Could not locate clojure/contrib/command_line__init.class or clojure/contrib/command_line.clj'
17:35	emezeske	hmm, I guess it needs to depend on some clojure.contrib jar
17:36	licenser	clojure.tools.cli is supposed to replace c.c.command_line
17:36	emezeske	ahh
17:37	emezeske	so maybe add [org.clojure/tools.cli "0.2.1"] to the :dependencies?
17:37	licenser	probably will need to change some code to :use it instead of c.c
17:38	Raynes	tools.cli has an entirely different API.
17:38	Raynes	It isn't a drop-in replacement.
17:38	TimMc	emezeske: I guess the parts of contrib you are using are 1.3 compatible.
17:39	licenser	sneaky sneaky
17:39	emezeske	Raynes: is tools.cli meant to fully replace contrib.command-line?
17:39	Raynes	Yes.
17:39	emezeske	Hmm, guess I should port it then
17:41	licenser	looking at it it does not look too complicated
17:46	emezeske	yeah, should just take a few
17:53	emezeske	licenser: I changed it to use the new cli
17:57	licenser	emezeske: looks good :)
17:58	emezeske	licenser: thanks for testing it!
17:58	emezeske	now that it's up, I think I might add some features
17:58	emezeske	like an option to find *.cljs files automatically
17:58	licenser	emezeske: thanks for setting it up :) now I'm trying out if it actually compiles stuff :P
17:59	emezeske	awesome
17:59	licenser	not bad it seems to compile now lets see if the output makes sense
18:00	licenser	lets see lets see :)
18:00	emezeske	gogo!
18:01	licenser	lets fire up the erlang server ^^
18:01	gf3	if anyone has a moment to help me out, I'm having an issue using the second argument in clojail's sandbox function to pass in some bindings
18:01	emezeske	whoa, you are erlang on the backend?
18:02	licenser	emezeske: yap :)
18:02	gf3	whenever I try to bind #'doc I get the following error "Unable to resolve var: doc in this context"
18:02	emezeske	licenser: now that's a unique stack :P
18:02	licenser	emezeske: it is a quite excellent one ^^
18:02	amalloy	gf3: does #'doc work in isolation?
18:02	licenser	they are a good fit in my eyes
18:02	emezeske	I can believe it
18:03	gf3	amalloy: in the context of the sandbox or the runner?
18:03	amalloy	i'd guess the runner
18:03	gf3	amalloy: no
18:03	amalloy	well then
18:03	gf3	amalloy: actually, in neither
18:03	Raynes	What are you trying to do, precisely?
18:04	amalloy	he just needs to get his namespace forms right. doc in in clojure.repl
18:04	gf3	Raynes: I just want to use a different `doc` in the sandbox for prettier output
18:04	licenser	emezeske: if you ever want to sneak a peak it's up on gitup
18:04	licenser	hub
18:04	Raynes	Probably don't need to rebind doc.
18:04	gf3	Raynes / amalloy: I wrote a macro to clean up the standard doc output
18:04	Raynes	It doesn't exist at all in clojure.core in 1.3.
18:04	Raynes	So, you can just pass your code in the :init option.
18:05	emezeske	licenser: yeah, link it! I'm curious
18:06	licenser	emezeske https://github.com/Licenser/erlpic
18:06	Raynes	gf3: https://github.com/flatland/lazybot/blob/develop/src/lazybot/plugins/clojure.clj#L36
18:06	gf3	Raynes: hmm, let me try that again, thank you
18:07	licenser	and emezeske it compiles like a charm :)
18:07	emezeske	licenser: that's great.
18:08	licenser	I agree ^^ thanks mate
18:08	Raynes	gf3: I'm also curious as to what you're using clojail for. :>
18:08	Raynes	Always fun to hear what people are doing with it.
18:09	gf3	Raynes: amazing, thank you, I'm not sure why I didn't try that initially since I was using :init to (use) other libs
18:09	gf3	Raynes: I'm sure for the same reason everyone else uses clojail, IRC bots
18:09	licenser	emezeske: if you look at the erlang stuff, feel free to poke me, it is horribly (mostly not at all) documented and a rather complex system ^^ but I'll glady explain things
18:09	Raynes	Haha.
18:09	licenser	gf3: there is also try-clojure :P
18:09	Raynes	Well, I did use it for tryclj.
18:10	emezeske	licenser: got a link that explains what EPIC is?
18:10	gf3	Raynes: I saw that, your source was actually very helpful to me
18:10	licenser	emezeske: not really no, the whole source material is not open sourced yet sadly but I probably should do that at some point. In short words it is a game engine for turn based combat
18:11	gf3	actually, Raynes, since I have you here, what is the purpose of this? https://github.com/Raynes/tryclojure/blob/master/src/tryclojure/models/eval.clj#L27-28
18:12	licenser	EPIC is the part of the game that handles combat logic, including stuff like custom AI scripts and fun like that ^^
18:12	Raynes	gf3: It is an extra precaution against keeping defs from residing in memory.
18:12	Raynes	I'm not sure it is actually necessary, but it doesn't hurt.
18:12	gf3	ahh neat, thanks
18:13	emezeske	licenser: sounds like a fun project!
18:13	licenser	emezeske: it is started it with a few friends like 4 years back, they all ditched out over time sadly but I hate giving up since I love the idea behind it :P
18:14	emezeske	:)
18:16	licenser	sadly I am stuck now at the GUI - and my gui-guy (I love the word) ditched me too but I hate guis so much :P
18:17	emezeske	bleh
18:18	licenser	emezeske: exactly, so I hope that cljs gets me around the tight spot there, since I am way more inclined to write clojure then javascript :P
18:21	emezeske	licenser: yeah, I hear that!
18:24	licenser	so I still struggle a lot with it, I rather set up a network of dedicated erlang servers then write a webpage :P
18:27	licenser	but one day, like 2020 I will have a game :P
18:28	emezeske	w00t!
18:29	licenser	so then likely all the technique will be outdated :P
18:29	emezeske	your game will just be retro
18:30	licenser	heh outdated not retro
18:38	gf3	hey Raynes, you know what would be cool, is if you could link to tryclj.com with some code pre-filled, a la coffeescript
18:39	gf3	http://jashkenas.github.com/coffee-script/#try:alert%20%22Hey%20there%2C%20Raynes!%22
18:40	licenser	emezeske: I'd have one request for your cljs-autobuild, show the time it used to build the file :)
18:40	emezeske	licenser: yeah, I want that too.
18:41	emezeske	licenser: I seem to remember running into some difficulty with that; maybe I'll revisit it
18:41	licenser	also a DWIM mode would be nice so I could write (ns evil.gui) (make-my-damn-gui)
18:43	emezeske	licenser: hmm, I'm not sure what you mean. just so you could compile via a REPL?
18:44	licenser	emezeske: DWIM is Do What I Mean, it is a joke mate :)
18:45	emezeske	hahaha
18:45	emezeske	I read "make" in (make-my-damn-gui) as "compile" :P
18:45	emezeske	as opposed to actually make :)
18:46	licenser	mono, I meant make as in do it for me :P
18:46	licenser	shoud slap a sudo in front of that perhaps
18:46	emezeske	haha
18:49	licenser	ponders perhaps winning in the lottery and can buy a gui-guy is a more realistic goal o.O
19:12	licenser	emezeske: thanks mate you just gave me the energy to tackle the thing again :P
19:12	gf3	hmm, I wonder why strings weren't made collections...
19:12	licenser	gf3: probably for performance reasons
19:13	emezeske	licenser: glad to hear it!
19:14	emezeske	licenser: just pushed my changes to print the time taken to compile
19:14	gf3	licenser: ahh, likely
19:14	tmciver	gf3: it can be ##(seq "Strings")
19:14	lazybot	⇒ (\S \t \r \i \n \g \s)
19:14	licenser	neat neat :D
19:14	gf3	tmciver: yes, they're seq-able, but they aren't collections
19:15	gf3	e.g.: ##(contains? "abc" "b")
19:15	lazybot	⇒ false
19:15	tmciver	gf3: curious, what do you need that you can't get with seq?
19:15	tmciver	ahh
19:15	gf3	tmciver: of course it's all possible, I just thought it'd be interesting to use the collection goodies
19:16	tmciver	gf3: Yes, I see.
19:19	amalloy	augh. that usage of contains? would be wrong with seqs too
19:20	gf3	also another cool feature could be strings as functions of their chars
19:20	gf3	actually, on that note, it seems inconsistent that vectors and hashmaps are functions of their members, but not lists
19:21	amalloy	it'd be cool if lots of things were functions, but it's never going to happen on the jvm. invoking functions needs to be fast, which means it needs to be a host-level thing like calling an interface method, which means you can't make built-in host objects support it
19:22	gf3	amalloy: do lists map to built-ins?
19:22	amalloy	no, that was a point about strings
19:22	gf3	ahh
19:22	amalloy	(and clojure chooses to use java.lang.String for strings, instead of inventing a clojure.lang.String, to make interop seamless. jruby has these sorts of features, but a lot more plumbing/busywork about mapping back and forth to real-java)
19:23	amalloy	if lists were functions of their indices, you would be tempted to use them in inefficient ways for no reason
19:24	tmciver	gf3: I too dumb to make this work in any case: ##(coll? (seq "abc"))
19:24	lazybot	⇒ true
19:24	tmciver	but ##(contains? (seq "abc") \a)
19:24	lazybot	⇒ false
19:25	tmciver	what's wrong?
19:25	amalloy	contains?
19:25	amalloy	clojurebot: contains?
19:25	clojurebot	No entiendo
19:26	amalloy	wth
19:26	amalloy	~contains?
19:26	clojurebot	It's greek to me.
19:26	amalloy	who deleted that factoid?
19:27	tmciver	contains? is greek to me too. ;)
19:27	amalloy	clojurebot: contains? \|is\| for checking whether a collection has a value for a given key. If you want to find out whether a value exists in a Collection (in linear time!), use clojure.core/some or the Java method .contains
19:27	clojurebot	Ik begrijp
19:27	gf3	ahh
19:28	tmciver	,(.contains "abc" "a")
19:28	clojurebot	true
19:29	tmciver	would that be an idiomatic approach then?
19:29	tmciver	using a character doesn't work: ##(.contains "abc" \a)
19:29	lazybot	java.lang.ClassCastException: java.lang.Character cannot be cast to java.lang.CharSequence
19:30	technomancy	there comes a time for every Clojure beginner when he thinks to himself "wait, vectors, maps, and sets are all functions... why aren't lists functions?" ... and then he realizes it doesn't make any sense
19:30	technomancy	regexes, on the other hand...!
19:32	amalloy	haha
19:32	amalloy	technomancy: also doesn't make sense, just for different reasons
19:33	technomancy	that's just, like, your opinion, man.
19:37	amalloy	technomancy: if i were a better man, i'd have a response cleverly crafted to sound like that Ocean Marketing guy
19:43	emezeske	I'd like to create a leiningen plugin that requires Clojure 1.3, which as I've read, is supported by lein 2.0. Does anyone know whether lein 2.0 is generally usable at this time?
19:44	technomancy	emezeske: it's a long way out
19:45	emezeske	technomancy: thanks!
19:45	technomancy	emezeske: there's a trick in doc/PLUGINS.md that explains how to use 1.3 from lein 1.x; you basically create a dummy project to eval inside
19:45	emezeske	technomancy: aha! that's exactly what I need.
19:47	darq	hello. i have a tree and i would like to output the path to the leafs using clojure.walk .. is it possible with clojure.walk?
19:48	darrint	Do I need to restart emacs/slime if I add deps to project.clj?
19:50	darq	You have to start a new swank server (lein swank) ... so yes.. you must reconnect
19:50	amalloy	the full path to each leaf? it's pretty easy without clojure.walk
19:50	darq	yes . to each leaf
19:54	technomancy	darrint: yes, unless you use https://github.com/cemerick/pomegranate
19:55	amalloy	darq: sketch at https://gist.github.com/1530833
19:57	amalloy	you can write something similar if you want your tree and nodes to just be sequences, by testing coll? to see if it's a sequence. but in that case interior nodes can't have values, so the path is not very interesting
19:59	darq	thx.
19:59	TimMc	tmciver: The idiomatic approach would be ##(not= -1 (.indexOf "abc" "b"))
19:59	lazybot	⇒ true
20:00	amalloy	&(.contains "abc" "b")
20:00	lazybot	⇒ true
20:00	tmciver	TimMc: why that and not .contains?
20:01	amalloy	i suspect TimMc's point was that .indexOf has an overload for Character, but he forgot to actually do that
20:01	tmciver	,(not= -1 (.indexOf "abc" \b))
20:01	clojurebot	#<IllegalArgumentException java.lang.IllegalArgumentException: No matching method found: indexOf for class java.lang.String>
20:01	amalloy	welp, i lose again
20:02	amalloy	$javadoc String indexOf
20:02	lazybot	http://download.oracle.com/javase/6/docs/api/java/lang/String.html#indexOf(int)
20:02	TimMc	wait wait wait .contains works?
20:02	tmciver	TimMc: nice of you to join the conversation. :)
20:02	amalloy	of course, why wouldn't it?
20:03	TimMc	Ah, I missed the bot responses.
20:03	TimMc	amalloy: I guess because everything since Java v1.3 is new to me.
20:04	amalloy	TimMc: funny you should mention that, i was just reading through old javadocs to see if indexOf always took an int rather than a char
20:04	TimMc	I last used Java in 2001 and picked it up again in about 2007.
20:04	amalloy	but .contains has worked for substrings since at least 1.1
20:04	TimMc	amalloy: String#contains says "since 1.5"
20:04	amalloy	man, really?
20:05	amalloy	my memory has betrayed me
20:05	TimMc	I wonder if that refers to a widening from String -> CharSequence.
20:05	TimMc	Nope, not there in 1.4.2.
20:05	weavejester	I remember using Java 1.4 some years ago and being annoyed by String#contains
20:06	amalloy	weavejester: it allegedly wasn't there in 1.4, but i remember it too
20:06	weavejester	amalloy: No, I mean I remember it not being there.
20:06	weavejester	amalloy: It only worked with chars
20:08	TimMc	weavejester: That doesn't work now, does it?
20:08	TimMc	&(.contains "abc" \b)
20:08	lazybot	java.lang.ClassCastException: java.lang.Character cannot be cast to java.lang.CharSequence
20:09	amalloy	TimMc: it does, if you write in java, because 'a' will be upcast to an int
20:09	amalloy	wait, that's probably not true either
20:10	weavejester	Hm... I've just checked and .contains didn't exist in 1.4
20:10	weavejester	Maybe I'm thinking of indexOf or something...
20:10	TimMc	yep
20:10	amalloy	just tested, java does upcast characters to ints
20:10	TimMc	correct
20:11	TimMc	Oh, wild -- I never noticed that indexOf can take an int.
20:11	TimMc	What are the semantics of that?
20:12	TimMc	&Character/MAX_VALUE
20:12	lazybot	â‡’ \ï¿¿
20:13	TimMc	&(.indexOf "abc" (inc Character/MAX_VALUE))
20:13	lazybot	java.lang.ClassCastException: java.lang.Character cannot be cast to java.lang.Number
20:13	TimMc	&(.indexOf "abc" (int (inc Character/MAX_VALUE)))
20:13	lazybot	java.lang.ClassCastException: java.lang.Character cannot be cast to java.lang.Number
20:14	TimMc	&(int \b) ; that's annoying
20:14	lazybot	⇒ 98
20:14	TimMc	Oh wait, it's inc that's complaining.
20:15	TimMc	&(.indexOf "abc" (inc (int Character/MAX_VALUE))) ; no complaints
20:15	lazybot	⇒ -1
20:15	gf3	bah, I keep expecting ('(a b c) 'a) to work like (some #(= % 'a) '(a b c))
20:16	amalloy	TimMc: it's to account for the fact that unicode characters no longer fit in a java char
20:16	weavejester	Oh, it was .replace I was thinking of.
20:16	weavejester	In 1.4 it was only for chars
20:16	weavejester	In 1.5 and above it's overloaded for CharSequences as well.
20:17	TimMc	amalloy: They never did.
20:17	amalloy	so if you cast a character to an int, it looks up that character like a one-character string. if it's an int larger than a character, it goes into the "be careful, characters might be really large" mode
20:17	weavejester	gf3: ('#{a b c} 'a) does :)
20:18	amalloy	TimMc: really? i was under the impression that they picked the size of char in order to fit all standardized characters of the time
20:18	gf3	weavejester: amazing, thank you
20:18	gf3	weavejester: sets can only contain unique members though, correct?
20:18	TimMc	amalloy: I think surrogate pairs have been around since forever.
20:18	TimMc	Maybe I'm wrong!
20:18	weavejester	gf3: Yes, and they're unordered
20:19	weavejester	gf3: But if you have a list, and want to check it for something...
20:19	weavejester	gf3: Then sometimes you can just do ((set xs) x)
20:19	weavejester	It works well in maps and things
20:20	weavejester	By which I mean clojure.core/map, not hash-maps :)
20:20	gf3	weavejester: thanks for the tip, I'll be using that
20:20	amalloy	(some #{x} xs) is surely nicer
20:23	technomancy	in 1.2 sets can contain duplicate numbers
20:23	technomancy	if one is an Integer and one's a Long
20:23	gf3	technomancy: hax
20:24	TimMc	technomancy: I noticed that ##{(long 5) :a, (int 5) :a} throws now!
20:24	lazybot	java.lang.IllegalArgumentException: Duplicate key: 5
20:24	TimMc	So glad.
20:25	TimMc	amalloy: "The Unicode standard has since been changed to allow for characters whose representation requires more than 16 bits."
20:26	TimMc	That's Character in 1.5
20:27	amalloy	TimMc: so, that sounds like it means two bytes used to be enough, yeah?
20:27	TimMc	yep
20:28	TimMc	I guess I should keep read the "History of Unicode" section in that book I have in my cubicle at work.
20:28	TimMc	s/keep//
20:29	technomancy	TimMc: it still falls back to the broken behaviour if you use the Java methods, which is arguably correct since the interfaces require you to be wrong.
20:29	amalloy	technomancy: well, sets can already have duplicate elements, sorta: ##(let [o (reify Object (hashCode [this] (rand-int 1000)) (equals [this x] false))] (hash-set o o))
20:29	lazybot	⇒ #{#<sandbox22696$eval25262$reify__25263 sandbox22696$eval25262$reify__25263@303> #<sandbox22696$eval25262$reify__25263 sandbox22696$eval25262$reify__25263@2d6>}
20:30	technomancy	heh
20:41	TimMc	Clearly, the Java devs should have made j.l.Character an enum. That would have solved it.
20:44	amalloy	TimMc: worked for the haskell booleans (i think? not sure if that was something they did do, or just something that would be easy)
20:47	xandrews	what do people use in place of the old clojure.contrib.repl-utils/show ?
20:48	TimMc	If it doesn't exist, that would be a nice little project.
20:51	amalloy	clojure.reflect, right?
20:52	amalloy	&(require '[clojure.reflect :as refl])
20:52	lazybot	⇒ nil
20:53	amalloy	&(keys (ns-publics 'clojure.reflect))
20:53	lazybot	java.lang.SecurityException: You tripped the alarm! ns-publics is bad!
20:54	amalloy	&(refl/reflect (java.util.Date.))
20:54	lazybot	⇒ {:bases #{java.io.Serializable java.lang.Comparable java.lang.Object java.lang.Cloneable}, :flags #{:public}, :members #{#clojure.reflect.Constructor{:name java.util.Date, :declaring-class java.util.Date, :parameter-types [java.lang.String], :exception-types [], :f... https://gist.github.com/1531104
20:56	xandrews	wow. lots of info there. show just prints out the method names and argument types. I'll need to write something to make it a bit more readable. Thanks!
20:57	chipdude	&(refl/reflect (java.util.Date))
20:57	lazybot	java.lang.ClassCastException: java.lang.Class cannot be cast to clojure.lang.IFn
20:57	chipdude	&(refl/reflect java.util.Date)
20:57	lazybot	⇒ {:bases #{java.io.Serializable java.lang.Comparable java.lang.Object java.lang.Cloneable}, :flags #{:public}, :members #{#clojure.reflect.Constructor{:name java.util.Date, :declaring-class java.util.Date, :parameter-types [java.lang.String], :exception-types [], :f... https://gist.github.com/1531121
20:57	chipdude	k
21:16	aaelony	is this the right forum to ask a beginner's swank-clojure with Emacs question? I've finally decided to try emacs, have done lein deps with a project.clj containing swank-clojure as a dev dependency, have done M-x clojure-jack-in, and now I've got a simple (ns foo) expression that I'd like to send to the repl. C-x c-e gives me a backtrace, what do I need to do to get this to work?
21:18	amalloy	IME you have to C-c C-k the file it's in, to load the code
21:20	aaelony	thanks! that works :)
22:17	gf3	technomancy: ping
22:34	unlink	How do I interact with Java properties in clojure 1.3
22:34	unlink	...now that clojure-contrib has been split up?
22:36	mindbender	unlink: what do you mean by Java properties
22:37	unlink	j.u.Properties
22:41	mindbender	unlink: I don't think you have to do anything special to use properties
22:41	mindbender	from my repl I can do this without errors: (def prop-obj (doto (java.util.Properties.) (.putAll {"a" 1 "b" 2})))
22:41	unlink	mindbender: Ah, yes, I'd like to parse properties files.
22:42	mindbender	are you having any issues doing that?
22:44	amalloy	$javadoc java.util.Properties
22:44	lazybot	http://download.oracle.com/javase/6/docs/api/java/util/Properties.html
22:45	amalloy	observe the Properties#load method. give it an input stream, and your file is parsed
22:45	unlink	Basically, I'm looking for something like (defn load-properties [f] (doto (java.util.Properties.) (.load (clojure.java.io/reader f))))
22:46	unlink	like this (but not deprecated): http://richhickey.github.com/clojure-contrib/java-utils-api.html#clojure.contrib.java-utils/read-properties
22:46	lazybot	Nooooo, that's so out of date! Please see instead http://clojure.github.com/clojure-contrib/java-utils-api.html#clojure.contrib.java-utils/read-properties and try to stop linking to rich's repo.
22:47	amalloy	so...you know exactly what code you want, and you've already written it. tada, problem solved, you're done!
22:48	unlink	no, I was done after I complained about not being able to find it outside of clojure-contrib. My problem was a social one.
23:47	ldh	i'm struggling with getting vimclojure/nailgun to work (i suspect classpath issues). now i'm trying lein-nailgun, but when I add ["lein-nailgun" "0.1.0"] to my leiningen :dev-dependencies,
23:47	ldh	then do "lein deps" and then "lein" I get "Warning: problem requiring leiningen.hooks.classpath hook: java.lang.ExceptionInInitializerError (classpath.clj:1)"
23:47	ldh	problems persist until I delete the lein-nailgun dependencies from lib/dev