#clojure – 2010-06-26

2010-06-26

00:11	hiredman	last var wins is really dumb
00:12	cemerick	hiredman: what's your reason?
00:13	hiredman	when I try to reload/compile a file in slime it complains that the functions I have defined have already been defined in the namespace I am trying to redefine them in
00:13	Raynes	The fact that you can't turn it off is enough.
00:14	hiredman	all that last var wins has ever done for me is cause grief
00:14	hiredman	the other day I could load some tests that used ring because they did a :reload-all
00:14	defn	hiredman: yeah I have the same issue all the time
00:14	hiredman	couldn't
00:15	hiredman	I had to put a (ns-unmap (create-ns 'clojure.core) 'spit) at the top of the file
00:16	cemerick	that sounds like a bug IIUC; you should be able to redefine vars in your own ns at any time
00:17	cemerick	FWIW, I redefine vars all the time...maybe it's a slime issue?
00:18	hiredman	it's a complication of the model via the addition of well intention complications to make things "easier"
00:23	Raynes	http://github.com/liebke/clj I just noticed this. This is awesome.
00:27	defn	Stolen from my twitter feed no doubt ;)
00:27	Raynes	defn: Totally. Thanks for mentioning it.
00:28	defn	:) Happy to. It looks really interesting. Obviously liebke has a pretty great track record when it comes to Clojure software.
00:28	defn	I can see how a simple Emacs interface could be writtin for it
00:28	defn	written
00:29	defn	since it will return the classpath and so forth
00:29	defn	anyone could write nice interface for it really
00:29	defn	like with anything Java + classpath I bet there are some (a lot) of caveats
00:40	tomoj	clj scares me
00:42	technomancy	it's a little too ambitious. I'd rather have something simpler that could be included in Clojure itself in the future.
00:43	defn	agreed
00:44	tomoj	is it not meant for developers?
00:49	tomoj	I mean, why `clj install`? only meant for tinkerers who don't want to set up real clojure projects?
00:49	defn	maybe it grabs the most recent?
00:49	Raynes	It shouldn't be that hard to write a simpler thing to be included in Clojure. I'm surprised that some sort of script hasn't already been written.
01:03	brandonw	if i use nailgun as a clojure repl server, and background the process, is it normal for anything calling the server to block until i foreground the server process?
01:04	brandonw	i could have sworn i backgrounded the nailgun server months back without a problem.. i don't think i am doing anything differently now
01:04	tomoj	how are you backgrounding the process?
01:04	brandonw	ctrl-z
01:05	brandonw	and `lein nailgun &`
01:05	brandonw	both seem to do the same thing
01:05	tomoj	the latter sounds right
01:05	tomoj	for the former I would think you'd need to `bg`
01:06	brandonw	oh okay
01:06	brandonw	let me try that
01:06	brandonw	okay, yes you are correct
01:07	brandonw	i guess that makes me a linux newbie still, heh
01:07	brandonw	never realized that there was a distinction between `cmd &` and `cmd` then ctrl-z
01:07	brandonw	thanks :)
01:08	tomoj	`fg` to get it back
01:10	defn	:)
01:13	bobo_	ö-äääääääääääääääääääää
01:13	bobo_	ö-äääääääääääääääääääää
01:51	yacin	technomancy: thanks!
05:54	rustemsuniev	Does anyone know how to remove a map element with defined x, y from the vector like this?
05:54	rustemsuniev	[{:x 0, :y 1} {:x 1, :y 0}
06:04	tomoj	rustemsuniev: huh?
06:11	noidi	,(remove #(= {:x 0 :y 1} %) [{:x 0, :y 1} {:x 1, :y 0}])
06:11	clojurebot	({:x 1, :y 0})
06:11	noidi	do you mean something like that?
06:15	rustemsuniev	noidi: Yep, thanks!
06:19	rustemsuniev	If I define a vector as (def my-vec (ref [{:x 0, :y 1} {:x 1, :y 0}])) how I can make the same remove work?
07:00	helino	hello everyone! i've just started learning clojure and have a question about Leiningen. Which folders in the project layout are "binary" folders? What's the "classes" folder?
08:50	helino	hello everyone! for network programming with clojure, which library would you recommend? server-socket in clojure-contrib?
09:14	bhenry	can someone give me a working link to ants.clj?
09:15	bhenry	found it. ]
09:25	raek	helino: server-socket and clojure.contrib.io/clojure.contrib.duck-streams are a good start
09:31	raek	I also recommend looking into lazy sequences
09:32	raek	they can be very handy for representing the incomming (maybe tokenized) data as a stream/sequence
10:04	helino	raek: ok, thanks for your answer!
11:26	toked	is clojure.repl meant to replace contrib.repl-utils? or is the idea to pull just the most commonly used functions into the core lib?
13:25	systay	I'm stuck. If anyone feels like helping a noob out, take a look at this: http://gist.github.com/454199
13:25	systay	I'm using neo4j, and the error I get from that declaration is: "java.lang.RuntimeException: java.lang.IllegalArgumentException: Don't know how to create ISeq from: clojure.lang.Symbol (data.clj:6)"
13:25	qbg	You need arguments for defn
13:27	qbg	(defn create-root [...] (with-tx ...))
13:27	systay	I feel really stupid now. Can we just pretend I never asked? :)
13:27	polypus	asked what?
13:27	polypus	;)
13:27	qbg	Internet knows all
13:28	qbg	It could be worse; the other day I had a brain fart regarding syntax-quote
13:38	systay	has anyone tried pair programming clojure? I'm curious
13:39	qbg	I did a little once with someone who didn't know clojure, but that's it.
13:39	systay	I was thinking it must be very different from pairing on a verbose language like java
13:43	qbg	How so?
13:45	systay	well... in a c# (my primary lang), when I'm backseat, I think about the "big picture" while my pair buddy does the boring typing
13:46	systay	I'm just curious
14:01	systay	I'm trying to get my repl to reload when a file changes...
14:01	systay	i write (use :reload-all 'src-file)
14:02	systay	but that doesn't seem to work... am I missing something?
14:05	chouser	that should work if by src-file you mean my.namespace
14:07	systay	and if I add a definition to that file, and save it, will it be picked up automagically?
14:20	raek	seems like i'm doing (into {} (for [x xs] [(make-key x) (make-val x)])) all the time...
14:20	raek	is there some better/more ideomatic/prettier way of doing this?
14:37	qbg	raek:
14:37	qbg	,(doc juxt)
14:37	clojurebot	"([f] [f g] [f g h] [f g h & fs]); Alpha - name subject to change. Takes a set of functions and returns a fn that is the juxtaposition of those fns. The returned fn takes a variable number of args, and returns a vector containing the result of applying each fn to the args (left-to-right). ((juxt a b c) x) => [(a x) (b x) (c x)]"
14:38	ober	anyone got clojure working on android?
14:38	qbg	There is a thread on the group about clojure on android
14:39	ober	yeah saw that and was prompting me to hunt for a howto or something
14:39	qbg	This thread seems relevant: http://groups.google.com/group/clojure/browse_thread/thread/737a69393a5b111e/4fbaa8c8695e90e9?lnk=gst&q=android#4fbaa8c8695e90e9
14:47	kiras	anyone have any suggestions on how this could be better? http://gist.github.com/454257
14:49	ataggart	use filter
14:50	kiras	ataggart: ok, let me try that
14:50	ataggart	ah sry that was with regard to the comment at the top, not the fn to see is soemthing is divisible by a number
14:51	ataggart	for that: (zero? (mod x 3))
14:55	kiras	ataggart: sorry, i don't understand what you mean. i don't actually check to see if something is divisible by a number, are you saying that i should?
14:55	ataggart	isn't that part of the problem?
14:55	ataggart	you need to test if a number is divisible by 3 or 5
14:57	kiras	well... the problem is to sum up all the multiples of 3 or 5 under 1000, which i already know is divisible by 3 and 5, so i don't have to test that, but i probably should anyway heh
14:58	ataggart	e.g., (reduce + (filter #(and (zero? (mod % 3)) (zero? (mod % 5))) (range 1000))
14:59	ataggart	)
15:01	kiras	i think for this problem, it would be or instead of and
15:01	ataggart	so it is
15:02	ataggart	but notice the difference in structure between yours and mine
15:03	kiras	they are definitely different. what aspect in particular are you referring to?
15:03	ataggart	composing together functions that work on sequences
15:04	ataggart	rather than writing every detail in a loop
15:04	ataggart	imperative vs functional, basically
15:05	kiras	that will probably take me a while to get used to
15:05	ataggart	heh, perhaps
15:05	kiras	in some ways, i thought that part of what i did was sort of functional
15:05	ataggart	it took me a bit to wrap my head around it
15:05	kiras	the part using the results of the divide-by-n-list results?
15:06	ataggart	it's the mental model. In yours you're given an end number and keep doing some math on it.
15:06	ataggart	it's entirely specialized
15:07	ataggart	whereas if you think of the starting data as a list of all the numbers between 0 and 999, then you process that sequence with various functions
15:07	ataggart	all which are non-specialized
15:08	kiras	i see what you mean
15:10	kiras	mine is also wrong, since i accidentally included 1000 in the divisible by 5 list
15:10	ataggart	also the one I pasted reads much like the problem: sum the set of numbers which are divisable by 3 or 5 where all numbers are in the range of 0 to 999
15:11	kiras	true
15:11	systay	I'm finding that I have good use of my dba-background. "Good" SQL is also set-based and not looping
15:12	systay	in re: to your discussion
15:12	ataggart	true, though I loathe sql
15:12	kiras	maybe i'll try another problem and try to keep this in mind
15:13	ataggart	kiras: break the problems down into discrete sub-problems (i.e., functions)
15:13	ataggart	and then compose them
15:13	ataggart	e.g., a fn that tests for divisibility by 3
15:14	cemerick	rhickey: ping?
15:15	systay	what does this mean: #<Object$RelationshipType$c9c4a4fe neo4j.proxy$java.lang.Object$RelationshipType$c9c4a4fe@1c54796>
15:15	qbg	It is an object
15:16	systay	how do I read it?
15:16	systay	I mean that string
15:16	qbg	You want to read in "#<...>"?
15:17	systay	well, I want to learn how to decode the repl-output
15:17	systay	it contains some data, and I want the decoder ring for it
15:17	qbg	First, #<...> is the syntax for an unreadable object
15:17	qbg	So you can't just type it in to get the object
15:18	qbg	If that is the last output from the REPL, *1 will be bound to it.
15:19	qbg	How are you getting the object?
15:19	systay	I'm reading all relationships from the top-node in neo4j: (relationship (top-node))
15:23	qbg	I'd suggest taking a look at the neo4j java docs
15:23	systay	yeah, I'm reading them...
15:24	systay	It's just the combination of two unknowns - clojure and neo4j that's messing me up
15:24	qbg	The object is an instance of a subclass of RelationshipType
15:28	qbg	If you are using clojure-neo4j, it looks like the relate function could be useful.
15:28	systay	ah... so I'm getting the relationship types, and not the relations...
15:29	systay	qbg: thanks so much. I'll continue digging. I got the relate part working, now I want to read as well :)
15:50	mmarczyk	kiras: I wonder if this can help to stay within the realm of nicely composing blocks, yet not test divisibility for the "multiples of 3 & 5" problem: http://gist.github.com/454287
15:51	mmarczyk	(reduce + (take-while #(< % 1000) (apply merge-seqs (map (fn [n] (iterate #(+ % n) 0)) [3 5]))))
15:58	kiras	mmarcyzk: i'm looking, but it will probably take me a while to understand this
15:59	LauJensen	Good evening gentlemen
15:59	ataggart	is it evening already?
15:59	qbg	Depends on where you live...
16:00	mmarczyk	kiras: updated the Gist to work with comparable stuff which isn't numeric
16:00	mmarczyk	LauJensen: good evening to you!
16:00	mmarczyk	kiras: it's the merge part of merge sort, basically
16:02	LauJensen	Sorry I meant Good morning (UGT) :)
16:02	mmarczyk	:-)
16:03	qbg	mmarczyk: merge-seqs looks good to me
16:04	mmarczyk	qbg: thanks; made yet another update just now so it's slightly prettier (I hope)
16:10	amatos	How do I convert a seq to a map? I have a map, I want to apply a function to each of its key-value pairs (that is easy using the map function), but that returns a seq, not a map. How do I make that a map?
16:10	qbg	(into {} (map identity {:a 1, :b 2, :c 3}))
16:11	qbg	,(into {} (map identity {:a 1, :b 2, :c 3}))
16:11	clojurebot	{:a 1, :b 2, :c 3}
16:12	mmarczyk	,(into {} {:a 1, :b 2, :c 3})
16:12	clojurebot	{:a 1, :b 2, :c 3}
16:13	mmarczyk	sorry, just checking something... had a (wrong) hunch
16:13	amatos	thanks! Didn't know about the into function. That seems to do what I need. Cheers
16:14	amatos	So the type that into returns is always the type of the to argument?
16:14	mmarczyk	right
16:14	amatos	great, thanks
16:14	mmarczyk	so if you might be dealing with sorted maps, you could use
16:15	mmarczyk	,((fn [m] (let [e (empty m) res (map identity m)] (into e res))) (sorted-map :a 1 :b 2 :c 3))
16:15	clojurebot	{:a 1, :b 2, :c 3}
16:17	amatos	great
16:19	LauJensen	$(letfn [(f [x] (inc x))] (reduce #(assoc %1 (key %2) (f (val %2))) {} {:a 1 :b 2 :c 3}))
16:19	sexpbot	=> {:a 2, :b 3, :c 4}
16:20	LauJensen	amatos: thats another way to apply a function to the values, without going through map and into
16:21	LauJensen	the 'letfn' just being to show you that its an arbitrary function
16:21	amatos	oh alright
16:21	amatos	thanks
16:28	itistoday	where is it recommended to get clojure 1.2 from? is it the 'new' branch of http://github.com/richhickey/clojure ?
16:29	mmarczyk	itistoday: master
16:29	itistoday	mmarczyk: thanks
16:29	mmarczyk	itistoday: plus see the ggroup -- http://groups.google.com/group/clojure -- for a number of threads on changes currently taking place on other branches, notably equiv
16:30	itistoday	mmarczyk: ok, yeah i need to re-subscribe, i've finally decided to go headfirst into clojure
16:30	mmarczyk	itistoday: way to go! :-)
16:31	systay	is there a way to clear the screen while in repl?
16:31	itistoday	mmarczyk: yeah, i'm excited and a little scared, as it means i have a lot to learn... how would you recommend pulling from rhickey's repo if you just want to get the 1.2 stuff that includes datatypes, and you don't want to waste a whole bunch of hard drive space?
16:32	kiras	systay: in emacs? you can use C-c M-o.
16:32	mmarczyk	itistoday: the whole thing is ~47M
16:33	itistoday	mmarczyk: oh, ok that's not bad
16:33	systay	kiras: nah... learning clojure is enough in it self. I'm using trusted old gedit so far
16:33	mmarczyk	itistoday: anyway, just use git clone and maybe stay on master for now
16:33	systay	kiras: so just a terminal repl
16:33	itistoday	mmarczyk: k
16:33	kiras	systay: ah. sorry, i don't know then.
16:34	mmarczyk	systay: in that case, look to your terminal for that
16:35	systay	mmarczyk: of course... duh! thanks...
16:36	mmarczyk	systay: :-) e.g. Gnome Terminal has a 'Reset and Clear' command in the 'Terminal' menu; kills your prompt too, but not the app, plus the last batch of input is still there
16:37	mmarczyk	so use at an empty prompt followed by return to get a mostly-cleared screen with a fresh prompt
16:37	yacin	does clojure 1.2/contrib 1.2 not work with swank?
16:37	yacin	i'm getting this error: http://osdir.com/ml/clojure/2010-02/msg00797.html
16:37	mmarczyk	yacin: it works fine, though you might need a fresh-enough swank
16:37	systay	mmarczyk: yeah, I found it straight away once I started looking for it...
16:37	rustemsuniev	If I have (def my-vec (ref [{:x 0 :y 1 :val false} {:x 1 :y 0 :val false}])) how I can update a map in it with a value "val = false" say for x 1, y 0?
16:38	mmarczyk	yacin: aahhh, you're being hit by the old contrib-compiled-with-different-clojure.jar problem
16:38	mmarczyk	yacin: you need to use a clojure-contrib.jar matching your clojure.jar
16:38	mmarczyk	systay: :-)
16:38	yacin	i'm pulling both from clojars
16:39	yacin	although it's 1.2.0-master-SNAPSHOT for clojure and 1.2.0-SNAPSHOT for clojure-contrib
16:39	mmarczyk	and for swank?
16:39	yacin	leiningen/lein-swank "1.2.0-SNAPSHOT"
16:41	mmarczyk	(let [my-vec (ref [{:x 0 :y 1 :val false} {:x 1 :y 0 :val false}])] (dosync (alter my-vec (partial clojure.walk/walk #(if (and (== (:x %) 1) (== (:y %) 0)) (assoc % :val false)) identity))
16:41	mmarczyk	,(let [my-vec (ref [{:x 0 :y 1 :val false} {:x 1 :y 0 :val false}])] (dosync (alter my-vec (partial clojure.walk/walk #(if (and (== (:x %) 1) (== (:y %) 0)) (assoc % :val false)) identity))))
16:41	clojurebot	java.lang.ClassNotFoundException: clojure.walk
16:41	mmarczyk	rustemsuniev: see above
16:42	rustemsuniev	Cheers! Going to try it.
16:42	mmarczyk	yacin: try a lein clean and lein deps again maybe...?
16:43	mmarczyk	plus I'd bump swank's version to 1.3.0 if that's on Clojars already
16:43	mmarczyk	rustemsuniev: ah, sorry, missed the other branch of the if... just use %
16:43	kiras	i've been using swank-clojure "1.2.1" instead of leiningen/lein-swank "1.2.0-SNAPSHOT"
16:43	kiras	not sure if that's right or not, but it seems to work for me
16:44	rustemsuniev	Sure! thanks again!
16:45	mmarczyk	rustemsuniev: plus it would be better to (assoc % :val true) to see that it works, seeing how the original values are already false :-)
16:46	yacin	kiras: as a :dev-dependencies?
16:46	kiras	yacin: yes
16:47	yacin	doesn't let swank start problem with M-x swank-clojure-project for me...
16:47	kiras	from the site: Note that the lein-swank plugin now comes with Swank Clojure; it does not need to be specified as a separate dependency any more.
16:47	kiras	ah... i think they say that it's better to use lein swank at the command line first, then slime-connect
16:48	kiras	instead of swank-clojure-project
16:50	yacin	ah, that worked just fine
16:50	kiras	cool
16:51	yacin	thanks!
16:51	yacin	is there anyway to specify a port for swank?
16:51	kiras	np :)
16:51	yacin	so i can have multiple lein swanks?
16:51	mmarczyk	lein swank port-number, I think
16:51	kiras	$ lein swank [PORT=4005] [HOST=localhost]
16:51	sexpbot	Command not found. No entiendo lo que estás diciendo.
16:52	LauJensen	sexpbot: hablar espanol?
16:52	sexpbot	Command not found. No entiendo lo que estás diciendo.
16:52	mmarczyk	ah, lying with a straight face
16:54	kiras	mmarcyzk: i think i finally understand how that code works lol
16:56	mmarczyk	kiras: :-)
16:56	Raynes	I should consider changing the primary prepend. $ is too common. Dollars and such.
16:56	systay	if I wanted to change how the attribute lookup works, how would I do that?
16:57	systay	I want :foo to mean something other than the normal attribute lookup does
16:57	mmarczyk	Raynes: maybe also require using whatever you choose for s/foo/bar/ style substitutions
16:57	Raynes	mmarczyk: Huh?
16:57	Raynes	Oh.
16:57	mmarczyk	s/Huh?/Sure!/
16:57	qbg	systay: You want :foo to be a function that does something else?
16:57	kiras	mmarcyzk: that's actually pretty cool... so in the example at the end, it basically creates three lazy sequences, then you merge them into one lazy sequence and take the first 15 elements?
16:57	Raynes	The idea is to not use a prepend.
16:58	mmarczyk	kiras: yup
16:58	Raynes	That plugin isn't loaded right now, I don't think.
16:58	Raynes	Erik was working on some stuff in that one.
16:58	systay	qbg: In neo4j, a lookup returns a proxy object. if I do (:name proxy-object), I get nil back. I have to do (:name (properties proxy-object)) instead, and that bothers me
16:58	mmarczyk	kiras: as mentioned above, you can merge (iterate #(+ % 3) 0) with #(iterate #(+ % 5)), then (take-while #(< % 1000) ...) from that
16:59	mmarczyk	kiras: (reduce + ...) / (apply + ...) to top it off
16:59	Raynes	But we have a $sed command that does the same thing with more functionality. s/// not requiring a prepend is a bit of a fun easter egg. It can be turned off if people find it annoying though.
16:59	Raynes	<3
16:59	mmarczyk	kiras: if you use ->>, you can actually write it down in a piped fashion
16:59	qbg	systay: Keywords are not variables, so that won't work by itself
17:00	qbg	You could always do macro magic, though
17:00	mmarczyk	Raynes: nah, I don't really mind, though as far as usefulness is concerned, hm, I'll look into $sed :-)
17:00	kiras	mmarcyzk: interesting... i'll have to read about ->>
17:00	mmarczyk	actually having the bot provide a $sed command is just cool
17:00	systay	qbg: I haven't read that chapter in my Programming Clojure-pdf...
17:01	qbg	Either way, it is probably overkill
17:01	mmarczyk	kiras: (->> (map (fn [n] (iterate #(+ % n) 0)) [3 5]) (apply merge-seqs) (take-while #(< % 1000)) (reduce +))
17:01	systay	qbg: it just feels like the clojure-neo4j doesn't hide the fact that we're using a java-lib
17:02	systay	qbg: enough anyway
17:02	qbg	systay: That can be a difficult choice to make when designing a library like that
17:02	systay	I'm sure it is
17:02	qbg	Do we make it like the java library, or do we do something more idiomatic?
17:02	LauJensen	mmarczyk: Im unfamiliar with merge-seqs, what would be passed aorund ?
17:03	mmarczyk	LauJensen: I just wrote it :-) -- http://gist.github.com/454287
17:03	mmarczyk	Seqables of Comparables, basically
17:03	systay	qbg: I was just checking if it was doable. Scratching such itches led me to clojure in the first place... :)
17:03	qbg	mmarczyk: One downside of merge-seqs is that you can't use it for mergesort
17:04	mmarczyk	$translate pl en "jejku, fantastyczne! :-)"
17:04	sexpbot	"Oh dear, fantastic! :-)"
17:04	qbg	systay: You have a lot of power with Clojure, and with great power comes great responsibility. :)
17:05	mmarczyk	Raynes: wow, sexpbot has a really cool collection of plugins :-)
17:05	systay	mmarczyk: Cześć
17:05	mmarczyk	qbg: hm? why not?
17:05	mmarczyk	systay: o, dobry wieczór :-)
17:05	qbg	mmarczyk: It looks like it swallows items that are equal
17:05	LauJensen	mmarczyk: So it concat seqs on each other, removing duplicates on overlap?
17:05	mmarczyk	qbg: ah, of course
17:06	mmarczyk	qbg: could use (cons x (cons x ...)) for the 0 case
17:06	mmarczyk	LauJensen: not concat...
17:06	mmarczyk	LauJensen: (merge-seqs [1 3 5] [2 4]) => (1 2 3 4 5)
17:06	qbg	mmarczyk: It might be better keep the originals instead of duplicating one
17:07	mmarczyk	qbg: hm, true again
17:07	mmarczyk	qbg: (cons x (cons y ...)) for a left-to-right precedence among the input seqs
17:08	kiras	mmarcyk: ->> is really cool, thanks for pointing it out to me
17:08	qbg	Writing a function to remove strings of equal items in a list would be easy
17:08	kiras	how often is ->> generally used?
17:09	LauJensen	kiras: often
17:09	qbg	I use ->> much more than ->
17:09	kiras	laujensen: practically by default? heh
17:09	LauJensen	Almost. If some kind of sequential processing makes more sense using either -> or ->> I rewrite. Its all about readability
17:10	kiras	laujensen: interesting
17:11	mmarczyk	qbg: updated the Gist to contain two versions, merge-seqs which does not remove duplicates and merge-seqs-nub which does
17:11	mmarczyk	qbg: thanks for the idea
17:12	mmarczyk	kiras: yeah, cool it is :-)
17:12	qbg	mmarczyk: Now there is code duplication. Fix that. ;)
17:12	mmarczyk	:-P
17:12	qbg	merge-seqs-nub is a composition of two functions, in my mind.
17:13	mmarczyk	sure, could use merge-seqs and distinct
17:13	mmarczyk	but distinct needs to build a set of previously seen objects as it goes
17:13	mmarczyk	whereas here the point is to exploit the assumptions made about the input
17:13	qbg	Once they are in sorted order, equals ones will appear in a string
17:13	mmarczyk	simple enough to fix, actually, with a helper function -- or rather a macro
17:13	qbg	You can fix that in linear time and constant space
17:14	qbg	Function would probably be better
17:14	mmarczyk	which is not quite as not needing to fix it at all
17:14	mmarczyk	but sure, it's a good point
17:15	LauJensen	mmarczyk: is it similar to
17:15	LauJensen	$(reduce #(clojure.set/union %1 %2) #{} [[1 3 5] [2 4]])
17:15	sexpbot	=> [1 3 5 2 4]
17:15	LauJensen	?
17:15	mmarczyk	LauJensen: with (sorted-set), right
17:16	LauJensen	k
17:16	mmarczyk	ah, good idea and the actual way to go for the -nub version, I guess :-)
17:16	LauJensen	So wrap it in a call to (set) and you're good to go
17:16	mmarczyk	though actually not quite
17:16	mmarczyk	because again
17:16	mmarczyk	this builds the whole set
17:16	mmarczyk	whereas merge-seqs[-nub] just walks a long the seqs lazily
17:17	mmarczyk	outputting one item at a time
17:17	mmarczyk	because it knows the inputs to be sorted
17:17	LauJensen	$(take 2 (reduce #(do (println "running") (clojure.set/union %1 %2)) #{} [[1 3 5] [2 4]]))
17:17	sexpbot	=> running running (1 3)
17:17	mmarczyk	^walks along
17:17	LauJensen	So its still lazy, except for the sorting
17:17	LauJensen	But to sort, you need to walk the whole set first
17:17	mmarczyk	which is the whole point
17:18	mmarczyk	because the original problem was to add up all numbers divisible by 3 or 5 under 1000
17:18	mmarczyk	I wanted to use (iterate #(+ % 3) 0) and (iterate #(+ % 5) 0), then do a duplicate-removing merge
17:18	mmarczyk	obviously can't use a set here
17:19	LauJensen	Nope, sorted-set is redundant for data which is incremental in nature
17:20	mmarczyk	$(take 20 (into (sorted-set) (iterate inc 0)))
17:20	sexpbot	java.lang.ClassNotFoundException: clojure.core$iterate$fn__3750
17:20	mmarczyk	huh?
17:20	mmarczyk	$(take 20 (into (sorted-set) (range)))
17:20	sexpbot	Execution Timed Out!
17:20	itistoday	what is the relationship of this (http://build.clojure.org/job/clojure/) to rhickey's master branch on github?
17:21	mmarczyk	itistoday: nightly build
17:21	itistoday	mmarczyk: is it based on the master branch or some other branch?
17:21	mmarczyk	master
17:21	itistoday	mmarczyk: ok cool thanks
17:22	mmarczyk	LauJensen: so anyway, "redundant" -- sure, in a very theoretical sense, but you can't use it with infinite seqs
17:25	LauJensen	Its a question of using the right tool for the job. Looks to me like you're trying to model a reality which doesnt exist, ie lazy sorting. For a task that requries sorting, I prefer a combo of reduce and sets, for a task such as the one you describe I wouldnt make it more complicated than it has to be
17:25	LauJensen	Just my 2 cents - hack away :)
17:26	mmarczyk	qbg: updated the Gist with a DRY version -- do you approve? :-)
17:26	mmarczyk	LauJensen: I don't sort, I assume the inputs are sorted
17:26	mmarczyk	LauJensen: as in merge sort -- the merge step knows it works with sorted inputs
17:27	mmarczyk	LauJensen: in fact, the original idea for merging was perfectly lazy, because it needed to be in for dealing with tape drives in an efficient manner I guess :-)
17:28	mmarczyk	LauJensen: anyway, your idea for a strict duplicate-removing merge with (sorted-set) is cool, so thanks; and I'll welcome any improvements to the lazy version :-)
17:28	qbg	mmarczyk: Note that before you were using compare and now you are using =.
17:29	mmarczyk	qbg: yeah, I thought about it
17:29	qbg	But otherwise, it's better :)
17:30	mmarczyk	I'm trying to figure out if the difference between (zero? (compare x y)) and (= x y) is significant
17:31	mmarczyk	ok, inserted the (zero? ...) version
17:31	mmarczyk	just to be safe
17:31	LauJensen	mmarczyk: on the master branch ?
17:32	mmarczyk	LauJensen: you mean if I'm targetting master with merge-seqs...? yeah, for now
17:32	LauJensen	mmarczyk: When you're asking questions about '=' I just wanted to know if it was related to the changes in the equal branch or not
17:32	mmarczyk	LauJensen: ah, good point
17:33	qbg	equiv brings back some equality across types
17:33	mmarczyk	actually I'm doing this on an 'equal' REPL
17:34	mmarczyk	since I haven't got 'round to building equiv yet... actually might do that now
17:37	TeXnomancy	LauJensen: did you have your clojure studio recently?
17:37	LauJensen	zero? calls x.signum() == 0, and = calls x.equals(y) as far as I can tell.
17:37	LauJensen	TeXnomancy: Yea I just got back from Brussels yesterday as a matter of fact :)
17:37	TeXnomancy	LauJensen: smashing! how'd it go?
17:39	LauJensen	TeXnomancy: I'd say it went great. The team got an IRCBot up and running on the first day, and by the second day they had already written some improvements to Clojure.core, which brought speedups of 20%, so I think people came with a super attitude and energy, and took away some skills because of it
17:41	TeXnomancy	sounds like fun. glad to see the ecosystem is already supporting several of these kinds of things.
17:41	Raynes	mmarczyk: There appears to be a problem with swank servers and clj-sandbox. I suppose some sort of compilation mix up. Either way, iterate and rseq do not work.
17:45	mmarczyk	Raynes: I see... well, no big deal
17:46	Raynes	mmarczyk: It'll probably be fixed if swank gets compiled with 1.2. Assuming it's actually compiled... If not, then I don't know what causes it and I digress. :p
17:46	mmarczyk	Raynes: no aot'd namespaces for swank iirc
17:47	TeXnomancy	mmarczyk: correct
17:47	Raynes	mmarczyk: Well, I can run sexpbot through the shell script and it works fine. I normally run it through a swank server, and when I do that, it meows at you on iterate and rseq.
17:47	Raynes	I have no clue.
17:47	mmarczyk	wow, weird
17:57	TeXnomancy	any last-minute patches before Leiningen rc2?
17:58	mmarczyk	TeXnomancy: one maybe
17:58	mmarczyk	TeXnomancy: :license & Co. in sample.project.clj
17:58	mmarczyk	TeXnomancy: I think I've sent you a pull request for that
17:59	mmarczyk	TeXnomancy: otherwise it's on add-more-info-to-pom-doc branch in my fork
18:00	Raynes	TeXnomancy: Did you fix the lein repl thing where it always uses 1.1?
18:00	TeXnomancy	Raynes: yeah, several weeks ago
18:00	Raynes	Good boy.
18:00	TeXnomancy	mmarczyk: oh, I thought I had got that one.
18:00	Raynes	<3
18:01	TeXnomancy	mmarczyk: apply'd!
18:01	mmarczyk	TeXnomancy: cool, thanks
18:01	mmarczyk	TeXnomancy: there's also the new commit
18:01	mmarczyk	'repositories being maps'
18:02	mmarczyk	just noticed it
18:02	mmarczyk	anyway, could use an example too
18:02	TeXnomancy	mmarczyk: yeah... I'm using the term "RC" to mean "functionally release candidate"
18:02	TeXnomancy	there are still documentation tasks remaining for 1.2
18:03	mmarczyk	TeXnomancy: fair enough :-)
18:09	TeXnomancy	plenty of changes since RC1: http://github.com/technomancy/leiningen/commit/d94d94db096d690b282f90f3edd5569159ba2cb0
18:11	mmarczyk	TeXnomancy: one more thing
18:12	mmarczyk	deps.clj -> make-repository -> second branch of if -> the let form seems to be missing a binding expression
18:13	mmarczyk	(let [{:keys [url username password]} settings-goes-here] ...
18:13	TeXnomancy	mmarczyk: dang! you're right.
18:13	TeXnomancy	I don't have a password-protected repo to test against, but I could have caught that =\
18:13	mmarczyk	:-)
18:18	kiras	so i just figured out that lein new allows you to specify a groupid. i'm not sure when this would normally be used, but last week i was trying to figure out how to use lein to set up a project "test-project" without having dashes where there were supposed to be underscores and vice versa. using the groupid option makes it possible to do this. just wondering, are there any other reasons why this option is useful?
18:19	TeXnomancy	kiras: IMO group-id is not useful. =)
18:19	TeXnomancy	but some people wanted it and were kind enough to contribute a patch
18:19	kiras	what about in the situation i just described?
18:19	kiras	is there a better way to accomplish that?
18:20	TeXnomancy	kiras: well, the JVM can't load files that have a dash in them. it's just a dumb limitation it has.
18:20	TeXnomancy	that's why they get replaced with underscores.
18:20	mmarczyk	I'm only using group-ids in :dependencies... and then I occasionally switch back and forth between a couple of them (different folks' jars on Clojars)
18:21	kiras	i understand that, i just meant, lein currently doesn't let you make a project correctly like this: lein new test-project, at least not that i'm aware of
18:21	TeXnomancy	oh yeah, you absolutely need group-ids for specifying dependencies on other peoples' projects. I just don't see the point of adding one for your own (other than publishing non-canonical releases to clojars)
18:21	kiras	so it's useful in that situation, at least
18:22	nickik	How can i make this ([1] [2] [3] [4]) out of this ([1] [2]) ([3] [4])
18:22	kiras	i was thinking if there was no other reason for that option in new, wouldn't it be possible to make lein new handle that automatically?
18:22	Raynes	$(concat '([1] [2]) '([3] [4]))
18:22	sexpbot	=> ([1] [2] [3] [4])
18:22	kiras	so lein new test-project sets up project.clj and core.clj with test-project and the directories are all test_project?
18:22	mmarczyk	kiras: lein new test-project works fine for me
18:22	kiras	mmarczyk: really?
18:22	kiras	...
18:22	Raynes	$(into '([1] [2]) '([3] [4])) ; back asswards
18:22	sexpbot	=> ([4] [3] [1] [2])
18:23	kiras	wonder what i'm doing wrong then
18:23	mmarczyk	the project directory is called test-project, the namespace directory is called test_project, as it needs to be due to JVM issues
18:23	TeXnomancy	kiras: could you describe what it is specifically that you think is wrong?
18:23	Raynes	concat is what you're looking for, nickik
18:23	TeXnomancy	where are you expecting there do be dashes rather than underscores?
18:23	kiras	texnomancy: i thought that when i did lein new test-project it was creating dashes everywhere
18:23	TeXnomancy	so ... I realized leiningen freaks out if I try to run it from my home dir since it tries to put all of ~/src on the classpath... which is like 20+ GB =(
18:24	mmarczyk	kiras: also, how are group-ids of help?
18:24	kiras	both in the directories and the source files
18:24	mmarczyk	TeXnomancy: even with lein new? that would be an 'ouch'
18:25	mmarczyk	then again, maybe not... ah, totally uncertain now
18:25	mmarczyk	kiras: the dashes need to be replaced with underscores for stuff which will end up on the classpath
18:25	TeXnomancy	kiras: hmmm... actually I vaguely recall a patch addressing that which has been applied in 1.2.0; perhaps you could be the first person to try the latest release candidate?
18:25	kiras	texnomancy: actually... looks like i am wrong... let me check
18:26	TeXnomancy	well you should try the RC anyway; it's really great. =)
18:26	mmarczyk	kiras: for the "outer" directory of the project, they shouldn't be replaced, but at least in HEAD they aren't, so if there was a problem, it's fixed now :-)
18:27	nickik	thx for your anwsers works great
18:27	mmarczyk	TeXnomancy: btw, what's the story behind checkout-deps? I notice it's rather stubby right now :-)
18:28	TeXnomancy	mmarczyk: at first I thought it would be useful as a task, but I don't think so anymore. it will probably be merged into deps.clj since there's no need to have it in its own ns.
18:30	mmarczyk	TeXnomancy: so, is the idea to pull from git repos into project/checkout-deps/foo/ ?
18:30	TeXnomancy	mmarczyk: yeah, lein-generated projects will put their git repo info in the pom (which is included in the jar), so it could do that
18:31	TeXnomancy	but I'm unsure if that would even be useful... if so it belongs in a plugin
18:31	mmarczyk	maybe an optional hook (hooke?) on the deps task?
18:32	TeXnomancy	possibly
18:33	TeXnomancy	hmm... I should list the contributors next to the entries in the NEWS file.
18:33	mmarczyk	:-)
18:34	arohner	TeXnomancy: thanks for applying my patch. What's with your name today? Are you working with tex, or hanging out in texas?
18:34	TeXnomancy	arohner: oh, heh... I had some issues with my dircproxy that I need to take a look at; falling back to my alt. nick in the mean time.
18:34	TeXnomancy	(I am actually not very good at typesetting)
18:36	itistoday	TeXnomancy: is it cool to use leiningen from your master branch, or is that not stable and we should use the RC2 from the Downloads page?
18:36	TeXnomancy	itistoday: right now they are exactly the same. =)
18:36	TeXnomancy	itistoday: master generally stays very stable; I use it at work every day.
18:37	itistoday	TeXnomancy: ok cool, thanks!
18:37	TeXnomancy	any destabilizing work will be done on a topic branch until it's "ready"
18:37	arohner	oh that is too cool. Metadata for line numbers are attached to the actual forms, so you can use them in macros
18:37	TeXnomancy	itistoday: btw; you shouldn't have to download any jars manually, just get the shell script and have it run self-install
18:37	TeXnomancy	(unless you're on Windows)
18:37	itistoday	TeXnomancy: yeah i haven't, i've cloned your repo, do i just go in and run ./bin/lein self-install ?
18:38	arohner	but it appears clojure.walk eats metadata :-(
18:38	mmarczyk	arohner: yeah... I remember I didn't get why metadata would be such a big deal when first learning about Clojure at all, whereas now I think having them is an amazing win
18:38	TeXnomancy	itistoday: should do the trick
18:39	mmarczyk	well, clojure.walk/walk doesn't, but the inner & outer functions would need to preserve them
18:39	mmarczyk	there was a thread on the ggroup mentioning this as a bug recently
18:39	TeXnomancy	you don't even need to check it out actually; you can just get the shell script by itself
18:39	mmarczyk	could be considered a bug in prewalk / postwalk, to be sure...
18:40	TeXnomancy	mmarczyk: the last three little hacks I've done have all centered around metadata. it's great!
18:40	mmarczyk	so it is :-)
18:41	TeXnomancy	(robert hooke, serializable-fn, and radagast)
18:42	arohner	TeXnomancy: what is radagast?
18:42	mmarczyk	serializable-fn & radagast? I want to know more!
18:42	arohner	serializable-fn is very clever btw
18:43	TeXnomancy	oh... I haven't really released radagast yet.
18:43	arohner	mmarczyk: (defmacro fn [ & body] (fn {:src body} ~@body)
18:43	TeXnomancy	but I recently decided on that name for http://p.hagelb.org/coverage.clj.html
18:43	mmarczyk	hah, cool :-)
18:43	kiras	texnomancy: it looks like everything is working as it should... but i'm having trouble running the uberjar after i create it... it should just be java -jar test-project-standalone.jar, right?
18:43	mmarczyk	(that was re: serializable-fn... looking at the link now)
18:43	TeXnomancy	mmarczyk: we implemented it at one of the seattle clojure meetings: http://github.com/technomancy/serializable-fn
18:44	mmarczyk	kiras: you'd need to specify a main namespace
18:44	mmarczyk	kiras: :main in project.clj
18:44	mmarczyk	kiras: plus the namespace itself needs to be :gen-class'ed
18:44	kiras	mmarcyzk: i did, but i'm not sure if it is the right one. i have :main test-project.core
18:45	mmarczyk	TeXnomancy: cool commit message on 1.1.0 :-)
18:45	mmarczyk	kiras: and the gen-class?
18:45	mmarczyk	(ns test-project.core (:gen-class))
18:45	kiras	mmarcyzk: and the :gen-class is where it should be as well... i had this working last week
18:45	mmarczyk	oh, and you need (defn -main [& args] ...) in there as well
18:46	kiras	mmarcyzk: well, i have (defn -main [] ...)
18:46	mmarczyk	actually, does java -jar work for you with the regular jar? if it does, then it's definitely something funny with uberjar
18:46	kiras	that did work before, although maybe it's wrong
18:46	kiras	no, it doesn't
18:47	kiras	i'm thinking maybe this was what made me think there was something wrong with the project creation
18:47	TeXnomancy	is it possible even to claim copyright by something as vague as Seajure?
18:49	kiras	wonder if i have the namespace wrong in project.clj...
18:49	mmarczyk	hm, could also replace print-method for fns with one using clojure.repl/source-fn where that is able to find the source
18:50	TeXnomancy	oh, that'd be nifty
18:51	TeXnomancy	... just sayin'.
18:51	mmarczyk	TeXnomancy: surely it must be, in fact I would say it gives Seajure an all new existence on the Upper Plane of IP
18:51	TeXnomancy	mmarczyk: you mean IPv6?
18:51	TeXnomancy	badum-crash!
18:51	mmarczyk	:-P
18:51	TeXnomancy	is it easy to concatenate PDFs?
18:52	mmarczyk	TeXnomancy: apparently not really... http://ansuz.sooke.bc.ca/software/pdf-append.php
18:53	mmarczyk	haven't tried all of the solutions listed, but normally I settle for some print-to-file-like approach
18:55	mmarczyk	hm, leiningen.coverage would be absolutely awesome
18:56	TeXnomancy	mmarczyk: sorta. it's only fn-level coverage.
18:57	TeXnomancy	what you really want is branch-level coverage, which would take a lot more than 30 lines to implement. =)
18:57	kiras	ok, so using underscores (e.g. :main test_project.core) in project.clj works for me, but using dashes doesn't. is that as it should be?
18:57	mmarczyk	though currently I find myself writing macros which define a bunch of functions in one go pretty often... (defparsefns SQL "SQL" expression "SQL expression" ...)
18:57	TeXnomancy	wow, actually that ghostscript hack worked
18:57	TeXnomancy	thakns
18:57	itistoday	what is a good clj script to use? i.e. i've checked out the clojure repos and have a jar file, now i just need a convenient way to run a repl
18:57	mmarczyk	TeXnomancy: oh good :-)
18:57	mmarczyk	itistoday: http://github.com/liebke/clj
18:58	mmarczyk	itistoday: brand new project -- be an early adopter! :-)
18:58	itistoday	mmarczyk: but isn't that a package manager?
18:58	mmarczyk	itistoday: one of the stated goals is to provide a means to launch repls easily
18:58	mmarczyk	clj repl, clj swingrepl
18:58	mmarczyk	for a swank server you'd need lein
18:59	mmarczyk	lein is an option for a terminal repl too, of course
18:59	itistoday	mmarczyk: hmm... ok, this was actually on my list of things to install and use, i didn't know it was also a "standard way to get a repl"
18:59	TeXnomancy	kiras: interesting... no, it should work with dashes there.
18:59	mmarczyk	well, not really standard quite yet, I guess, but might become one
18:59	TeXnomancy	kiras: could you open an issue on the leiningen github page?
19:00	mmarczyk	kiras: oh, good catch then
19:00	kiras	heh glad i wasn't totally wrong
19:01	mmarczyk	the entry in the jar's manifest should be correct, afaict
19:01	kiras	texnomancy: i think i can do that
19:03	itistoday	mmarczyk: I have clojure installed in ~/.clojure/clojure/clojure.jar, how do I tell clj to use this clojure?
19:03	mmarczyk	itistoday: um, not sure, haven't really investigated clj yet... just skimmed the readme & code
19:03	mmarczyk	itistoday: the readme seems quite extensive
19:04	Raynes	mmarczyk: You can start swank servers with clj now.
19:04	mmarczyk	Raynes: oh cool, thanks for the heads up
19:04	Raynes	mmarczyk: That was actually added just a few hours ago, actually.
19:04	Raynes	actually :p
19:05	mmarczyk	that's actually good to know, anyway ;-)
19:08	mmarczyk	kiras: so you say that :main test_project.core works for you?
19:08	mmarczyk	kiras: it doesn't seem to work for me
19:08	mmarczyk	mind you, :main test-project.core doesn't either
19:11	kiras	mmarcyzk: yes, it works for me
19:11	kiras	strange... i really hope i'm not doing something stupid and overlooking it
19:13	itistoday	ok, so for now, until i figure out how to get clj to use a different clojure.jar file, is there any other popular clj script for simply running a repl?
19:13	itistoday	or do most people simply write their own?
19:14	qbg	I don't know about others, but I wrote my own
19:16	qbg	It isn't that hard to write a simple one
19:16	itistoday	qbg: it can be daunting if you haven't used java in several years :-p
19:17	qbg	Simple usage is java -cp <classpath> <java options> clojure.main
19:18	qbg	Where <classpath> contains clojure.jar, and any other goodies you like (like clojure-contrib)
19:20	itistoday	i think i'll just modify this: http://github.com/russolsen/dejour/blob/master/bin/clj
19:20	mmarczyk	itistoday: just a sec, I'll Gist my own
19:21	mmarczyk	itistoday: http://gist.github.com/454436
19:21	qbg	Python, eh?
19:21	mmarczyk	more palatable than bash :-)
19:22	itistoday	mmarczyk: thanks! I might write a newlisp version then :-D
19:22	itistoday	mmarczyk: (based on yours)
19:22	mmarczyk	itistoday: that would be cool :-)
19:23	itistoday	i guess writing a clj file is a sort of an initiation into clojure that n00bs must go through :-p
19:24	mmarczyk	kiras: actually I notice I've been doing sth remarkably silly all this time
19:24	kiras	is this ok for a title for the github issue or would something else be preferred? project-name + project.clj :main project-name.core + lein uberjar + java -jar standalone jar = java.land.NoClassDefFoundError
19:24	mmarczyk	kiras: having fixed that, java -jar ... works for me with uberjar-created jars
19:24	mmarczyk	kiras: um, I'd say something else would be preferred ;-)
19:24	kiras	sth == something?
19:25	mmarczyk	yup
19:25	qbg	mmarczyk: Now I have an urge to a clj script in Clojure
19:25	kiras	do you mean that this issue doesn't exist for you having fixed the sth silly you were doing?
19:25	mmarczyk	qbg: called ouroboros, presumably? ;-)
19:25	mmarczyk	kiras: apparently
19:25	mmarczyk	kiras: just one more thing to check to be sure
19:26	mmarczyk	kiras: because I might be masking it
19:26	kiras	mmarcyzk: ok, please let me know if you've solved it
19:26	mmarczyk	kiras: will do in a second
19:26	mmarczyk	kiras: yeah, seems to work for me
19:27	mmarczyk	kiras: could you make a Gist of your test-project (directory layout + project.clj + your main namespace)? maybe I'd spot sth
19:28	kiras	mmarczyk: sure, might take me a few minutes
19:29	mmarczyk	kiras: no problem, planning to hang around for a while yet
19:29	kiras	ok
19:35	kiras	mmarczyk: http://gist.github.com/454449 let me know if this isn't sufficient
19:36	mmarczyk	kiras: looking now
19:40	mmarczyk	kiras: ok, I replicated your layout, ran `lein deps` then `lein uberjar`
19:40	mmarczyk	kiras: and java -jar ...-standalone.jar works fine
19:40	kiras	mmarcyzk: hm... ok... let me try "lein deps" and "lein uberjar" again...
19:40	mmarczyk	java -jar slim-jar doesn't, because it doesn't have the Clojure runtime on the classpath
19:42	kiras	mmarczyk: i still can't get the standalone jar to run with java -jar ...-standalone.jar
19:43	mmarczyk	kiras: I should note that I'm using lein's HEAD... not sure what issues might be present in earlier versions
19:43	kiras	mmarczyk: ah... i think i'm still using 1.1.0
19:44	mmarczyk	kiras: could you try out the HEAD?
19:45	kiras	mmarczyk: sure, if you don't mind telling me how to. i only see 1.1.0 and 1.2.0-RCs 1 and 2 at http://github.com/technomancy/leiningen/downloads
19:45	mmarczyk	RC2 will do
19:45	kiras	ok
19:46	mmarczyk	it's behind by one commit, which is a bugfix, but unrelated to this
19:47	kiras	ok this will likely take me a bit to get setup, as i'm on windows... hopefully i won't need to reboot.
19:48	mmarczyk	TeXnomancy: the link in your announcement is to RC1 :-)
19:49	mmarczyk	kiras: oh, I think you should just get lein.bat
19:49	mmarczyk	for RC2
19:49	mmarczyk	and tell it to self-install
19:49	TeXnomancy	mmarczyk: noooo... not again. =(
19:49	kiras	ah, didn't realize the new lein.bat could self-install
19:49	TeXnomancy	actually... I don't think it can. =(
19:50	kiras	T_T
19:50	mmarczyk	oh :-(
19:50	mmarczyk	TeXnomancy: :-)
19:50	TeXnomancy	still waiting for someone to port that. not sure how well lein.bat will work with the release candidate; sorry.
19:50	mmarczyk	TeXnomancy: does the RC2 jar include the 'missing local' fix?
19:50	kiras	back to setting up environment variables by hand again, with the dialog with the textline that you can't expand :(
19:50	TeXnomancy	mmarczyk: it does
19:51	mmarczyk	oh, ok then
19:51	mmarczyk	kiras: actually I'd get the lein.bat
19:51	mmarczyk	kiras: try to run it on a project
19:51	mmarczyk	kiras: then hopefully it would complain about lein's jar missing at some path
19:51	TeXnomancy	for past releases, Rob Wolfe helped with getting the Windows side working... I should ask him if he could help for this one too.
19:51	kiras	mmarczyk: you mean without updating the jars?
19:51	mmarczyk	then you could put it there
19:51	kiras	ah
19:51	TeXnomancy	unless someone else volunteers, of course.
19:52	mmarczyk	if it doesn't complain, then presumably the old location will do
19:52	kiras	well, i was trying to keep it set up like, /leiningen/1.1.0 /leiningen/1.2.0
19:52	kiras	instead of just copying over stuff... maybe that's a bad idea though
19:53	mmarczyk	kiras: if the lein.bat from 1.1.0 doesn't mind that, the one from HEAD shouldn't either
19:54	kiras	mmarczyk: sorry, i don't understand what you mean by that... if the lein bat from 1.1.0 doesn't mind what?
19:54	mmarczyk	kiras: your current placement of the jar
19:55	mmarczyk	kiras: I guess I might not understand what kind of setup you have in mind, though... haven't tried all this on Windows
19:55	kiras	ah... i wouldn't expect it to, barring any changes, but i thought it would be a good idea to keep the various version of leiningen organized so that i could use different ones as needed
19:55	kiras	but i guess it doesn't really matter
19:55	mmarczyk	kiras: well, I do have lein-stable set up separately, using the latest release version
20:00	kiras	mmarczyk: ok, switched my environment variables, now running lein at all gives errors... think this happened the last time i tried this too, probably have to reboot.
20:01	mmarczyk	kiras: :-(
20:01	kiras	hehe
20:01	kiras	brb
20:17	kiras	mmarczyk: back
20:17	mmarczyk	kiras: better luck after the reboot?
20:18	kiras	lein is working now, my initial attempt at a successful uberjar run was unsuccessful though
20:18	kiras	maybe i should try with a new project
20:20	mmarczyk	kiras: nah, just do a lein clean
20:20	kiras	mmarczyk: ok
20:23	kiras	mmarczyk: lein builds the jars successfully, but i seem to be getting the same error at runtime
20:24	kiras	also, a clojure.lang.LispReader$ReaderException is thrown during the lein uberjar
20:24	mmarczyk	:-(
20:24	mmarczyk	and what does `lein version` say?
20:24	mmarczyk	just to be sure
20:24	kiras	Leiningen nil on Java 1.6.0_20 Java HotSpot(TM) Client VM
20:24	kiras	:P
20:25	mmarczyk	nil? whoa :-P
20:25	mmarczyk	it's 1.2.0-RC2 for me
20:25	kiras	yeah, that command has never seemed to work for me on windows
20:25	mmarczyk	oh well
20:25	kiras	heh
20:26	kiras	any ideas?
20:26	mmarczyk	ho-hum. thinking about it, but no ideas so far
20:26	kiras	heh
20:26	mmarczyk	:-/
20:27	mmarczyk	ah, the joys of cross-platform compatibility
20:28	kiras	write once...
20:28	mmarczyk	yeah.
20:29	mmarczyk	... crash in some of the places
20:29	mmarczyk	kiras: what's the exception message?
20:29	kiras	the lein uberjar one?
20:30	kiras	or the runtime one?
20:32	mmarczyk	both, I guess
20:33	kiras	mmarczyk: ok, i'll post them
20:33	mmarczyk	in this case, maybe include the stack traces too, just in case
20:34	kiras	ok, i thought that was what you wanted, actually
20:35	mmarczyk	ah, I meant just the exception message originally, if there is one... but the full stacktrace idea is better
20:36	kiras	ok
20:39	kiras	mmarczyk: http://gist.github.com/454496
20:40	mmarczyk	ohhhh........
20:40	kiras	ohhhh?
20:40	mmarczyk	starts to make sense
20:41	mmarczyk	does it only happen with uberjar
20:41	mmarczyk	or with, say, lein clean too?
20:42	kiras	lein clean is fine
20:42	mmarczyk	and lein jar, lein compile, lein deps?
20:42	mmarczyk	hm, every task really
20:42	kiras	let me try
20:43	kiras	lein jar looks like it's giving the same reader error as uberjar
20:43	mmarczyk	good :-)
20:43	kiras	heh
20:43	mmarczyk	could you have a look at the others?
20:44	mmarczyk	though I think I have an idea as to where the problem might be
20:44	mmarczyk	with some blank spaces remaining, though...
20:44	kiras	lein compile: reader error lein deps: java.io.IOException...
20:45	kiras	i could post that to the gist as well, if you like
20:45	mmarczyk	yes, please
20:47	kiras	mmarczyk: ok, updated it with the deps error... when you said "all of the tasks" did you literally mean all of them?
20:48	mmarczyk	well, I hate to ask, but... :-)
20:48	kiras	heh
20:50	mmarczyk	hm, the IOException is funny... an issue with permissions maybe? either NTFS permissions or JVM security settings, I mean
20:50	itistoday	phew, ok done with my newlisp clj script, i haven't fully tested it, but it seems to work :-)
20:50	itistoday	http://paste.pocoo.org/show/230451/
20:50	itistoday	based on: http://github.com/russolsen/dejour/blob/master/bin/clj
20:51	mmarczyk	itistoday: heh, cool :-)
20:51	kiras	mmarcyzk: i don't know, but i wonder if it's related to something that's been bothering me, which is that sometimes with emacs open, i'm unable to empty the /lib directory
20:51	kiras	maybe i should try it with emacs closed, although i've been using eshell most of the time
20:51	mmarczyk	kiras: well, it would be useful to try doing it in a context where you can clean the directory by hand
20:52	kiras	mmarczyk: right. ok, i'll close emacs then
20:55	kiras	mmarczyk: even when i can clean the directory by hand, i get the error message from lein deps if the lib directory isn't already empty
20:56	mmarczyk	hm, not good
20:56	mmarczyk	but this seems like a separate issue
20:56	mmarczyk	so let's try fixing the uberjar thing for now
20:56	kiras	probably
20:56	kiras	ok
20:56	kiras	still making my way down the task list
20:56	mmarczyk	thanks :-)
20:57	kiras	heh np
20:59	mmarczyk	btw, you're just using the no argument versions of the tasks, right?
20:59	mmarczyk	`lein jar`, `lein uberjar` etc.
20:59	kiras	mmarczyk: so far, yes
21:00	mmarczyk	ok, that should be enough
21:00	mmarczyk	just wanted to make sure
21:00	kiras	ok
21:00	Raynes	itistoday: You really shouldn't put closing parens on their own lines. Lisp isn't C++. :P
21:01	itistoday	Raynes: I've been told that many times, but I just can't justify not doing it... yet at least. maybe if more people yell at me, but I hate the "standard way"
21:02	itistoday	Raynes: to me, it's close to unreadable
21:02	Raynes	It just looks really ugly, and nobody who knows better does it. It feels okay for curly brackets, but parentheses don't serve the same purpose here.
21:02	Raynes	But in the end, it's your code.
21:02	Raynes	I'm just sayin'. :p
21:03	itistoday	Raynes: and I'm just sayin' that to me the standard way "looks really ugly" :-p
21:03	itistoday	i don't know why people do it
21:03	Raynes	Because your unstandard way is unreadable to us. :p
21:04	itistoday	Raynes: i've tried to do it the standard way, and i couldn't take it, i had to go back
21:04	kiras	mmarczyk: ok, think i'm done
21:05	kiras	let me know if i missed anything... after this i'm thinking of making a feature subtraction request ;)
21:05	mmarczyk	kiras: :-)
21:05	itistoday	people complain about lisp's "many parenthesis" and "parenthesis zoo", I think it's mostly because people stack up their parenthesis and don't use them to delimit scope
21:05	Raynes	New people complain. After a while, they like it.
21:06	Raynes	Or at least tolerate it with their editors.
21:06	Raynes	But I don't think putting closing parens on new lines helps that.
21:06	itistoday	well I'm going to try to start a counter-movement :-D
21:06	itistoday	because i think it does :-)
21:06	Raynes	Besides that, parens aren't just for delimiting scope.
21:06	itistoday	you'll thank me later ;-)
21:06	Raynes	Good luck with that.
21:20	mmarczyk	kiras: so, if I understand correctly, there are .jar files being created by lein jar & Co.
21:21	mmarczyk	kiras: right? if so, could you open one of them up in an archive manager of some sort?
21:21	kiras	mmarczyk: yes, the jars are being built
21:21	mmarczyk	I'm wondering if they actually contain everything that they should
21:22	mmarczyk	namely the .class files
21:22	kiras	mmarczyk: let me try extracting them
21:22	mmarczyk	ok
21:23	kiras	hm...
21:23	kiras	ok, so what .class files am i looking for?
21:24	kiras	mmarczyk: when i extract the non-standalone jar, i have a META-INF folder, a test_project folder and a project.clj folder at the root
21:24	mmarczyk	well, I guess the top level of the jar includes a test_project directory
21:24	mmarczyk	yeah
21:25	mmarczyk	and inside test_project ?
21:25	kiras	the standalone is the same with the addition of a clojure directory
21:25	kiras	core.clj
21:25	mmarczyk	just this file?
21:25	kiras	yeah
21:25	mmarczyk	ok
21:25	kiras	the classes must be in another castle
21:25	mmarczyk	one more experiment then:
21:26	mmarczyk	apparently :-)
21:26	mmarczyk	I'm not sure how one launches JVMs on Windows
21:26	mmarczyk	so correct any obvious mistakes
21:26	kiras	well
21:26	mmarczyk	but I wonder about something like
21:26	kiras	i'm new to java
21:27	kiras	so i may not be able to correct you
21:27	mmarczyk	java.exe -cp "clojure.jar;clojure-contrib.jar" clojure.main
21:27	mmarczyk	note the semicolon; I'm not sure this is the correct char, it ought to be the same one Windows uses for separating $PATH entries
21:27	Raynes	semi-colon is right
21:28	kiras	then it would be a semi colon
21:28	mmarczyk	ok then, this should be fine
21:28	kiras	and i remember using a similar command when i first started playing with clojure
21:28	clojurebot	clojurebot is like life: you make trade-offs
21:28	mmarczyk	clojurebot: um, I'll remember that, thanks
21:28	clojurebot	Pardon?
21:29	mmarczyk	ah, wait, I screwed up
21:29	mmarczyk	I meant to include more stuff on the classpath
21:29	kiras	ok
21:29	mmarczyk	namely the src/ and classes/ directories under the project dir
21:30	mmarczyk	with that addition, I'm curious about what happens when you evaluate (compile 'test-project.core)
21:31	kiras	mmarczyk: something like this: java -cp "clojure.jar;clojure-contrib.jar;src;classes" clojure.main in the project's root directory?
21:31	mmarczyk	kiras: right
21:32	kiras	how many lines can i paste here?
21:32	mmarczyk	not sure, but do you get an exception of some sort?
21:32	kiras	yes
21:32	mmarczyk	hah
21:32	mmarczyk	involving the LispReader?
21:32	kiras	no
21:32	kiras	heh
21:32	mmarczyk	:-P
21:33	kiras	Exception in thread "main" java.lang.NoClassDefFoundError: clojure/main
21:33	kiras	Caused by: java.lang.ClassNotFoundException: clojure.main
21:33	mmarczyk	oh.
21:33	kiras	Caused by: java.lang.ClassNotFoundException: clojure.main
21:33	kiras	oops
21:33	kiras	more follows
21:33	mmarczyk	hmmm, try java.exe -classpath maybe
21:35	mmarczyk	instead of -cp, I mean
21:35	kiras	same thing
21:35	mmarczyk	actually
21:35	mmarczyk	I'd expect you to need to use lib/clojure.jar
21:35	kiras	which jar is it supposed to be using?
21:35	kiras	yeah
21:35	kiras	i was wondering hehe
21:36	kiras	windows terminal is so bad
21:39	mmarczyk	yup, one of the major annoyances
21:39	kiras	mmarczyk: java -cp "lib\clojure-1.2.0-master-2010623.220259-87.jar;lib\clojure-contrib-1.2.0-20100615.150419-128.jar;src;classes" clojure.main
21:39	kiras	no luck
21:40	mmarczyk	-cp -> -classpath
21:40	mmarczyk	?
21:40	kiras	oh, right
21:40	kiras	same result
21:40	mmarczyk	how about java -jar lib\clojure.jar ?
21:41	kiras	just that?
21:41	mmarczyk	yeah
21:41	kiras	i get a repl
21:41	mmarczyk	right, well then that error makes no sense :-/
21:41	kiras	hm
21:42	kiras	oh...
21:42	mmarczyk	ok, maybe try
21:42	kiras	i made a typo, i think
21:42	kiras	let me try again
21:42	mmarczyk	whew :-)
21:42	kiras	heh
21:42	kiras	ok
21:42	kiras	now it works
21:42	mmarczyk	:-)
21:42	mmarczyk	so now, (compile 'test-project.core)
21:43	kiras	-cp and -classpath both work
21:43	kiras	ok
21:44	kiras	test-project.core is returned
21:44	mmarczyk	hm
21:44	mmarczyk	any .class files in classes/ ?
21:44	kiras	let me see
21:45	kiras	yes
21:45	kiras	ls classes/test_project/
21:45	kiras	core$_main.class core$loading__4403__auto__.class core.class core__init.class
21:45	mmarczyk	huh. in this case, try a lein uberjar again
21:45	kiras	ok
21:46	kiras	same reader error
21:46	mmarczyk	right, but it might include those .class files in the jar, in which case it would be interesting to see whether java -jar can run it
21:46	kiras	no luck
21:47	mmarczyk	ahhhh, actually, that was nonsense
21:47	mmarczyk	uberjar currently does a `lein clean` first
21:47	kiras	ah, right
21:47	mmarczyk	so hopefully classes/ is now empty :-)
21:47	kiras	heh
21:48	kiras	it is :)
21:49	kiras	so
21:49	kiras	if i do lein jar
21:49	kiras	after the compile from the repl
21:49	kiras	and lein jar doesn't do a clean
21:50	kiras	should i be able to run the program if i give the proper classpath to java?
21:50	kiras	and would that even do anything for us at all?
21:51	mmarczyk	I suppose it would be interesting to try
21:51	mmarczyk	although
21:51	mmarczyk	you'd have to run it as java -cp ...
21:51	kiras	right
21:51	mmarczyk	naming your :main class at the end
21:51	kiras	ah
21:52	kiras	like this: java -cp "lib\clojure-1.2.0-master-20100623.220259-87.jar;lib\clojure-contrib-1.2.0-20100615.150419-128.jar;src;classes" test-project.core ?
21:52	mmarczyk	yeah, I think java -jar doesn't take extra classpath args
21:52	mmarczyk	kiras: `um, wait, not quite
21:52	kiras	ah
21:52	mmarczyk	test_project.core
21:53	mmarczyk	also
21:53	kiras	we're back to that then, are we? :P
21:53	mmarczyk	skip src and classes
21:53	kiras	ok
21:53	mmarczyk	well, not really
21:53	mmarczyk	the generated class must use _
21:53	mmarczyk	though you should never need to care
21:53	kiras	ok
21:53	mmarczyk	except you need to name your files / folders appropriately
21:53	mmarczyk	so it's not all that transparent
21:53	mmarczyk	ah well
21:53	kiras	heh
21:55	kiras	mmarczyk: java -cp "lib\clojure-1.2.0-master-20100623.220259-87.jar;lib\clojure-contrib-1.2.0-20100615.150419-128.jar" test_project.core ?
21:55	mmarczyk	right
21:55	kiras	it didn't work
21:55	kiras	:(
21:56	mmarczyk	ah wait
21:56	mmarczyk	your jar too
21:56	kiras	oh... in the classpath?
21:56	mmarczyk	yes
21:56	kiras	ok
21:56	mmarczyk	that's were your class should be
21:56	mmarczyk	hopefully :-)
21:56	kiras	heh
21:58	kiras	mmarczyk: java -cp "lib\clojure-1.2.0-master-20100623.220259-87.jar;lib\clojure-contrib-1.2.0-20100615.150419-128.jar;test-project-1.0.0-SNAPSHOT-standalone.jar" test_project.core didn't work either
21:58	mmarczyk	wrong jar
21:58	kiras	ohhh
21:59	kiras	right
21:59	kiras	thanks
21:59	kiras	lol
21:59	mmarczyk	:-)
21:59	kiras	that works
21:59	mmarczyk	woohoo!
21:59	kiras	hehe
21:59	kiras	so, does that help us at all?
22:01	kiras	it seems like the problem is that the classes aren't being compiled, but this doesn't really help determine why that's the case, right?
22:01	itistoday	when I run M-x slime it says "it looks like Clojure is not installed, install now?" how can i tell it where my clj file is?
22:01	mmarczyk	kiras: well, it's good to know where to search for the problem
22:01	kiras	mmarczyk: true
22:10	kiras	mmarczyk: it seems like the reader error is happening when it hits either the d or the : in some path or another, right? is it possible that lein.bat is sending the wrong string somewhere?
22:11	mmarczyk	yeah
22:12	mmarczyk	seems like lein.bat or leiningen.compile/eval-in-project issue
22:13	mmarczyk	well, leiningen.compile... the exact function is just a guess
22:13	kiras	ah
22:14	kiras	so either it's bad input to a function in leiningen.compile from lein.bat or some function in leiningen.compile isn't handling valid input correctly?
22:14	mmarczyk	seems so to me
22:15	mmarczyk	actually it would be possible to check this
22:15	mmarczyk	sth like
22:15	kiras	i'm diffing the 1.1.0 bat against the 1.2.0 one
22:15	kiras	maybe something obvious will show up
22:16	mmarczyk	java -cp "clojure.jar;clojure-contrib.jar;leiningen.jar;src;classes" leiningen.core uberjar
22:16	mmarczyk	with proper paths to the jars, of course
22:16	mmarczyk	all this in the project directory, I mean
22:17	kiras	in the test-project directory or the leiningen project directory?
22:17	kiras	oh
22:17	kiras	nm
22:17	kiras	i could try that
22:17	mmarczyk	it should either work just fine or throw a tantrum like lein uberjar does
22:18	kiras	heh
22:18	mmarczyk	...fully expecting to be surprised with a third outcome
22:19	kiras	lol
22:20	itistoday	could someone walk me through how to run ants.clj using lein?
22:20	mmarczyk	itistoday: ants.clj predates lein quite significantly
22:20	itistoday	mmarczyk: is not possible?
22:20	itistoday	i mean, i'm sure it is
22:21	mmarczyk	itistoday: use your Clojure launcher script: clj ants.clj
22:21	itistoday	i copied the source into src/core.clj
22:21	itistoday	mmarczyk: i'm trying to learn how to use lein
22:21	itistoday	(and swank-clojure)
22:21	mmarczyk	Leiningen doesn't include a `lein run` task by default
22:22	mmarczyk	if you just mean to run a repl from which you'll be able to call functions from ants.clj
22:22	mmarczyk	lein repl should do that for you
22:22	mmarczyk	or lein swank, for a SLIME repl
22:22	itistoday	it doesn't work
22:22	itistoday	That's not a task. Use "lein help" to list all tasks
22:22	mmarczyk	what doesn't work?
22:23	itistoday	(for: lein swank)
22:23	itistoday	and lein help doesn't show swank as a command
22:23	mmarczyk	ah, well, you'll need to include swank-clojure in :dev-dependencies for your project
22:23	itistoday	i thought it did:
22:24	mmarczyk	latest version is 1.3.0-SNAPSHOT, latest stable release -- 1.2.0, I think
22:24	itistoday	http://paste.pocoo.org/show/230481/
22:24	kiras	mmarczyk: does java -cp "lib\clojure-1.2.0-master-20100623.220259-87.jar;lib\clojure-contrib-1.2.0-20100615.150419-128.jar;d:/xPrograms/leiningen/1.2.0/leiningen-1.2.0-RC2-standalone.jar;src;classes" leiningen.core uberjar look ok?
22:24	mmarczyk	kiras: xPrograms ?
22:24	kiras	just a folder
22:25	itistoday	mmarczyk: http://paste.pocoo.org/show/230481/
22:25	mmarczyk	kiras: yeah, wanted to make sure the 'x' wasn't a typo
22:25	mmarczyk	otherwise it seems fine
22:25	mmarczyk	aaaahhhh
22:25	mmarczyk	no
22:25	mmarczyk	wait wait
22:25	kiras	heh
22:25	mmarczyk	if you're going to use -standalone.jar
22:25	kiras	i was wondering about that
22:25	mmarczyk	skip the clojure and contrib jars
22:25	kiras	ok
22:26	mmarczyk	itistoday: already looked at it
22:26	kiras	well, you wanted a third outcome ;)
22:26	mmarczyk	itistoday: I'm not sure if this will help, but
22:26	mmarczyk	kiras: can't wait :-P
22:26	kiras	heh
22:26	mmarczyk	itistoday: you could try moving swank-clojure to :dev-dependencies
22:27	mmarczyk	itistoday: I'm not sure if the regular dependencies are considered when lein looks for plugins
22:27	itistoday	still get this: "That's not a task. Use "lein help" to list all tasks."
22:28	mmarczyk	itistoday: what OS?
22:28	itistoday	10.6.4
22:28	itistoday	i'm cursing in my head
22:28	kiras	mmarczyk: http://gist.github.com/454565
22:29	itistoday	mmarczyk: i appreciate you trying to help me though
22:29	mmarczyk	itistoday: np, trying to come up with a guess as to what it's about
22:29	itistoday	i'm using the latest git stuff for lein
22:29	mmarczyk	kiras: ah, yeah, I got the class wrong
22:29	itistoday	i looked at the shell command (lein) and it really doesn't even have the word swank in it
22:29	itistoday	wtf
22:30	kiras	i think moving swank-clojure to :dev-dependencies would work, if you haven't tried that yet
22:30	itistoday	kiras: i did try it
22:30	itistoday	same result
22:30	kiras	i see
22:30	itistoday	unless i did it wrong: http://paste.pocoo.org/show/230482/
22:30	kiras	no, that looks right to me
22:31	mmarczyk	kiras: try java -cp "..." clojure.main -e "(use 'leiningen.core) (-main)"
22:31	kiras	did you do lein deps afterwards?
22:31	kiras	mmarczyk: ok, where "..." is the previous classpath?
22:31	mmarczyk	right
22:32	itistoday	'lein deps' gives me a bunch of errors: http://paste.pocoo.org/show/230483/
22:33	mmarczyk	itistoday: ah, wrong version strings
22:33	mmarczyk	use "1.2.0-master-SNAPSHOT" for Clojure
22:33	mmarczyk	"1.2.0-SNAPSHOT" for contrib
22:34	itistoday	mmarczyk: you're my hero!! :-*
22:34	itistoday	:-P
22:35	mmarczyk	:-)
22:35	itistoday	i had tried changing both to 1.2.0-SNAPSHOT, but that failed
22:35	itistoday	i didn't think to try that...
22:35	itistoday	(having one be 1.2.0-SNAPSHOT, the other for some reason different)
22:35	mmarczyk	that's a carefully installed trip-up device
22:37	itistoday	ok yay, so lein swank has launched a server
22:37	kiras	mmarczyk: java -cp "d:/xPrograms/leiningen/1.2.0/leiningen-1.2.0-RC2-standalone.jar;src;classes" clojure.main -e "(use 'leiningen.core) (-main)" brings up the lein help list
22:37	itistoday	now to try to connect to it
22:37	mmarczyk	kiras: add uberjar to the end
22:37	mmarczyk	kiras: actually I'm wondering why the version using leiningen.core-the-class directly didn't work... I'll save that for later though
22:38	mmarczyk	itistoday: slime-connect
22:38	itistoday	ok, getting an odd prompt: Versions differ: nil (slime) vs. 20100404 (swank). Continue? (y or n)
22:39	itistoday	is that normal?
22:39	mmarczyk	itistoday: it is
22:39	kiras	mmarczyk: well... with uberjar it prints the help list again, then i get FileNotFoundException: uberjar
22:40	kiras	mmarczyk: do i need to pass a full path to the uberjar file as well?
22:40	mmarczyk	kiras: hm, didn't think so
22:40	mmarczyk	kiras: java -cp "..." clojure.main -e "..." uberjar
22:40	mmarczyk	kiras: right?
22:41	itistoday	holy crap... i have a window...
22:41	kiras	mmarczyk: java -cp "d:/xPrograms/leiningen/1.2.0/leiningen-1.2.0-RC2-standalone.jar;src;classes" clojure.main -e "(use 'leiningen.core) (-main)" uberjar
22:41	mmarczyk	kiras: right... hmm
22:42	itistoday	HOORAYYYY! ANTS AH-HOY!
22:42	itistoday	look at the litter fuckers go
22:42	itistoday	*little
22:42	itistoday	got a little too excited there
22:42	mmarczyk	itistoday: happy for you ;-)
22:43	itistoday	mmarczyk: thanks for all your help!! http://cl.ly/baa49f2b89912ffa9a56
22:43	mmarczyk	well, it was the lein deps suggestion which provided the breakthrough :-)
22:43	itistoday	i'm surprised that after that everything went pretty smoothly
22:44	itistoday	this ancient clojure file just worked
22:44	mmarczyk	kiras: I really don't get it, let me dive into lein.bat to see what's its bright idea for how to call into lein
22:44	kiras	mmarczyk: ok
22:44	mmarczyk	itistoday: no gratuitous breakage in Clojure-land :-)
22:44	mmarczyk	one of the great parts of the experience
22:45	itistoday	so, one more question, what about auto-completion in emacs?
22:45	itistoday	is slime needed for that?
22:46	mmarczyk	kiras: ok, so try "(use 'leiningen.core) (-main \"uberjar\")"
22:46	mmarczyk	itistoday: depends on the kind of autocompletion you have in mind
22:46	mmarczyk	M-/ will autocomplete as it usually does
22:46	itistoday	mmarczyk: the fancy-kind. :-) where it's based on knowledge of dependencies and function params, etc
22:47	mmarczyk	or if you use it for hippy-expand, it'll do the usual thing
22:47	mmarczyk	well yeah, dynamic knowledge about the project is provided by swank
22:47	itistoday	mmarczyk: so i need to run 'lein swank' and then connect via slime-connect?
22:47	kiras	mmarczyk: yes, that works, but gives the same reader exception as just doing "lein uberjar"
22:48	kiras	so it looks like lein.bat may not be at fault?
22:48	mmarczyk	itistoday: I thought you just did that and it worked?
22:48	itistoday	mmarczyk: yeah i did, i mean in the future, and in general, for autocompletion
22:48	mmarczyk	kiras: agreed
22:49	mmarczyk	itistoday: that's one good way of doing things
22:49	kiras	mmarczyk: also, classes is still empty, java -jar standalone.jar doesn't work, etc.... so it looks like it's exactly the same as lein uberjar
22:49	mmarczyk	itistoday: personally, I use M-x slime for standalone "experimental" repls
22:49	kiras	which seems kind of weird
22:50	itistoday	mmarczyk: i can't do that though, remember the error?
22:50	mmarczyk	itistoday: and a custom clojure-project function when working with a project
22:50	itistoday	mmarczyk: here, i'll get it again
22:50	mmarczyk	itistoday: well, I've got a totally custom slime setup
22:50	itistoday	mmarczyk: "It looks like Clojure is not installed. Install now?"
22:50	mmarczyk	itistoday: don't know much about the elpa setup
22:50	itistoday	mmarczyk: i'm trying to avoid that and just go by the books to avoid breaking anything
22:51	mmarczyk	kiras: right :-(
22:51	itistoday	the whole thing seems very fragile to me
22:51	mmarczyk	itistoday: oh? why would that be?
22:51	mmarczyk	itistoday: underdocumented perhaps, if it doesn't come with a clear explanation of how to override various defaults
22:52	itistoday	mmarczyk: well, i've got so many clojures installed now
22:52	itistoday	(jars)
22:52	mmarczyk	itistoday: which I wouldn't know anything about, because I haven't even got package.el installed
22:52	itistoday	i just want to have package.el take care of everything
22:52	itistoday	and to not introduce conflicts by modifying it directly myself
22:52	kiras	mmarczyk: well, i think i need to take a break from this. any ideas on where i should go from here?
22:52	mmarczyk	itistoday: I meant a clearly documented way to tell elpa's slime / swank-clojure to "use this jar"
22:52	tomoj	so install clojure-mode and slime-repl from elpa, and you should be good
22:53	mmarczyk	kiras: yeah, well... actually I'm becoming extremely sleepy myself
22:53	kiras	mmarczyk: same hehe thanks for all your help
22:53	mmarczyk	kiras: I'll be looking into leiningen.compile, maybe I'll figure something out
22:53	tomoj	itistoday: you still have problems after installing those?
22:54	mmarczyk	kiras: np :-)
22:54	kiras	mmarczyk: ok, how will i know if you find a solution? should i just hang out here? lol
22:54	itistoday	tomoj: sorry, can you remind me what you're referring to? i was having problems, but mmarczyk helped me out to get ants.clj working with lein/swank/slime. now i'm trying to get M-x slime to use my existing clojure.jar
22:55	tomoj	oh
22:55	mmarczyk	kiras: I'd say make an issue on GitHub, with basic information about the problem -- maybe a link to your Gist (I think it misses info on lein jar, so maybe you could add it); indicate that it might be Windows specific (I can't reproduce it on Linux, plus there's the d: thing)
22:56	mmarczyk	kiras: you could also provide a link to
22:56	tomoj	M-x slime will just use whatever is in ~/.swank-clojure
22:56	mmarczyk	kiras: http://clojure-log.n01se.net/
22:56	mmarczyk	kiras: I mean to one of the date-and-time anchors within this conversation
22:57	mmarczyk	if you want to be extra thorough :-P
22:57	mmarczyk	but then again, maybe a mention that it's likely related to leiningen.compile would be better
22:57	kiras	ah, you mean just place a link in the gist?
22:58	kiras	thats kind of cool
22:58	kiras	that's
22:58	mmarczyk	kiras: a link in the issue text, to the gist
22:58	kiras	mmarczyk: i meant about the clojure-log site
22:58	kiras	but i think i follow you
22:59	kiras	i'll probably post the issue tomorrow, kind of tired right now
22:59	mmarczyk	kiras: ah, yeah; you'd need to use a .../date/2010-06-26.html link, though
22:59	kiras	ok
22:59	mmarczyk	kiras: sure; also, of course you should hang around here! :-)
23:00	kiras	mmarczyk: hehe ok, i'll be around
23:00	kiras	thanks again for all your help
23:00	mmarczyk	anyway. my `sleep` task is long overdue
23:00	kiras	heh
23:00	kiras	night
23:00	mmarczyk	will look into this again in my next waking period
23:01	kiras	ok
23:01	mmarczyk	good night :-)
23:01	kiras	night
23:05	itistoday	tomoj: thanks!
23:05	itistoday	thanks to you I got M-x slime working too! :-D
23:06	itistoday	i created symlinks in ~/.swank-clojure to point to clojure.jar and swank-clojure.jar
23:06	itistoday	and that did the trick
23:07	tomoj	got paredit?
23:07	itistoday	tomoj: i do ... but i'm modified it a bit
23:07	itistoday	it's no longer really paredit
23:07	itistoday	i've sortof butchered it so that it behaves like TextMate
23:08	tomoj	I don't remember.. how does textmate behave?
23:08	itistoday	a lot more intuitively :-P
23:08	itistoday	you type " and it creates "" and puts the cursor in between them
23:08	itistoday	it does the same for { ( [, etc
23:09	tomoj	that sounds exactly like paredit
23:09	itistoday	well, not really
23:09	itistoday	paredit is really funky
23:09	itistoday	you can't, for example, delete them like normal
23:09	tomoj	oh, right
23:09	tomoj	that's a good thing, though :P
23:09	itistoday	you have to press some crazy key combination
23:09	itistoday	why is that a good thing?
23:10	tomoj	because manually balancing parens is a waste of time
23:10	itistoday	TextMate will delete both quotation marks if you press delete within an empty pair
23:10	tomoj	paredit does the same
23:10	itistoday	so you don't end up manually balancing very much
23:10	itistoday	also, I frequently will wrap a function in a function
23:10	itistoday	so I'll have some code like this: (((blah asdf ... etc
23:10	itistoday	and i want to wrap that in another function
23:11	tomoj	but I just wanted to make sure you weren't going to go off clojure+slimeing without knowing about paredit, long as you do, cool
23:11	itistoday	in text mate, I just put an extra parenthesis in front of it
23:11	ober	would kill for repl on this portable :P
23:11	tomoj	it will add the closing paren automatically?
23:11	itistoday	tomoj: no, I C-e to the end and manually balance it
23:12	tomoj	right :)
23:12	itistoday	but in paredit, it puts this: () (((blah asdf ... etc
23:12	tomoj	in paredit you put point in front of the (((blah.. and hit M-(
23:12	itistoday	that's not very helpful at all
23:12	itistoday	oh
23:12	tomoj	it is unintuitive, yeah
23:12	tomoj	but imo very worth getting used to
23:12	itistoday	well i might have to give it a chance...
23:13	tomoj	if you ever do, be sure to get the beta, version 22
23:13	itistoday	tomoj: is that in elpa?
23:13	tomoj	nope :(
23:13	itistoday	why should i get the beta?
23:13	tomoj	it works better with clojure
23:13	tomoj	clojure-mode will detect that you're using version 22 and fix {}
23:13	itistoday	tomoj: ok i'll give it a try
23:14	itistoday	where can i get it from? is there a github repo?
23:14	tomoj	http://mumble.net/~campbell/emacs/paredit-beta.el
23:14	itistoday	yeah i just found that :-)
23:14	itistoday	hmm...
23:15	itistoday	they should put it on github or some site like that
23:15	itistoday	so that you can just update it...
23:15	tomoj	then https://gist.github.com/038be3e78e8fa58d2733 works for me
23:16	itistoday	tomoj: thanks!
23:17	itistoday	what do you do in the slime repl?
23:17	tomoj	http://mumble.net/~campbell/emacs/paredit-beta.html
23:17	tomoj	I don't use paredit in the repl
23:17	itistoday	well, i mean in general
23:17	tomoj	I think it causes some problems, but there is some way to resolve the problems, but I just haven't bothered yet
23:18	itistoday	i just tried running some source code in it from the ants.clj file: (dorun (map #(send-off % behave) ants))
23:18	itistoday	and it gave me an exception, despite the file being loaded
23:18	itistoday	so... i'm not sure what it's for
23:18	tomoj	what was the exception?
23:19	tomoj	probably it still says "user>" ?
23:19	itistoday	http://gist.github.com/454599
23:19	itistoday	tomoj: yes
23:19	tomoj	oh, well, that's fine because ants.clj doesn't declare a namespace, hmm
23:19	itistoday	well, actually, it does
23:19	itistoday	i modified it to do that
23:19	itistoday	so that it would work with the lein project
23:20	itistoday	how do i switch to ants.core?
23:20	tomoj	oh, then you need to switch into that namespace
23:20	tomoj	type ",i" at the repl
23:20	tomoj	then you can type a package name (with tab-completion)
23:20	itistoday	oh, cool
23:20	itistoday	yay!
23:20	itistoday	that works :-)
23:20	itistoday	ok, now i see that it does indeed do what i expected it to
23:21	tomoj	that's always nice
23:21	itistoday	is there a way to get a list of the defined functions in a clj file? perhaps have it in speedbar?
23:22	itistoday	so that i can quickly jump to a function by clicking on it
23:22	tomoj	not sure if something is there already for that
23:22	tomoj	should be possible with some elisp though
23:23	tomoj	you can already jump to a function definition by hitting M-., but that's a bit different
23:24	tomoj	(e.g. type "map" in the repl and hit M-. :D)
23:24	tomoj	still amazes me that it reaches into jars
23:24	itistoday	thanks for that tip! yeah i just noticed that too, and it has autocompletion
23:27	itistoday	do you happen to know in advance whether i need to rename paredit-beta.el to paredit.el?
23:27	itistoday	tomoj: (err.. forgot to include your name)
23:27	tomoj	I did, not sure if it's necessary
23:27	tomoj	probably a good idea
23:27	itistoday	mmk
23:35	itistoday	yup, turned out to be necessary :-p
23:47	itistoday	tomoj: i don't like how paredit changes the behavior of the backspace key
23:47	itistoday	anyway to make it not do that?
23:47	itistoday	now whenever i highlight something and press backspace, it doesn't delete it
23:48	tomoj	dunno, sorry
23:48	tomoj	I'd use C-w
23:48	tomoj	but be careful with that, it can unbalance your parens
23:48	itistoday	tomoj: i don't think that's dangerous at all
23:49	itistoday	i'm used to normal text editors not adding parenthesis like paredit does
23:49	itistoday	and most of them have paren-highlighting
23:50	tomoj	better (imo) to use delete commands that know about sexps
23:50	itistoday	i disagree, but to each his own
23:50	tomoj	except for a whole bunch of toplevel forms or something
23:50	itistoday	how the heck do you delete a parenthesis?
23:50	tomoj	if you must, C-u DEL
23:51	itistoday	ok, thanks, yeah, i'm going to edit this thing so that it always does that
23:51	tomoj	the idea with paredit is that you should never have to
23:51	itistoday	tomoj: well, i just ran across a scenario where i needed in the first minute of using it
23:51	itistoday	*needed it
23:52	itistoday	i'm not going to force my brain to adapt to this thing also because i don't want to become dependent on it
23:52	itistoday	no other editor behaves this way
23:52	polypus	itistoday: i think i've used C-u DEL once in aabout a week of heavy coding so it's rarely needed.
23:52	tomoj	never considered that
23:52	Raynes	If you aren't going to learn to use paredit properly and use it's commands, why bother with it?
23:52	tomoj	it's rarely needed IF you do things the paredit way
23:52	itistoday	polypus: like i said, i just needed in the first minute of using it
23:52	tomoj	if you go around C-w'ing or things like that, sure, you'll need it
23:53	polypus	just cuz you're not used to it that's all
23:53	itistoday	polypus: i don't think so, i copy/pasted some text, and it added an extra paren
23:53	itistoday	i needed to get rid of it
23:53	itistoday	happens all the time
23:53	tomoj	you're right, though, I don't think I could stand using another editor for clojure
23:53	tomoj	but that's fine with me :)
23:54	itistoday	Raynes: i want it for its creation of matching pairs
23:54	polypus	itistoday: it shouldn't happen all the time. you must not be copy pasting corectly
23:54	itistoday	Raynes: that's it though
23:54	itistoday	polypus: uh huh...
23:54	itistoday	polypus: whatever you say
23:54	polypus	ok
23:55	tomoj	itistoday: maybe autopair.el or something like it is more suitable for you
23:55	itistoday	tomoj: thanks!!!
23:55	itistoday	autopair
23:55	itistoday	Automagically pair braces and quotes like TextMate
23:55	itistoday	someone understands me :-D
23:56	tomoj	paredit needs testimonials
23:57	polypus	tomoj: yeah seriously. after a few days of using it there just isn't any going back
23:57	itistoday	that's what scares me
23:58	itistoday	i like being comfortable with Xcode, TextMate, and millions of other editors
23:58	polypus	itistoday, don't be scared it's very powerful, and emacs isn't going anywhere
23:58	itistoday	polypus: one step at a time, i just finished setting up clojure today
23:58	itistoday	maybe you lunatics will convince me in the end, but not today
23:58	tomoj	:)
23:58	polypus	;)
23:59	itistoday	:-p